X-O #1 goes to third print

[StarBrand]

It's impossible to fairly judge the motives for going to a third print on X-O 1 without having the exact statistical info Valiant had when the decision was made. However, it could be largely a marketing move to increase exposure of the character and line. Valiant seems to really have in place some fine folks who know what they're doing. They certainly are absolutely blowing away Dark Horse's attempt to launch a line using the Gold Key characters with Shooter at the helm. Maybe it's a good thing Dark Horse went first.

[Heath]

At the risk of sounding even more negative about Valiant and their variants than I ever intended to, I'm starting to feel that VEI is really milking us for all they can. I think the 3rd printing is more manufactured demand than real demand for a 3rd printing. As paradise pointed out, Valiant fans want multiple covers, and he (and most other shops that order the 2nd and 3rd printings) are only going to order enough for those Valiant fans they know will want them. So, it seems to me that this 3rd printing is just for the sake of a 3rd printing to sell to fans that are going to buy it simply because it exists.

If I'm wrong and there really is demand for a 3rd printing, outside those of us who are going to buy it because they made it, then I'm very happy for them! My complaints are out of love for Valiant and a hope for long term growth and success.

Do you really think that ANY real publisher (not Avatar, or the like) would print a whole new printing, 2-3k copies just to fill demand of cover collectors???? You think there are that many people that would want multiple covers? Did you read my post above that explained rather well (i hope) the mechanics of multiple printings in our industry?

I think you ARE getting too negative. I know you say you want Valiant to succeed, but by continuously being negative about something you are NOT OBLIGATED TO BUY you are creating a negative mood with the most sensitive group of people that Valiant needs to survive in the beginning, people who will buy multiple copies to give them to their friends (or collect themselves). It's been talked about it for weeks, and there is no point to adding fire to the flames with silly accusations and ideas.

I've been on this board a long time, and I we're really not that sensitive. My comments here aren't going to kill Valiant any more than Valiant would seriously put out a 3rd print just because we'll buy it.

And yeah, maybe I am being too negative and let my frustration over the seemingly endless release of variant covers cloud my judgement this time. VEI says the demand for a 3rd printing is real, so I'll believe them.

I'll work on that negativity. I'll gladly withdraw my accusation above and say I was wrong (on nothing more than VEI's word). But I stand by my comments in the other thread about them going crazy with the variants.

It's impossible to fairly judge the motives for going to a third print on X-O 1 without having the exact statistical info Valiant had when the decision was made. However, it could be largely a marketing move to increase exposure of the character and line. Valiant seems to really have in place some fine folks who know what they're doing. They certainly are absolutely blowing away Dark Horse's attempt to launch a line using the Gold Key characters with Shooter at the helm. Maybe it's a good thing Dark Horse went first.

I think that was where my mind started out when I heard about the 3rd print - that maybe it was a marketing move to attract attention. And then things degenerated in my mind from there. But I'll say it again - VEI says the demand for a 3rd print is really there and I'll believe them and offer them a hearty congratulations!

[BugsySig]

It's impossible to fairly judge the motives for going to a third print on X-O 1 without having the exact statistical info Valiant had when the decision was made. However, it could be largely a marketing move to increase exposure of the character and line. Valiant seems to really have in place some fine folks who know what they're doing. They certainly are absolutely blowing away Dark Horse's attempt to launch a line using the Gold Key characters with Shooter at the helm. Maybe it's a good thing Dark Horse went first.

I don't have any statistics on hand, but it's not like second and third printings are that rare for big launches, events or even single issues. Justice League #1 had several, as is AvX and multiple issues of the Walking Dead, especiallythe upcoming #100. I am sure there are several others from the Indy circuit too out there.

[StarBrand]

It's impossible to fairly judge the motives for going to a third print on X-O 1 without having the exact statistical info Valiant had when the decision was made. However, it could be largely a marketing move to increase exposure of the character and line. Valiant seems to really have in place some fine folks who know what they're doing. They certainly are absolutely blowing away Dark Horse's attempt to launch a line using the Gold Key characters with Shooter at the helm. Maybe it's a good thing Dark Horse went first.

I don't have any statistics on hand, but it's not like second and third printings are that rare for big launches, events or even single issues. Justice League #1 had several, as is AvX and multiple issues of the Walking Dead, especiallythe upcoming #100. I am sure there are several others from the Indy circuit too out there.

