What needs to work in Eternal Warrior??

[Manaf82]

Based upon my earlier question about Shadowman,this is another title which just hasn't worked out even though Gilad works well in other titles he appears in..

For me personally it is the disconnection with other titles just like Shadowman..

The other houses should have first been mentioned unity or some other titles first.Then they should have shown how the houses interacts with the rest of the organisations in VEI as well..

They could begin by showing the house of death interacting with Shadow-man and other supernatural denizens..

[ValiantCentral]

As it stands now, I don't seen Shadowman returning to his own ongoing, at least not as a "hero". I do see a Master Darque book as a possibility and as the way to tie Shadowman back into the VEI universe. Darque was everywhere in old Valiant so why not?

[FormerReader]

I think the problem for me so far has been the first arc was building to this big battle that was supposed to take place 2000 years later. The second arc jumps 2000 years into the future and we have no continuation of the story. Why even tell the first arc then? The arcs did not connect together in my opinion and the way it was written they should have. Why jump to the 4001 year timeline at all? It didn't advance the story. I was expecting that Rai would be introduced in the second arc and this was the reason for the jump. As a reader it just felt like the writer had too much freedom to do what they wanted and no clear plan.

I think this is a book that can be easily fixed though. Give Gilad more of a back story. Have each arc focus on him throughout history showing how his decisions have impacted the VEI universe as we know it and use these stories to introduce new characters and build the universe. A WWII arc with the old Unity team would make a cool story. Stories with him and the Geomancers throughout time. This is what I want out of an Eteranl Warrior story.

[Keith]

A couple of thoughts:

1) Fix the back-story - I think we mostly agree that there is a discrepancy between the "first Pak arc" Gilad and the "Wrath of the Eternal Warrior/Unity" Gilad. Making the leap from a Gilad who has foresaken his duty to the Geomancers/Earth and is openly hostile against them, to FVLs Gilad who is back on the job and all gung-ho for Geomancers is fitting a very square peg in a ridiculously round hole. I mean, he freekin' blew up the Earth Tree for Pete's sake, but apparently that's no biggee??? Might as well bring in Joe Quesada to say "because magic."

2) Explain the houses - They were introduced, but we had no explanation as to what they were or why we should care. The death house apparently has a sword... is it Mitu? Was it Xaran? Or was she with the Earth? And what about the Machine house? Why were they in the story anyway? Confusion.

[leonmallett]

Eternal Warrior didn't 'not work' for me.

There was stuff that could have been better, but the hiatus really surprised me. The small stuff that could be better is easily fixable and manageable in future.

[mateo107]

definitely bring back the Geomancers and the concept of serving the Earth, not only did his apostasy (for lack of a better word) not fit with how the character was previously established, it really detracts from everything that makes EW unique in general.

unfortunately, Greg Pak's take on Gilad wasn't even very unique for Greg Pak. his Turok seems to be nothing more than a retread of an isolationistic, sword-wielding naturist who forsakes his previous beliefs. his writing comes across less as entertaining and more as axe grinding.

[RogueJedi74]

The first arc of EW was just not good at all. I didn't like the art or the story. There was nothing in this story that felt like EW except that the fact he lived a very long time. The EW I like is in Unity, A&A, and X-O.

Hoping that it can come back and get back to what makes him great (Honor, Experience over the ages, and Fist & Steel)

[Intrepidxc]

I actually really liked the 2nd arc. Call me crazy, but I miss my monthly Eternal Warrior read.

[lorddunlow]

I liked both arcs.

[SJS4]

I enjoyed both arcs, although i was a little disappointed there wasn't more to the confrontation with the nergal death cult.

I enjoyed Hairsine's art and was also a little disappointed they needed a fill in artist for a few pages in issue 4. I enjoyed Gill's work in the second arc and was really pleased he did the entire arc himself. I am glad both artists are still with Valiant (AH: Bloodshot and AH: Harbinger) but i really miss the Eternal Warrior series. Even with its flaws it was the book i looked forward to the most each month. Since that series was canceled the torch has been passed to another book, but not from Valiant ("X" from Dark Horse, FWIW).

