RAI #0 details

sandman · Post by **sandman** » Thu Apr 15, 2004 9:39 pm

I reread RAI #0 tonight and noticed some details that raised some questions.

1- When XO and Turok are leaving to go dino hunting there are posters on the floor for Ken Clarkson running for Senate in '94. I don't remember the later XO that well, but did they ever bring this into XO in the 1994 year of issues? I didn't remember if they had already started to *SQUEE* the story yet.

2- Can anyone identify the heroes gathered for Shadowman's funeral? Some are obvious (Bloodshot, Archer and Flamingo, Armstrong, Solar, Geoff, XO, Gilad, Kris and Pete in 99?). But what about the big bald guy? Or the curly haired Harbinger? There is a girl in a skimpy outfit in front of the bald guy too. The one I'm really curious about is the blonde haired guy with what looks like chain mail armor and a shoulder strap of ammo. He looks similar to Gilad. Is there any mention of these characters in later books? Could this be the first appearance of some character?

3- More of technicality. How can they say "not a trace fo blood" remains in Bloodshot's dead body when there are blood stains on the floor and his mouth? Did he have regular blood in addition to his nanite blood? I know the last RAI needs to slit his wrists to make room for the nanite blood and they don't drain his old blood. Could Ax have separated the nanite blood from Bloodshot?

Let me know what you think

screamingdc · Post by **screamingdc** » Thu Apr 15, 2004 10:02 pm

#2- nevermind, i think i was wrong. blonde haired guy in chain mail i think is Ivar. the only one i'm wondering about is the guy who's sitting above the Harbinger kids, with only his legs showing.

#3- the blood was already stained and therfore unrecoverable. i think what they meant about 'not a trace of blood' was actual usable blood that could be injected into another host.

BodaZoffa · Post by **BodaZoffa** » Thu Apr 15, 2004 11:40 pm

I remember reading an article, way back, about Bloodshot's death in RAI #0. The person being interviewed was a writer for Valiant, & he had hinted that Bloodshot does not really die in the battle with AX. He was being extrememly vague about it, but that was the jist of his explanation.

Boda

graybola · Post by **graybola** » Fri Apr 16, 2004 12:42 am

I dont recall Ken ever running for senate. He must have lost. The girl in front of the bald guy looks like Thumper (I think) from harbinger 5. I have no clue who the curly haired kid is, but I dont think the guy in the mail is Ivar. Ivar has almost always had brown hair and a trench coat.

Chris

graybola · Post by **graybola** » Fri Apr 16, 2004 12:43 am

Also... In another topic we were talking about the visitor, the harbinger, and Peter Stanchek. On the page where all the other characters appear it shows Pete, Zephyr, Kris, and Flamingo together. Sometime after the end of the Visitor series, but before the harbinger wars start, the original harbinger kids and the curly haired kid must have all hooked back up. Harbinger was always my favorite, but after 25 I just couldnt get into it. Going from Sting who had so much power to Zephyr was a total let down. I think a lot of people probably felt the same.

I wonder if there were plans to try to bring back the original team, but were cancelled when vh2 arrived? Maybe for the 50th issue they had plans to revamp the series??? Who knows, maybe the harbinger wars wouldnt have been too far off had things been a little different.

Any thoughts?

Sector3600 · Post by **Sector3600** » Fri Apr 16, 2004 7:31 am

graybola wrote:Also... In another topic we were talking about the visitor, the harbinger, and Peter Stanchek. On the page where all the other characters appear it shows Pete, Zephyr, Kris, and Flamingo together. Sometime after the end of the Visitor series, but before the harbinger wars start, the original harbinger kids and the curly haired kid must have all hooked back up. Harbinger was always my favorite, but after 25 I just couldnt get into it. Going from Sting who had so much power to Zephyr was a total let down. I think a lot of people probably felt the same.

I wonder if there were plans to try to bring back the original team, but were cancelled when vh2 arrived? Maybe for the 50th issue they had plans to revamp the series??? Who knows, maybe the harbinger wars wouldnt have been too far off had things been a little different.

Any thoughts?

The focus on Zephyr ties directly with Rai #0 - she was instrumental in re-forming the resistance. In addition, during the Chaos Effect Epilogues, Magnus encounters the "renegade" Harbingers led by Zephyr which sparks her drive to resist Harbinger Foundation.

The cool thing about after Harbinger #25 is that everyone seemed to under estimate Zephyr. She was a very fun character, from "fat kid" to leader of the Harbinger Resistance. I guess some readers didn't like the fact she was a dumpy girl instead of another 'Wonder Woman' clone

I would have liked Valiant to form a new series from that merged Harbinger & H.A.R.D. Corps into something like 'Harbinger Wars'.

Any problems Valiant had were very much changed under Acclaim, we'll never really know what Valiant was planning besides over-printing and expanding to 18 titles.