Yeah, we probably shouldn't be too surprised by it, nor should we be surprised if some of the other first issues from this line go back to the printer.

[etos45]

It's impossible to fairly judge the motives for going to a third print on X-O 1 without having the exact statistical info Valiant had when the decision was made. However, it could be largely a marketing move to increase exposure of the character and line. Valiant seems to really have in place some fine folks who know what they're doing. They certainly are absolutely blowing away Dark Horse's attempt to launch a line using the Gold Key characters with Shooter at the helm. Maybe it's a good thing Dark Horse went first.

I don't have any statistics on hand, but it's not like second and third printings are that rare for big launches, events or even single issues. Justice League #1 had several, as is AvX and multiple issues of the Walking Dead, especiallythe upcoming #100. I am sure there are several others from the Indy circuit too out there.

Yeah, we probably shouldn't be too surprised by it, nor should we be surprised if some of the other first issues from this line go back to the printer.

With what happened with X-O, I fully expect a second print announcement of Harbinger #1.

[grendeljd]

It's impossible to fairly judge the motives for going to a third print on X-O 1 without having the exact statistical info Valiant had when the decision was made. However, it could be largely a marketing move to increase exposure of the character and line. Valiant seems to really have in place some fine folks who know what they're doing. They certainly are absolutely blowing away Dark Horse's attempt to launch a line using the Gold Key characters with Shooter at the helm. Maybe it's a good thing Dark Horse went first.

I don't have any statistics on hand, but it's not like second and third printings are that rare for big launches, events or even single issues. Justice League #1 had several, as is AvX and multiple issues of the Walking Dead, especiallythe upcoming #100. I am sure there are several others from the Indy circuit too out there.

Yeah, we probably shouldn't be too surprised by it, nor should we be surprised if some of the other first issues from this line go back to the printer.

With what happened with X-O, I fully expect a second print announcement of Harbinger #1.

I hope Harbinger sells out & gets a 2nd print, it was fantastic. I was seriously disheartened when I went into my LCS on the 6th and found out they barely ordered enough to get a 1:20 variant, especially since they had ordered much heavier on X-O #1.

[StarBrand]

I don't see anything wrong with Heath voicing his opinion on the variants. It's how he feels. I don't like the cheap paper Valiant used on the cover to Harbinger 1, and expressed myself about that. We've got to be able to express ourselves if we don't like something Valiant's doing. I don't think this relaunch is so fragile our stating we don't like something about it is going to sink it. Comments on this board about this line are probably 95-99% positive about the line, anyway.

[400yrs]

Do you really think that ANY real publisher (not Avatar, or the like) would print a whole new printing, 2-3k copies just to fill demand of cover collectors???? You think there are that many people that would want multiple covers?

Errrr. Ed, you answer this question below.

b. the business person in me knows that Valiant collectors will want multiple covers. Plus we made a few mail order customers and even a couple of new local customers since Valiant came back that are VFans members, so it makes it easy to sell those copies. I am not getting a lot, just to cover those who I KNOW will want them.

I will do the same with 3rd printing for the same reasons.

[400yrs]

What I find odd is that Bleeding Cool is always the one to "break" the news for everything VEI. And they always have been all the way back to the Brett Rattner Harby announcement. There's a bit of me that can't help but wonder if Bleeding Cool is to VEI what Wizard was to Valiant.

[Elveen]

What I find odd is that Bleeding Cool is always the one to "break" the news for everything VEI. And they always have been all the way back to the Brett Rattner Harby announcement. There's a bit of me that can't help but wonder if Bleeding Cool is to VEI what Wizard was to Valiant.

I think it is good/great for VEI to have a good relationship with sites like that.

[Elveen]

It's impossible to fairly judge the motives for going to a third print on X-O 1 without having the exact statistical info Valiant had when the decision was made. However, it could be largely a marketing move to increase exposure of the character and line. Valiant seems to really have in place some fine folks who know what they're doing. They certainly are absolutely blowing away Dark Horse's attempt to launch a line using the Gold Key characters with Shooter at the helm. Maybe it's a good thing Dark Horse went first.

I don't have any statistics on hand, but it's not like second and third printings are that rare for big launches, events or even single issues. Justice League #1 had several, as is AvX and multiple issues of the Walking Dead, especiallythe upcoming #100. I am sure there are several others from the Indy circuit too out there.

