Harbinger #17 Discussion

[somewhatlazy]

DId anyone else pick up all the variant covers of this issue? I love the 8 bit Harbinger Kart, and the Sean Chen signature series cover is such an excellent, tight drawing too... I think he would be another great classic Valiant artist that should be getting some more work with VEI.

ditto

There's so many great VH1 talents out there just waiting to return to the medium. It would be a big mistake not get guys like Sean Chen, BWS and Bob Hall back in the mix

I think a Barry Windsor the Smith cover for the 25th issue of the flagship title would be totally appropriate.

Just sayin.'

[Phoenix8008]

LOVED this issue!

Seeing what really happened at the end of Harbinger Wars was spectacular. Also glimpsing the chink in Harada's armor was interesting. With Unity coming up, he's obviously not going to have time to rest anytime soon. I wonder how long it will be until we see him unleash his Mind Squall in public and get villified?

Anamalia ROCKS! Samurai Sue is just a nasty piece of work. I take back what I said about her and Torque having the same powers. Related, perhaps, but she can generate multiple seperate hardshell projections with their own personalities while she's unconscious! This girl takes the cake and may be more dangerous than any of the Renegades except for Peter! Oh the potential, and a needed dose of humor to boot.

Thank goodness there's only 2 weeks to wait till the next issue!

[kjjohanson]

LOVED this issue!

Seeing what really happened at the end of Harbinger Wars was spectacular. Also glimpsing the chink in Harada's armor was interesting. With Unity coming up, he's obviously not going to have time to rest anytime soon. I wonder how long it will be until we see him unleash his Mind Squall in public and get villified?

Anamalia ROCKS! Samurai Sue is just a nasty piece of work. I take back what I said about her and Torque having the same powers. Related, perhaps, but she can generate multiple seperate hardshell projections with their own personalities while she's unconscious! This girl takes the cake and may be more dangerous than any of the Renegades except for Peter! Oh the potential, and a needed dose of humor to boot.

Thank goodness there's only 2 weeks to wait till the next issue!

The question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell apart from his body as well.

[lorddunlow]

The question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell apart from his body as well.

He can. His hat is proof.

[BugsySig]

The question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell apart from his body as well.

He can. His hat is proof.

Smartest thing you've ever said.

[kjjohanson]

The question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell apart from his body as well.

He can. His hat is proof.

Perhaps I should clarify: the question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell that doesn't encase his body.

[Phoenix8008]

The question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell apart from his body as well.

He can. His hat is proof.

Well played, sir. Well played.

[BugsySig]

The question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell apart from his body as well.

He can. His hat is proof.

Perhaps I should clarify: the question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell that doesn't encase his body.

His hat fell off (in issue 9 or 10...I think it was 10) when he fell out of the PRS chopper. So the hat existed independent of the rest of his "body".

[lorddunlow]

The question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell apart from his body as well.

He can. His hat is proof.

Perhaps I should clarify: the question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell that doesn't encase his body.

His hat fell off (in issue 9 or 10...I think it was 10) when he fell out of the PRS chopper. So the hat existed independent of the rest of his "body".

That is indeed what I was referencing. I couldn't remember the issue - I was waiting to confirm before I posted my response.

[BugsySig]

The question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell apart from his body as well.

He can. His hat is proof.

Perhaps I should clarify: the question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell that doesn't encase his body.

His hat fell off (in issue 9 or 10...I think it was 10) when he fell out of the PRS chopper. So the hat existed independent of the rest of his "body".

That is indeed what I was referencing. I couldn't remember the issue - I was waiting to confirm before I posted my response.

Just imagine if he were to go all Torquehalla the way Animalia is producing hard-shell projections... Monsters and battle axes and half-naked she-wenches everywhere!

[Baramos]

Torque can, he simply has a mental block preventing him from making the hard-shell projections be anything other than the "persona" he's created.

This reminds me of another topic where someone was asking if the HARD Corps. power set "Muscle" was different from "Hard-Shell Projection" and I think undoubtedly they are different. One is creating a hard-shell projection, one is actually increasing the physical muscular power of the person themselves.

[Phoenix8008]

The question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell apart from his body as well.

He can. His hat is proof.

Perhaps I should clarify: the question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell that doesn't encase his body.

His hat fell off (in issue 9 or 10...I think it was 10) when he fell out of the PRS chopper. So the hat existed independent of the rest of his "body".

That is indeed what I was referencing. I couldn't remember the issue - I was waiting to confirm before I posted my response.