[Peter]

I think the problem for me so far has been the first arc was building to this big battle that was supposed to take place 2000 years later. The second arc jumps 2000 years into the future and we have no continuation of the story. Why even tell the first arc then? The arcs did not connect together in my opinion and the way it was written they should have. Why jump to the 4001 year timeline at all? It didn't advance the story. I was expecting that Rai would be introduced in the second arc and this was the reason for the jump. As a reader it just felt like the writer had too much freedom to do what they wanted and no clear plan.

"I think this is a book that can be easily fixed though. Give Gilad more of a back story. Have each arc focus on him throughout history showing how his decisions have impacted the VEI universe as we know it and use these stories to introduce new characters and build the universe. A WWII arc with the old Unity team would make a cool story. Stories with him and the Geomancers throughout time. This is what I want out of an Eteranl Warrior story.

"

Well said, I think you have hit the nail on the head with both points you make FR.

I was also expecting a sort of connection between the first and second arcs, thinking that perhaps we would see how the fates Mitu and Xaron had panned out, plus more on their connection with the houses. I am not complaining as I enjoyed the 4001 arc and I had surmised that this tale of the houses would be expanded further down the track.

I could not agree with you more regards your second paragraph FormerReader ^

The possibilities are endless, keep the premise simple and straight forward and everything will of course spiral outwards from there. I feel the first arc perhaps tried a little to hard to introduce new aspects too quickly. Perhaps had this been a backstory, it could have spread out over more issues, keeping the intrigue and interest up whilst not being the main focus of each particular arc.

I have enjoyed the Eternal Warrior title so far and I hope to see it's imminent return. I am excited that we will see more of the Eternal Warrior/Geomancer interaction in the upcoming 'The Valiant', and I continue to enjoy Gilad's exploits in Unity. The storytelling possibilities for this character have thousands of years of backstory, let's dive in .

[Shadowman99]

I don't think there's been any problem with EW at all

On FormerReader's point about 'The Big Battle 2000 Years From Now': Technically speaking, if it's assumed that if the first EW arc takes place in 2014, then the 'big battle' takes place in 4014. As far as I recall, the 2nd EW arc takes place in 4001... So the 'big battle' hasn't actually happened yet.

As for Manaf82's comment on how the 'Houses should have been mentioned in Unity or some other titles first... Why? The Abettors from Shadowman are barely hinted at in any other comics. Even Harada's Eggbreakers and PRS are barely hinted at in some of the other VEI comics. So why do EW's 'Houses' need to be mentioned in any other comics? I can see your frustration at EW not particularly crossing over or tying into other VEI comics, but I think you're asking a bit too much a bit too soon. The comic's only 8 issues in for crying out loud, give it some time to establish itself properly in its own corner before forcing it out into the ring to tie up with the others. I'm not saying you're totally wrong to suggest that perhaps the 'House of Death' could have links to the supernatural element of Shadowman (for example) one way or another: I think you're just a bit too quick off the mark here.

The way I see it is that there haven't really been any problems with EW so far: There were some HUGE plot elements that were introduced in the first arc, and some HUGE ones in the second arc also that have yet to have been fully explained, let alone realised, but to me this simply suggests a wealth of coming story that's there to be enjoyed. I have no problems with that at all. If some of those elements are still left unchecked in say, three years time then I'll probably have something to say about it, but until then, BRING ON MORE ETERNAL WARRIOR for me to read!

[FormerReader]

On FormerReader's point about 'The Big Battle 2000 Years From Now': Technically speaking, if it's assumed that if the first EW arc takes place in 2014, then the 'big battle' takes place in 4014. As far as I recall, the 2nd EW arc takes place in 4001... So the 'big battle' hasn't actually happened yet.