WD #100 is totally different that what this thread is about. WD #100 multiple covers are all 1st prints. there are only a few WD 2nd prints. #2, #7, #8, #33, #34, #50

[400yrs]

It's impossible to fairly judge the motives for going to a third print on X-O 1 without having the exact statistical info Valiant had when the decision was made. However, it could be largely a marketing move to increase exposure of the character and line. Valiant seems to really have in place some fine folks who know what they're doing. They certainly are absolutely blowing away Dark Horse's attempt to launch a line using the Gold Key characters with Shooter at the helm. Maybe it's a good thing Dark Horse went first.

I don't have any statistics on hand, but it's not like second and third printings are that rare for big launches, events or even single issues. Justice League #1 had several, as is AvX and multiple issues of the Walking Dead, especiallythe upcoming #100. I am sure there are several others from the Indy circuit too out there.

WD #100 is totally different that what this thread is about. WD #100 multiple covers are all 1st prints. there are only a few WD 2nd prints. #2, #7, #8, #33, #34, #50

And few variants for that matter. In fact, Valiant may have passed TWD variants (before 100) already with only 3 issues out (or are damn close to it).

[BugsySig]

It's impossible to fairly judge the motives for going to a third print on X-O 1 without having the exact statistical info Valiant had when the decision was made. However, it could be largely a marketing move to increase exposure of the character and line. Valiant seems to really have in place some fine folks who know what they're doing. They certainly are absolutely blowing away Dark Horse's attempt to launch a line using the Gold Key characters with Shooter at the helm. Maybe it's a good thing Dark Horse went first.

I don't have any statistics on hand, but it's not like second and third printings are that rare for big launches, events or even single issues. Justice League #1 had several, as is AvX and multiple issues of the Walking Dead, especiallythe upcoming #100. I am sure there are several others from the Indy circuit too out there.

WD #100 is totally different that what this thread is about. WD #100 multiple covers are all 1st prints. there are only a few WD 2nd prints. #2, #7, #8, #33, #34, #50

I meant in addition to previous single issue second printings it is likely #100 will receive them as well. Your list supports my point that it is not out of the ordinary for books to receive second prints.

[jmatt]

Just buy digital. That way the nicotine-like substance that they soak into the pages won't get into your blood stream, creating the compulsion to go order 5 copies of the third printing, like I am about to.

Hmm, I have to say I'm surprised to hear that you're going all digital. Not that there's anything wrong with it, but I'm surprised to see a Valiant stalwart eschewing the printed copy.

I'm just not ready to abandon hard copies; to me, going all digital is like turning it into a ... I dunno ... something impermanent, like a television show.

Not knocking your decision in any way, I just can't see myself doing it. Call me old school, I guess.

[GGSAE]

It's impossible to fairly judge the motives for going to a third print on X-O 1 without having the exact statistical info Valiant had when the decision was made. However, it could be largely a marketing move to increase exposure of the character and line. Valiant seems to really have in place some fine folks who know what they're doing. They certainly are absolutely blowing away Dark Horse's attempt to launch a line using the Gold Key characters with Shooter at the helm. Maybe it's a good thing Dark Horse went first.

I don't have any statistics on hand, but it's not like second and third printings are that rare for big launches, events or even single issues. Justice League #1 had several, as is AvX and multiple issues of the Walking Dead, especiallythe upcoming #100. I am sure there are several others from the Indy circuit too out there.

WD #100 is totally different that what this thread is about. WD #100 multiple covers are all 1st prints. there are only a few WD 2nd prints. #2, #7, #8, #33, #34, #50

I meant in addition to previous single issue second printings it is likely #100 will receive them as well. Your list supports my point that it is not out of the ordinary for books to receive second prints.

I don't think a newly created company (granted it's a rehashed brand) should be in comparison with TWD. It goes back on what that small retailer that didn't order enough copies of X-O or Harbinger said, I just don't hope they try to expand too quickly. Sure it's a universe with an established blueprint and fan base, but going to 4-6 titles in just a couple months, and they throw on a mountain of variants can be too much accelerated growth.

[GGSAE]

At the risk of sounding even more negative about Valiant and their variants than I ever intended to, I'm starting to feel that VEI is really milking us for all they can. I think the 3rd printing is more manufactured demand than real demand for a 3rd printing. As paradise pointed out, Valiant fans want multiple covers, and he (and most other shops that order the 2nd and 3rd printings) are only going to order enough for those Valiant fans they know will want them. So, it seems to me that this 3rd printing is just for the sake of a 3rd printing to sell to fans that are going to buy it simply because it exists.

