Dynamic Forces is VIP.

Darques_Emporium · Post by **Darques_Emporium** » Wed Aug 01, 2007 11:17 pm

With all this, I feel like I walked into a 60's Batman episode and the Riddler has gone mad. I am confused now.

StarBrand · Post by **StarBrand** » Wed Aug 01, 2007 11:40 pm

Darques_Emporium wrote:With all this, I feel like I walked into a 60's Batman episode and the Riddler has gone mad. I am confused now.

The waters are just a bit murky at the moment, my friend.
Hopefully it will all clear up soon enough.

Dr. Solar · Post by **Dr. Solar** » Wed Aug 01, 2007 11:42 pm

Murky?!

2+2=red.

This is clear as tropical waters!

TKWill · Post by **TKWill** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 2:29 am

The only thing that bothers me about Dynamic Forces being VIP is the *SQUEE* ashcan. They could put out such better material without lifting a finger. Doesn't this bother anyone else, I mean the ashcan has an indeoendent or underground feel to it, not the glitz and glamour I would expect from a DF product. I don't know, just a thought.

leonmallett · Post by **leonmallett** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 2:40 am

ThrillKillWill wrote:The only thing that bothers me about Dynamic Forces being VIP is the *SQUEE* ashcan. They could put out such better material without lifting a finger. Doesn't this bother anyone else, I mean the ashcan has an indeoendent or underground feel to it, not the glitz and glamour I would expect from a DF product. I don't know, just a thought.

I'd guess the ashcan was a rush job as those aren't really model sheets offering diffferent views of the same charcter(s) - including their feet.

I can imagine that it didn't take more than a few days to assemble.

steverino · Post by **steverino** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 3:31 am

I believe it was a legal maneuver to try and get more leverage for their bogus claims to the trademarks. Pretending to have more invested in the names than what they really had so a judge may favor them instead of Dino.

If that was the case, it either fizzled or backfired, thankfully.

Daniel Jackson · Post by **Daniel Jackson** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 6:44 am

leonmallett wrote:
ThrillKillWill wrote:The only thing that bothers me about Dynamic Forces being VIP is the *SQUEE* ashcan. They could put out such better material without lifting a finger. Doesn't this bother anyone else, I mean the ashcan has an indeoendent or underground feel to it, not the glitz and glamour I would expect from a DF product. I don't know, just a thought.
I'd guess the ashcan was a rush job as those aren't really model sheets offering diffferent views of the same charcter(s) - including their feet.

I can imagine that it didn't take more than a few days to assemble.

Looks they had a third grader draw it for them.

Daniel Jackson · Post by **Daniel Jackson** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 6:45 am

steverino wrote:I believe it was a legal maneuver to try and get more leverage for their bogus claims to the trademarks. Pretending to have more invested in the names than what they really had so a judge may favor them instead of Dino.

If that was the case, it either fizzled or backfired, thankfully.

Indeed it did, they look more foolish than ever now.

slym2none · Post by **slym2none** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 12:25 pm

Daniel Jackson wrote:
Brian Thomer wrote:
Daniel Jackson wrote:What kills me is what do they honestly hope to gain by hiding in the shadows on this? If they feel that what they have done is right then they should stand behind it and be proud to put their names on it. Instead they cower behind their lawyer and don't want to stand up and face the music because they know that what they are doing is wrong. If they're hoping that this ugliness will all be forgotten when they release some books with ripped off Valiant names on them, they have another thing coming.
Not that I'm defending VIP, cause I'm not, but you're assuming that's why they aren't coming forward. I think it's common practice to not speak publicly about your company until it's ready to launch. For example, I, at least, have heard very little from the new owner of the Dreamwave assets. I don't believe Tales of Wonder spoke too much about their plans for the Chaos! characters. And, of course, VEI didn't make public comments until they were ready to launch their first book.
Ah yes, but in the other cases they have acquired the properties the right way and have nothing to slink around about. Also, in the case of VEI, don't forget the reason they haven't been able to talk about anything is because of VIP.

My two cents on this particular issue - there are MANY of us on this very site that can put at least one face with a name, and have shook hands with said person(s.) Who can say that they have met anyone from VIP?

-slym

slym2none · Post by **slym2none** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 12:27 pm

schi0249 wrote:What worries me is that VIP has the resources to drag this on indefinitely. That they will keep it in the courts until VEI runs out of capital and sells Valiant to VIP.

My two cents on this matter - don't count out VEI when it comes to deep pockets.

"It is only a matter of time."

-slym

Darques_Emporium · Post by **Darques_Emporium** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 1:35 pm

Is this move from VIP retaliation for the real Valiant releasing the Harbinger Hardcover? If it is, they have failed miserably. If this is the kind of quality product we can expect from them in the future, Valiant Entertainment will win hand over fist just reprinting the Valiant comics that came before Unity. Ooh, imagine a Unity Hardcover.

superman-prime · Post by **superman-prime** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 2:09 pm

unity the ABSOLUTE edition yummmmmmmmmmmmmm

Daniel Jackson · Post by **Daniel Jackson** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 2:28 pm

Darques_Emporium wrote:Is this move from VIP retaliation for the real Valiant releasing the Harbinger Hardcover? If it is, they have failed miserably. If this is the kind of quality product we can expect from them in the future, Valiant Entertainment will win hand over fist just reprinting the Valiant comics that came before Unity. Ooh, imagine a Unity Hardcover.