You may be correct. I'm not sure it stated exactly 2000 years. I guess my complaint is more so that all this background is laid out in the first arc as if it is leading to some momentous showdown in the second arc and that is the reason for the jump to the 4001 timeline. The second arc didn't tie into anything laid out in the first arc where it was implied it was going to.

I think the series so far has been enjoyable, it is not a bad book by any means, but it is not what I was expecting from an Eternal Warrior series.

[bygranddesign]

On FormerReader's point about 'The Big Battle 2000 Years From Now': Technically speaking, if it's assumed that if the first EW arc takes place in 2014, then the 'big battle' takes place in 4014. As far as I recall, the 2nd EW arc takes place in 4001... So the 'big battle' hasn't actually happened yet.

You may be correct. I'm not sure it stated exactly 2000 years. I guess my complaint is more so that all this background is laid out in the first arc as if it is leading to some momentous showdown in the second arc and that is the reason for the jump to the 4001 timeline. The second arc didn't tie into anything laid out in the first arc where it was implied it was going to.

+1

How does it make sense to build up this battle in 2000 years (where Nergal will be unleashed upon the world) only to completely ignore that plot point when you jump to 4001? This makes sense?

And in fact - the way it is talked about in the 2nd arc is that ALL the Gods are dead ... so does that mean EW killed Nergal before he could escape?


These are some of my issues with the title:

1) Pak makes you believe that Gilad has been living a simple, quiet life ever since 1877 when he was asked by the Earth and the Geomancer to kill the women and child. But we know that he has been very much active - from the 1st Unity team during WW1 to the Kennedy Assassination .. where he was killed by Jack Ruby and returned back to life by the Earth (even though he supposedly left the Earth's services)

2) In the A&A arc - EW is very much in the service of the Earth after Buck the Geomancer is killed. How did he go from forsaking the Earth (destroying the tree in the Pak story) to being its unquestioned champion in the A&A arc? How did that transformation back to dedication happen?

3) Speaking of Buck ... his last name as revealed in the Pak arc is McHenry. He has the same last name as Kay McHenry yet there has been nothing to indicate that they are related. I believe this was a mistake ... we know that FVL never intended for Buck and Kay to be related or coincidentally have the same last name.

4) Evidently ... Geomancer's are immortal? Buck lives for hundreds of years? Just another plot point that was never explained.

5) Mitu and Xaran ... immortal and existing for thousands of years as swords of the Houses he fights against ..and EW is unaware of this? I find that hard to believe. EW is hands on in the frontlines battling for the Earth against the other houses for thousands of years ... but Xaran and Mitu are simply manipulating events from the background?

6) As already mentioned ... the 1st arc ends with the mention of releasing Nergal 2000 years from now and the 2nd arc (that takes place in the future - close to the time of his supposed release) and it doesn't even go into this plot point. It was completely forgotten.

Too many forgotten plot points ... and inconsistencies

I really don't mean to rip on the book too much - I actually like Pak and liked some of the things he was trying to do with the character. On the surface, I enjoyed both arcs. Pak is a great storyteller and he is probably 2nd to Dysart in creating compelling characters that you care about. But it did fail in regards to continuity and needed better editorial oversight, IMO.

[Phoenix8008]

On FormerReader's point about 'The Big Battle 2000 Years From Now': Technically speaking, if it's assumed that if the first EW arc takes place in 2014, then the 'big battle' takes place in 4014. As far as I recall, the 2nd EW arc takes place in 4001... So the 'big battle' hasn't actually happened yet.

You may be correct. I'm not sure it stated exactly 2000 years. I guess my complaint is more so that all this background is laid out in the first arc as if it is leading to some momentous showdown in the second arc and that is the reason for the jump to the 4001 timeline. The second arc didn't tie into anything laid out in the first arc where it was implied it was going to.

+1

How does it make sense to build up this battle in 2000 years (where Nergal will be unleashed upon the world) only to completely ignore that plot point when you jump to 4001? This makes sense?