If I'm wrong and there really is demand for a 3rd printing, outside those of us who are going to buy it because they made it, then I'm very happy for them! My complaints are out of love for Valiant and a hope for long term growth and success.

Do you really think that ANY real publisher (not Avatar, or the like) would print a whole new printing, 2-3k copies just to fill demand of cover collectors???? You think there are that many people that would want multiple covers? Did you read my post above that explained rather well (i hope) the mechanics of multiple printings in our industry?

I think you ARE getting too negative. I know you say you want Valiant to succeed, but by continuously being negative about something you are NOT OBLIGATED TO BUY you are creating a negative mood with the most sensitive group of people that Valiant needs to survive in the beginning, people who will buy multiple copies to give them to their friends (or collect themselves). It's been talked about it for weeks, and there is no point to adding fire to the flames with silly accusations and ideas.

Ed, do you really think that with 45k plus regular printing that eventually all those copies won't be distributed to the fans? So what if a retailer doesn't have a copy of X-O this month? More fans will come by and ask, and they will eventually decide to gradually increase their orders. The loss of immediate compensation is their aversion to risk in not getting copies when they first come out. I would rather the demand be sustainable and gradual, than manufactured.

[Aram]

I think x-o is fairly safe in it's printings. I think demand is akin to Saga only there were more first prints of x-o due to the variants that will sit around the large shops for the next few months to a year at most as word spreads. After that I think demand will re-assert itself and once most the issues have found a home we will see those issues going for 6-10$ a piece for the long run.

Just my theory.

[Dr. Solar]

Just buy digital. That way the nicotine-like substance that they soak into the pages won't get into your blood stream, creating the compulsion to go order 5 copies of the third printing, like I am about to.

Hmm, I have to say I'm surprised to hear that you're going all digital. Not that there's anything wrong with it, but I'm surprised to see a Valiant stalwart eschewing the printed copy.

The problem with dangling modifiers is that they can modify so many things. I'm about to order 5 copies of the third printing, not go digital

[400yrs]

I think x-o is fairly safe in it's printings. I think demand is akin to Saga only there were more first prints of x-o due to the variants that will sit around the large shops for the next few months to a year at most as word spreads. After that I think demand will re-assert itself and once most the issues have found a home we will see those issues going for 6-10$ a piece for the long run.

Just my theory.

Whoa, whoa, whoa! Let's not get crazy here.

Saga is doing well WITHOUT the different cover gimmick for later printings. All 4 printings are the same cover with a different colored logo. They aren't trying to get people to buy the same book with a different cover for a new printing. I.e., BVK is not relying on the completion freaks within his audience as is VEI to sell more books. He is relying on new readers to pick up the new printings with the same cover to keep shelves stocked.

Saga #1 did it without the variant incentive gimmicks which VEI has no doubt fallen head over heels for as evidenced by the continuation of the 1:x variants.

Saga had barely any drop-off at all from #1 to #2 (Less than 2K) and sales for #3 are up over sales for #1 first printing. This means people are reading #1, enjoying it and buying subsequent issues. I'm certain we are going to see a massive drop off with #2 on X-O. We'll see how much though.

And finally and most importantly, Saga is being discussed all over the place. X-O, not so much.


Just trying to keep things in perspective as I don't really see the comparison to Saga at all. Apples, oranges.

[paradise]

Errrr. Ed, you answer this question below.

No, not quite. There is a difference between someone like myself ordering a dozen due to knowledge of what members here would want because of my membership (and it's not enough apparently, should have done more), to a bunch of stores ordering that way. I really doubt too many stores will order these 3rd printings if they still have 1st prints. Or if they are getting 2nds. Economics of printing comics do not support that.

[paradise]

Ed, do you really think that with 45k plus regular printing that eventually all those copies won't be distributed to the fans? So what if a retailer doesn't have a copy of X-O this month? More fans will come by and ask, and they will eventually decide to gradually increase their orders. The loss of immediate compensation is their aversion to risk in not getting copies when they first come out. I would rather the demand be sustainable and gradual, than manufactured.