Wait, wait, wait. Faith took the big box/bag of Harbinger school uniforms, right? He had his hardshell projection dressed in regular clothes during that first fight by his home. Could he have just put on actual uniform pieces over his hardshell projection instead? I'd have to go back and reread from the time he joined and see. But if I remember right, Pete got brought back in the hotel room and everybody else was suited up in the new outfits. Torque wouldn't have just modified his projection in front of the others, because that would 'prove' it wasn't the real him. I guess he could have gone into the bathroom to 'change' and gotten rid of the actual clothes and then shifted his hardshell form instead. Maybe we won't ever know for sure. I'll concede it go be either way at this point without harder evidence.

[blujay]

Also glimpsing the chink in Harada's armor was interesting.

you racist

[BugsySig]

The question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell apart from his body as well.

He can. His hat is proof.

Perhaps I should clarify: the question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell that doesn't encase his body.

His hat fell off (in issue 9 or 10...I think it was 10) when he fell out of the PRS chopper. So the hat existed independent of the rest of his "body".

That is indeed what I was referencing. I couldn't remember the issue - I was waiting to confirm before I posted my response.

Wait, wait, wait. Faith took the big box/bag of Harbinger school uniforms, right? He had his hardshell projection dressed in regular clothes during that first fight by his home. Could he have just put on actual uniform pieces over his hardshell projection instead? I'd have to go back and reread from the time he joined and see. But if I remember right, Pete got brought back in the hotel room and everybody else was suited up in the new outfits. Torque wouldn't have just modified his projection in front of the others, because that would 'prove' it wasn't the real him. I guess he could have gone into the bathroom to 'change' and gotten rid of the actual clothes and then shifted his hardshell form instead. Maybe we won't ever know for sure. I'll concede it go be either way at this point without harder evidence.

They hadn't put on the uniforms yet when they were captured by PRS and put on the transport. I suppose Torque could have put on his brothers clothes, but considering he looked the same as his self-image in Torquehalla, I doubt it.

[BugsySig]

Also glimpsing the chink in Harada's armor was interesting.

you racist

I was going to reply with the same comment when it was first posted, but thought better of myself

[Phoenix8008]

He can. His hat is proof.

Perhaps I should clarify: the question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell that doesn't encase his body.

His hat fell off (in issue 9 or 10...I think it was 10) when he fell out of the PRS chopper. So the hat existed independent of the rest of his "body".

That is indeed what I was referencing. I couldn't remember the issue - I was waiting to confirm before I posted my response.

Wait, wait, wait. Faith took the big box/bag of Harbinger school uniforms, right? He had his hardshell projection dressed in regular clothes during that first fight by his home. Could he have just put on actual uniform pieces over his hardshell projection instead? I'd have to go back and reread from the time he joined and see. But if I remember right, Pete got brought back in the hotel room and everybody else was suited up in the new outfits. Torque wouldn't have just modified his projection in front of the others, because that would 'prove' it wasn't the real him. I guess he could have gone into the bathroom to 'change' and gotten rid of the actual clothes and then shifted his hardshell form instead. Maybe we won't ever know for sure. I'll concede it go be either way at this point without harder evidence.

They hadn't put on the uniforms yet when they were captured by PRS and put on the transport. I suppose Torque could have put on his brothers clothes, but considering he looked the same as his self-image in Torquehalla, I doubt it.

No, no, no. I mean later than that. Torque comes crashing out wearing his standard Torquehalla outfit and jumps on a helicopter. They were all captured, except for Faith, who helps Peter fake being zonked out before they get loaded on the transport. Faith pulls out and puts on her white uniform to help her feel heroic and helps rescue them. Sometime later on when they are checked in at a hotel, Peter is on the balcony being all melancholy and they all summon him back inside only to see that they've all changed into their blue Harbinger uniforms including hat for Torque (except Faith who was already in her white outfit). This is the best I can do without going and pulling out the issues (which I'd go do now if they wife wasn't already trying to sleep in there).

Or do you mean his hat got knocked off in that first fight before they changed into the Harbinger uniforms?

[BugsySig]

Perhaps I should clarify: the question arises as to whether Torque can project a shell that doesn't encase his body.

His hat fell off (in issue 9 or 10...I think it was 10) when he fell out of the PRS chopper. So the hat existed independent of the rest of his "body".

That is indeed what I was referencing. I couldn't remember the issue - I was waiting to confirm before I posted my response.

Wait, wait, wait. Faith took the big box/bag of Harbinger school uniforms, right? He had his hardshell projection dressed in regular clothes during that first fight by his home. Could he have just put on actual uniform pieces over his hardshell projection instead? I'd have to go back and reread from the time he joined and see. But if I remember right, Pete got brought back in the hotel room and everybody else was suited up in the new outfits. Torque wouldn't have just modified his projection in front of the others, because that would 'prove' it wasn't the real him. I guess he could have gone into the bathroom to 'change' and gotten rid of the actual clothes and then shifted his hardshell form instead. Maybe we won't ever know for sure. I'll concede it go be either way at this point without harder evidence.