And in fact - the way it is talked about in the 2nd arc is that ALL the Gods are dead ... so does that mean EW killed Nergal before he could escape?


These are some of my issues with the title:

1) Pak makes you believe that Gilad has been living a simple, quiet life ever since 1877 when he was asked by the Earth and the Geomancer to kill the women and child. But we know that he has been very much active - from the 1st Unity team during WW1 to the Kennedy Assassination .. where he was killed by Jack Ruby and returned back to life by the Earth (even though he supposedly left the Earth's services)

2) In the A&A arc - EW is very much in the service of the Earth after Buck the Geomancer is killed. How did he go from forsaking the Earth (destroying the tree in the Pak story) to being its unquestioned champion in the A&A arc? How did that transformation back to dedication happen?

3) Speaking of Buck ... his last name as revealed in the Pak arc is McHenry. He has the same last name as Kay McHenry yet there has been nothing to indicate that they are related. I believe this was a mistake ... we know that FVL never intended for Buck and Kay to be related or coincidentally have the same last name.

4) Evidently ... Geomancer's are immortal? Buck lives for hundreds of years? Just another plot point that was never explained.

5) Mitu and Xaran ... immortal and existing for thousands of years as swords of the Houses he fights against ..and EW is unaware of this? I find that hard to believe. EW is hands on in the frontlines battling for the Earth against the other houses for thousands of years ... but Xaran and Mitu are simply manipulating events from the background?

6) As already mentioned ... the 1st arc ends with the mention of releasing Nergal 2000 years from now and the 2nd arc (that takes place in the future - close to the time of his supposed release) and it doesn't even go into this plot point. It was completely forgotten.

Too many forgotten plot points ... and inconsistencies

I really don't mean to rip on the book too much - I actually like Pak and liked some of the things he was trying to do with the character. On the surface, I enjoyed both arcs. Pak is a great storyteller and he is probably 2nd to Dysart in creating compelling characters that you care about. But it did fail in regards to continuity and needed better editorial oversight, IMO.

+1 to all that you and FormerReader have said. Those continuity issues are my biggest points of bother as well. The stories that got told are good, but the just didn't make SENSE as parts of the whole tapestry because those connective materials were never shown or explained enough.

[ShadowTuga]

I think the problem for me so far has been the first arc was building to this big battle that was supposed to take place 2000 years later. The second arc jumps 2000 years into the future and we have no continuation of the story. Why even tell the first arc then? The arcs did not connect together in my opinion and the way it was written they should have. Why jump to the 4001 year timeline at all? It didn't advance the story. I was expecting that Rai would be introduced in the second arc and this was the reason for the jump. As a reader it just felt like the writer had too much freedom to do what they wanted and no clear plan.

I think this is a book that can be easily fixed though. Give Gilad more of a back story. Have each arc focus on him throughout history showing how his decisions have impacted the VEI universe as we know it and use these stories to introduce new characters and build the universe. A WWII arc with the old Unity team would make a cool story. Stories with him and the Geomancers throughout time. This is what I want out of an Eteranl Warrior story.

This. Pretty much my opinion on the title. I was enjoying it, but the 2 arcs still felt way too disconnected and the reader is left with a whole lot of unanswered questions. In a bad way.
But, unlike VEI's Shadowman, Gilad is actually fun to read. I have no probs with the direction of the character (even gave VEI a "let's see what rolls from here" pass in some continuity "questions"), I just think that his solo book needs to find a focus when it gets back.

[nutflush76]

I really enjoyed both storylines. I was OK with the plot being abandoned in the second arc in order to have a little bit of Gilad's 4001 character being established. The one thing that did bother me though was his constant need to refer to himself as the Eternal Emperor.

It did bring up some questions though. If robots and technology are things of the past (sort of like a Mad Max type of feel I guess) then does Gilad have any idea of Rai's Japan? Does he know about it and is he trying to protect his granddaughter? It sure seemed as if he thought that she was bringing back long lost technology at the end of the second arc.