That's not the point. We gotta stop thinking of this as a Comic Book INDUSTRY, it's not, it's about 2,000 (more or less) Independent shops who make independent decisions. I have xxx copies left, does not mean I am actively looking for other shops that need those copies and fulfilling their demand for books. There is a rather big print run, but it's in pockets. That's why you see people selling 10 packs or regular books, those are the people that bought up to order variants (like myself to fill the needs of this board). If I sell a 10pack to someone, they are not going to a store to sell it back to them. They will, in a few years when it either matters or not. But for now, the product does not travel well enough, so there is a need for multiple printings.

[Aram]

I think x-o is fairly safe in it's printings. I think demand is akin to Saga only there were more first prints of x-o due to the variants that will sit around the large shops for the next few months to a year at most as word spreads. After that I think demand will re-assert itself and once most the issues have found a home we will see those issues going for 6-10$ a piece for the long run.

Just my theory.

Whoa, whoa, whoa! Let's not get crazy here.

Saga is doing well WITHOUT the different cover gimmick for later printings. All 4 printings are the same cover with a different colored logo. They aren't trying to get people to buy the same book with a different cover for a new printing. I.e., BVK is not relying on the completion freaks within his audience as is VEI to sell more books. He is relying on new readers to pick up the new printings with the same cover to keep shelves stocked.

Saga #1 did it without the variant incentive gimmicks which VEI has no doubt fallen head over heels for as evidenced by the continuation of the 1:x variants.

Saga had barely any drop-off at all from #1 to #2 (Less than 2K) and sales for #3 are up over sales for #1 first printing. This means people are reading #1, enjoying it and buying subsequent issues. I'm certain we are going to see a massive drop off with #2 on X-O. We'll see how much though.

And finally and most importantly, Saga is being discussed all over the place. X-O, not so much.


Just trying to keep things in perspective as I don't really see the comparison to Saga at all. Apples, oranges.

I am comparing it to Saga because Saga is the second attempt at a comic by someone that made something people liked almost a decade ago. I have no Idea what people are saying about Saga. I just know that it is now in multiple printings and every local shop I know of is sold out of the first printings.

From what I've seen Y did not go to muliple printings until it was in tpb, except for a special issue reprinting issue 1. Alot of people enjoyed Y and are still finding out about it for the first time today, but when it first came out demand was not great.

I think the same thing that is happening with saga will happen with some VEI titles. I personally signed up for Saga the moment I found out about it in previews, and that is just because I loved Y so much when I found out about it 6 months ago that I bought all the tpbs.

From mere observance I see demand increasing for X-O and the issues selling out in stores the same way I saw Saga sell out. The only difference I see is that X-O has multiple covers and was highly ordered by a few large shops to get the Variants. Lcs demand appears the same to me for both titles.

I haven't even read Saga yet even though I have them. I have no doubt I'll like it, just like I have no doubt I will like the Valiant titles coming out.

All I'm saying is overall print runs and demand seem akin to me between x-o and saga with the only difference being the distribution so far. Aka it seems everyone under ordered on saga and for the most part only large lcs' ordered enough of X-O.

[jmatt]

Just buy digital. That way the nicotine-like substance that they soak into the pages won't get into your blood stream, creating the compulsion to go order 5 copies of the third printing, like I am about to.

Hmm, I have to say I'm surprised to hear that you're going all digital. Not that there's anything wrong with it, but I'm surprised to see a Valiant stalwart eschewing the printed copy.

The problem with dangling modifiers is that they can modify so many things. I'm about to order 5 copies of the third printing, not go digital

I stand corrected. Whew!

[Heath]

I emailed MOC about the 3rd printing and got this response....

Good morning Heath,

The 3rd printing for X-O Manowar #1 was solicited in April. Unfortunately, I am unable to re-order a copy of this item, from our distributor....sorry.

Let me know if you need anything else.

Enjoy your day,

Does anyone have a Diamond item code for the 3rd printing?

EDIT: Nevermind, I found it. I looked at Valiant's web site yesterday for the announcement and the item code, but didn't see it. It's there today though. http://valiantuniverse.com/news/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[Aram]

I emailed MOC about the 3rd printing and got this response....

Good morning Heath,

The 3rd printing for X-O Manowar #1 was solicited in April. Unfortunately, I am unable to re-order a copy of this item, from our distributor....sorry.

Let me know if you need anything else.

Enjoy your day,

Does anyone have a Diamond item code for the 3rd printing?

EDIT: Nevermind, I found it. I looked at Valiant's web site yesterday for the announcement and the item code, but didn't see it. It's there today though. http://valiantuniverse.com/news/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Uhm... How could the 3rd printing be solicited before the 2nd was announced?