BloodOfHeroes · Post by **BloodOfHeroes** » Fri Apr 16, 2004 1:05 pm

BodaZoffa wrote:I remember reading an article, way back, about Bloodshot's death in RAI #0. The person being interviewed was a writer for Valiant, & he had hinted that Bloodshot does not really die in the battle with AX. He was being extrememly vague about it, but that was the jist of his explanation.

Boda

I think you're talking about a line by Jon Hartz in which he said (I'm paraphrasing here) that Bloodshot *might* have survived his battle with Ax, just without the BoH--the implication being that what Rai #0 *states* is true, but that there was LOTS of "wiggle room" left in there. The easy solution is to say Bloodshot dies, Archer dies, Jack Boniface dies, but JH (in the WIZARD special, perhaps?) very matter-of-factly states that that was not necessarily the case. Case in point" Bob Layton's declaration that other heroes had the nanite blood between its being taken from Bloodshot and injected into Rai. RAI #0 doesn't say that it *did* happen, but it doesn't say it *COULDN'T* happen, either.

BoH

Shakespeare · Post by **Shakespeare** » Fri Apr 16, 2004 1:28 pm

Wasn't it the ad for HARD Corps#13 that read "Valiant: Where dead is dead."?

Wonder if they would have kept that promise?

Sector3600 · Post by **Sector3600** » Fri Apr 16, 2004 1:34 pm

BloodOfHeroes wrote:
BodaZoffa wrote:I remember reading an article, way back, about Bloodshot's death in RAI #0. The person being interviewed was a writer for Valiant, & he had hinted that Bloodshot does not really die in the battle with AX. He was being extrememly vague about it, but that was the jist of his explanation.

Boda
I think you're talking about a line by Jon Hartz in which he said (I'm paraphrasing here) that Bloodshot *might* have survived his battle with Ax, just without the BoH--the implication being that what Rai #0 *states* is true, but that there was LOTS of "wiggle room" left in there. The easy solution is to say Bloodshot dies, Archer dies, Jack Boniface dies, but JH (in the WIZARD special, perhaps?) very matter-of-factly states that that was not necessarily the case. Case in point" Bob Layton's declaration that other heroes had the nanite blood between its being taken from Bloodshot and injected into Rai. RAI #0 doesn't say that it *did* happen, but it doesn't say it *COULDN'T* happen, either.

BoH

I also remember that someone on the Valiant staff said that the Blood of Heroes passed through others before Rai. That there was suppose to be a Blood of Heroes series or such.

I like that Rai #0 was suppose to be an end to key characters; Aric, Jack Boniface, Archer, X-O armor, Solar/Destoryer, death of Harada and etc.

I think it was when Valiant became Acclaim did the tune change to say that nothing is really absolute due to the Chaos Effect and the Visitor in regards to Rai #0. Acclaim thought they had a continous gold mine

Rai #0 was promoted as the "bridge" and was held as the direction for a majority of the pre-Acclaim staffing members.

Sector3600 · Post by **Sector3600** » Fri Apr 16, 2004 1:37 pm

Shakespeare wrote:Wasn't it the ad for HARD Corps#13 that read "Valiant: Where dead is dead."?

Wonder if they would have kept that promise?

Yes, it did. In fact, some Valiant upper staff members did interviews in which they were reffering to Marvel's periodic "Dead/Not Dead" characters and that Valiant was going to keep those that die, dead.

Readers of VH1 & VH2, know that UNITY 2000 was centered around the 'Many Deaths of Jack Boniface!'

oxygen · Post by **oxygen** » Fri Apr 16, 2004 3:05 pm

I don't think that's Ivar, because I think Shooter said he didn't ever envision the character of Ivar.

sandman · Post by **sandman** » Fri Apr 16, 2004 3:16 pm

I didn't think it was Ivar either. The blonde hair doesn't fit him. Whoever that is, he's the most interesting of the unidentified. Most of the characters to the left can be labeled Harbingers that were discovered after Harbiner 41. The chainmail on the middle guy just piqued my curiosity.

I haven't read the last issues of the Visitor, but I know his identity. Should Pete be with Kris there? Or is that someone else?

oxygen · Post by **oxygen** » Sun Apr 18, 2004 2:09 pm

oh, and ken did try to run for senate. starts in xo issue 19 or so, i believe. another senator even offered him a seat if he gave up the armor to the government.

Jaknife · Post by **Jaknife** » Sun Apr 18, 2004 4:01 pm

acclaim totally screwed things up. the problem with having a futuristic title, is that you can see the outcomes of somethings that happen in the normal continuity. bloodshot 'dying' by proteus would have stopped ax from getting the blood, and so forth down to takao konishi, stopping him from getting the blood, which would have let the malevs take over, etc. also, the Archies would never have been started due to the fact that archer, armstrong and geoff were taken. i know chaos effect is supposed to kind of negate Rai 0, but you cant deny the archies existed, therefore screwing the timeline.

is it possible that the blonde person with chain mail is zephyr? cuz near the end of harbinger, she did sort of go into commando mode mode. and she wasn't pictured near the others.