I would have liked at least one more arc to see where the narrative was headed.

[Phoenix8008]

I really enjoyed both storylines. I was OK with the plot being abandoned in the second arc in order to have a little bit of Gilad's 4001 character being established. The one thing that did bother me though was his constant need to refer to himself as the Eternal Emperor.

It did bring up some questions though. If robots and technology are things of the past (sort of like a Mad Max type of feel I guess) then does Gilad have any idea of Rai's Japan? Does he know about it and is he trying to protect his granddaughter? It sure seemed as if he thought that she was bringing back long lost technology at the end of the second arc.

I would have liked at least one more arc to see where the narrative was headed.

I don't think Gilad knows about it, at least based off the (fractured) continuity we've seen. In the A&A arc, Gilad couldn't find the Geomancer because Buck was kept flying in an airplane for a long time and not in contact with the earth for Gilad to be able to become aware of his location. Japan is up in orbit and therefore I'm betting Gilad has no knowledge of it.

[p-s manowar]

What eternal warrior needs is Robert Venditti and Cary Nord

[Shadowman99]

I really enjoyed both storylines. I was OK with the plot being abandoned in the second arc in order to have a little bit of Gilad's 4001 character being established. The one thing that did bother me though was his constant need to refer to himself as the Eternal Emperor.

It did bring up some questions though. If robots and technology are things of the past (sort of like a Mad Max type of feel I guess) then does Gilad have any idea of Rai's Japan? Does he know about it and is he trying to protect his granddaughter? It sure seemed as if he thought that she was bringing back long lost technology at the end of the second arc.

I would have liked at least one more arc to see where the narrative was headed.

I don't have a problem with his self reference as the Eternal Emporer. He's been around a darn long time, and is the leader of a group of people. Why not give yourself a title eh? How many famous characters in real life history gave themselves titles that the general populace adopted? Besides, perhaps there's a story in this that's yet to come out!

Again, the awareness of Japan thing is another interesting thing to mull over right now. It could be that he has no idea about Japan: It could be that he knows very well about Japan, having possibly lived through its construction and launch, which is precisely why he's trying to keep the Earth technology-free.

Whatever the case, we're lucky to still be in the early phase of the comic where we still have lots of unanswered questions and topics to speculate about

[lorddunlow]

This current discussion makes me rethink the "Los Angeles" sector in Japan. Maybe it's not a recreation of that area. Maybe the people of Earth had a cultural schism with some embracing technology and some shunning it. All that embraced it came together (literally) in Japan and launched themselves into orbit? The rest of the Earth became technophobes and destroyed all technology on Earth (or at least tried).

[BugsySig]

What eternal warrior needs is Robert Venditti and Cary Nord

Well...you're getting half of your wish.

New EW 3-issue mini by Cary Nord and....Peter Milligan

Here's hoping we don't get an End Times repeat catastrophe

[lorddunlow]

What eternal warrior needs is Robert Venditti and Cary Nord

Well...you're getting half of your wish.

New EW 3-issue mini by Cary Nord and....Peter Milligan

Here's hoping we don't get an End Times repeat catastrophe

Yeah, really. Totally let the wind out of my sails when I saw his name and the fact it was a 3-issue mini. PTSD, I suppose.

[leonmallett]

What eternal warrior needs is Robert Venditti and Cary Nord

Well...you're getting half of your wish.

New EW 3-issue mini by Cary Nord and....Peter Milligan

Here's hoping we don't get an End Times repeat catastrophe

[leonmallett]

What eternal warrior needs is Robert Venditti and Cary Nord

Well...you're getting half of your wish.

New EW 3-issue mini by Cary Nord and....Peter Milligan

Here's hoping we don't get an End Times repeat catastrophe

Yeah, really. Totally let the wind out of my sails when I saw his name and the fact it was a 3-issue mini. PTSD, I suppose.

VEI need to set up some post-End Times and post-Ming Doyle counselling methinks....