They hadn't put on the uniforms yet when they were captured by PRS and put on the transport. I suppose Torque could have put on his brothers clothes, but considering he looked the same as his self-image in Torquehalla, I doubt it.

No, no, no. I mean later than that. Torque comes crashing out wearing his standard Torquehalla outfit and jumps on a helicopter. They were all captured, except for Faith, who helps Peter fake being zonked out before they get loaded on the transport. Faith pulls out and puts on her white uniform to help her feel heroic and helps rescue them. Sometime later on when they are checked in at a hotel, Peter is on the balcony being all melancholy and they all summon him back inside only to see that they've all changed into their blue Harbinger uniforms including hat for Torque (except Faith who was already in her white outfit). This is the best I can do without going and pulling out the issues (which I'd go do now if they wife wasn't already trying to sleep in there).

Or do you mean his hat got knocked off in that first fight before they changed into the Harbinger uniforms?

Same issue. When they jump out of the transport, Torque crashes into the ground and his hat comes off. Then they go to the hotel and put on the uniforms. Torque is then shown with the Harbinger hat on, which may have replaced his previous (now lost?) hat. It's still hard to say definitively if his clothes are clothes or projections, though.

[lorddunlow]

So to sum up the last few pages of discussion:

Is Torque's penis part of his pants?

[BugsySig]

So to sum up the last few pages of discussion:

Is Torque's penis part of his pants?

Is it too late to change your custom?

Greg?

[Blood of Heroes]

Also glimpsing the chink in Harada's armor was interesting.

you racist

I was going to reply with the same comment when it was first posted, but thought better of myself

I was going to post the same thing too!

[Dallow Spicer1]

Great read, puts the last 2 issues into perspective perfectly! I had wondered why Peter recovered from his broken jaw so quickly following his battle with Bloodshot, now we know he is still injured and a captive of Harada. You've got to hand it to Josh Dysart, nobody predicted this following Harbinger Wars. This series is surely why most of us read comics, fresh, interesting, cliche free story lines. Great art too, hope Clayton Henry stays on board for a while.

4.5/5

[krylox]

solid issue, though i wish the story could move forward a bit faster, feels kind of decompressed right now. i bet it will read great in a trade, though.
4/5

[BugsySig]

solid issue, though i wish the story could move forward a bit faster, feels kind of decompressed right now. i bet it will read great in a trade, though.
4/5

It seems like almost every book from every publisher reads better in trade. Its an unfortunate side-effect of the industry today. Personally, I hate it, but at least Harbinger is good enough that I want to read it every month. Sometimes I feel I'd enjoy a book like XO more if I only read it in trade form.

[solidsteeze]

solid issue, though i wish the story could move forward a bit faster, feels kind of decompressed right now. i bet it will read great in a trade, though.
4/5

It seems like almost every book from every publisher reads better in trade. Its an unfortunate side-effect of the industry today. Personally, I hate it, but at least Harbinger is good enough that I want to read it every month. Sometimes I feel I'd enjoy a book like XO more if I only read it in trade form.

Ive considered going to trades myself for this reason. I dont know if I could stand the wait though. Also I would have to avoid the internet all together.

Harbinger 17 was a fantastic issue though. I feel like it had everything you could want in a superhero comic. The characterization has become really stellar, and none of the twists feel cheap. The art was also pretty good, although I'm curious why they didn't keep Barry Kitson on the book. I was really hoping he and Josh would be a long term creative team. Has anyone heard rumblings about him doing more work at Valiant?

[ThatDarnCabbage]

solid issue, though i wish the story could move forward a bit faster, feels kind of decompressed right now. i bet it will read great in a trade, though.
4/5

It seems like almost every book from every publisher reads better in trade. Its an unfortunate side-effect of the industry today. Personally, I hate it, but at least Harbinger is good enough that I want to read it every month. Sometimes I feel I'd enjoy a book like XO more if I only read it in trade form.

Ive considered going to trades myself for this reason. I dont know if I could stand the wait though. Also I would have to avoid the internet all together.

Harbinger 17 was a fantastic issue though. I feel like it had everything you could want in a superhero comic. The characterization has become really stellar, and none of the twists feel cheap. The art was also pretty good, although I'm curious why they didn't keep Barry Kitson on the book. I was really hoping he and Josh would be a long term creative team. Has anyone heard rumblings about him doing more work at Valiant?

It doesn't seem like we'll ever get a long term creative team at Valiant, by biggest complaint with the company. They can't even have four issues straight with a single artist for the most part.