I'm in for that.

magnusr · Post by **magnusr** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 2:36 pm

[Moved, wrong thread]

Geomancer · Post by **Geomancer** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 2:44 pm

I have a hard time associating the people who put out an amateurish project at the San Diego Con have or at least are willing to spend any significant amount of money.

Why sell a limited number of ashcans for $40?

I've never been to a big comics convention, but for those who have -- how common is it for a decently funded start-up to charge inflated prices to promote their upcoming company?

Wouldn't they generally have promotional give-aways or at most some kind of nominal cost?

I wonder what arrangement they made to pay their lawyer. Maybe its like those ambulance chaser deals where the attorney doesn't charge upfront with the expectation that instead their pay would be a percentage of the expected settlement?

thePike · Post by **thePike** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 2:54 pm

Geomancer wrote:I wonder what arrangement they made to pay their lawyer. Maybe its like those ambulance chaser deals where the attorney doesn't charge upfront with the expectation that instead their pay would be a percentage of the expected settlement?

With a few exceptions, this is pretty much how every lawyer works. They don't get paid unless you do. It's the name of the game.

Lovitz would not be a cheap lawyer, and a law firm such as theirs would not be taking on this case unless their was $$$ to be earned from doing it. As much as I do not like it, VIP has a strong case... (at least with the info we have at the moment, things can always change)

Geomancer · Post by **Geomancer** » Thu Aug 02, 2007 3:10 pm

thePike wrote:
Geomancer wrote:I wonder what arrangement they made to pay their lawyer. Maybe its like those ambulance chaser deals where the attorney doesn't charge upfront with the expectation that instead their pay would be a percentage of the expected settlement?
With a few exceptions, this is pretty much how every lawyer works. They don't get paid unless you do. It's the name of the game.

Lovitz would not be a cheap lawyer, and a law firm such as theirs would not be taking on this case unless their was $$$ to be earned from doing it. As much as I do not like it, VIP has a strong case... (at least with the info we have at the moment, things can always change)

Thanks.

I was trying to think of what significant expenses VIP could possibly have made to launch their new company. The only one I could think of was legal expenses - and it seems even that wouldn't have to be all that much.

The more news that trickles in the more VIP seems to be an opportunist/extortion campaign run on the cheap. Whereas those who put actual money down to get everything but some of the names and looks to be putting out a first class product look like a genuine comics company.

So with some creativity, as Valiant entertainment just needs to come up with alternative logos (worst case scenario) like "Valiant Entertainment Presents...Harbinger" "Valiant Entertainment Spotlight....featuring Ninjak" and everything should be just fine.

greg · Post by **greg** » Fri Aug 03, 2007 3:01 am

VIP is only known to be represented by attorney Michael Lovitz.

In order to better understand Michael Lovitz's history with comic book trademarks,
I decided to search the public database at the USPTO.gov.

Here are the results... with the addition of the known publisher for those trademarks,
and any comments related to the source of information found.

Since there's a lot of data on the page, let me highlight some interesting areas.

http://www.newsarama.com/deadpublishers/PriestQ_W.htm

slym2none · Post by **slym2none** » Fri Aug 03, 2007 3:02 am

What a surprise.

-slym

TKWill · Post by **TKWill** » Fri Aug 03, 2007 3:23 am

And the plot thickens...... If this turns out to be true I think Greg deserves one of them VF merit badges for Research.

slym2none · Post by **slym2none** » Fri Aug 03, 2007 4:05 am

I guess that's the biggest thing about VIP - the shiftyness, the shadiness, the (admittedly IMO) underhanded way everything they've done has gone about... why can't they just come out and say who they are and what they want?

VEI has been pretty damn transparent, esp. compared to VIP. The only reason (again, IMO) that we don't know more is because of the legalese that VEI has had to wade through because of VIP's involvement.

-slym

Second_Death · Post by **Second_Death** » Fri Aug 03, 2007 8:18 am

Not much question about the link between vip and Dynamic Forces.

leonmallett · Post by **leonmallett** » Fri Aug 03, 2007 8:22 am

Second_Death wrote:Not much question about the link between vip and Dynamic Forces.

I'd agree except to add that it all circumstantial. Nothing irrefutably definitive as yet.

mobstirr · Post by **mobstirr** » Fri Aug 03, 2007 8:23 am

Thanks for the very enlightening research, Greg. Kudos!

greg · Post by **greg** » Fri Aug 03, 2007 9:17 am

leonmallett wrote:
Second_Death wrote:Not much question about the link between vip and Dynamic Forces.
I'd agree except to add that it all circumstantial. Nothing irrefutably definitive as yet.

If Mr. Lovitz allowed "irrefutably definitive" to occur for his client, he wouldn't be doing his job.

...and it appears that in this area of the industry, he only has one client.

If all the arrows pointing the same direction isn't enough for you...
I guess you'll just have to believe that Dynamic Forces isn't involved.