Bleeding Monk #0 discussion

[DirtbagSailor]

Just because.

DBS

[Phoenix8008]

Link to preview: http://www.comicbookresources.com/?page ... w&id=20608

Looks good to me.

[Keith]

Tease. Thought you had the inside scoop on an early review!

[BugsySig]

Fan-freakin-tastic.

Go out and read this right now.

That is all.

[Keith]

Yep... +1 x Infinity to what Bugsy said. Dysart is a genius. Only problem with the issue was that it had to end.

Still trying to wrap my noodle around it all.

[bygranddesign]

This issue was so powerful and thought provoking - This may be Josh's best written single issue of Harbinger.

This issue was a brilliant origin story, character study; and a remarkable spiritual journey.

In that moment that he was speared, I believe he entered into something similar to what Ivar experienced when he was trapped in the continua, he became one with all possibilities, living all moments simultaneously. His intentions still feel aloof to me ... he can see every possibility and therefore has now taken upon himself to guide the future into the way he sees fit. Very different mind set than the monk who once wanted to simply meditate into the nothingness. I think it would make sense if the Bleeding Monk and Ivar one day collide as both have a vast understanding of the future, time itself and all its possibilities but may have much more drastic views on how to shape these things.

The art was brilliant throughout. Great work from all the artists and the colorist. Loved the last two splash pages especially.

The only bad thing about this issue?

It was the first thing I read and I'm having a hard time getting motivated to read anything else including XO and Shadowman.

[greg]

Could our "Kyros", friend of Alexander the Great, have actually been someone who had survived from a couple centuries earlier?

Maybe this guy?

[Chiclo]

Could our "Kyros", friend of Alexander the Great, have actually been someone who had survived from a couple centuries earlier?

Maybe this guy?

Kyros just means "master". Cyrus could be a variation of Kyros.

[bygranddesign]

I had the same thought of looking up Kyros .. to see if he/the name had some historical significance or meaning

I found this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kyros_of_Constantinople" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

[dornwolf]

wasn't bad very Doctor Manhattan with the powers.

[pixierosa]

This is the best Valiant book I've read to date. Rich storytelling, effective and beautiful art.

The whole thing is stunning. I need to re-read it and see if I notice anything different, but it is both informative and non-spoilerish.

[BugsySig]

The biggest mystery for me is when the Monk says he was Kyros "before the body changed" (or something to that effect). How exactly did this happen/how does this work? Is it similar to Harada's changing appearance or a true physical change? This leaves open a lot of possibilities for the Monk possibly having taken on multiple appearances between his time as Kyros and his time as the Monk.

[bygranddesign]

The biggest mystery for me is when the Monk says he was Kyros "before the body changed" (or something to that effect). How exactly did this happen/how does this work? Is it similar to Harada's changing appearance or a true physical change? This leaves open a lot of possibilities for the Monk possibly having taken on multiple appearances between his time as Kyros and his time as the Monk.

I think his many, many years of long and deep meditation's (many times in the harsh elements) transformed him slowly over time. As time went on Kyros began looking more and more like his master - Lover of Wisdom.

When he goes to live among the monks in Mongolia - I think as time went on his deep meditations slowly transformed him into one of them as well.

[jmatt]

So, I'm assuming the monk had a way of activating Harbingers, the lantern-eyed, yes? Via meditation I suppose. I think we see Kyros activated when he first meditates with the Naked Lover of Wisdom (now, there's a title; I think that's my Cosplay act for the NYCC. )

Canon to date says that Harbingers are not born activated (with the exception of Pete, Darpan and Harada), their powers must be triggered with pain or experimentation. So a route via meditation has possibilities.

There's also some Harbinger (lantern-eye) foreshadowing with "Something must illuminate the path. Wisdom is a lantern, is it not, Master?"

I find it interesting that after all this time, Valiant chose him to be of Greek origin and not Asian. And then at some point he becomes Asian ("before your mind had changed your body itself"). An odd plot choice. He could easily have been an Asian philosopher caught in the winds of war that found his way to the Naked Lover of Wisdom.

[Jace]

Very interesting issue. The plot point that stuck with me the most was how the monk had spent so much of his life trying to think of nothing and simply to be, but then upon awakening when he is unearthed he has chosen to attempt to manipulate the future. It almost seems as though he has become "unenlightened" so to speak. So is he a villain? Can't wait to take to Josh D at Wondercon!

[pixierosa]

I find it interesting that after all this time, Valiant chose him to be of Greek origin and not Asian. And then at some point he becomes Asian ("before your mind had changed your body itself"). An odd plot choice. He could easily have been an Asian philosopher caught in the winds of war that found his way to the Naked Lover of Wisdom.

He was always depicted with blue eyes, and I seem to remember that causing some discussion as to who he really was. Now we know.

I'm waiting for the onslaught of "Lover of Naked Wisdom" jokes. It's not that far of a stretch.

[hunter_peterson]

Very interesting issue. The plot point that stuck with me the most was how the monk had spent so much of his life trying to think of nothing and simply to be, but then upon awakening when he is unearthed he has chosen to attempt to manipulate the future. It almost seems as though he has become "unenlightened" so to speak. So is he a villain? Can't wait to take to Josh D at Wondercon!

I think that he was nihilist at first in the typical Buddhist way- life is suffering so we free ourselves from it by separating our souls from the pain of the world through spiritual development and reincarnation. He was denied reincarnation due to his powers (which seem to be essentially super-meditation that allows him to transcend all limitations). And he experienced all of he possible futures up until the 4001 era, if I numbered correctly, so he realised that suffering can vary in both its shape and consequence.

So he tries to make the world the best version of itself while he is still alive, as opposed to over multiple lifetimes. Either that or he's manipulating events so as to commit an extremely drawn-out suicide. It's wonderfully hard to tell.

Also, Harada said that psiots can only be activated by pain or direct neurological stimulation, but BM knows that hits isn't true. Psiots can activate their powers through meditation non-lethally. Was Harada lying? Did BM withhold this information from him? In either case, it seems that the speed of activation is necessary for their plans, as I imagine meditation for years is not a quick way of activating your world-shaping army. Fascinating interplay of agendas on show here.

Loved this issue! Simply breathtakingly good.

[lorddunlow]

Well, Shadowman #0/10 have officially been unseated as the best VEI story told to date. This was so awesome. The Bleeding Monk has been my favorite character since Harbinger #1. His origin is beyond my wildest speculation. So freaking awesome!

I cannot wait to see what he brings in the further issues.

I, too, would love to see an interchange of philosophy between the Bleeding Monk and Ivar. I bet they see thing very differently. Also, it would be almost impossible for the two not to know of one another from their knowledge of all time. I wouldn't be surprised if a secondary battle broke out between factions following Ivar and those following the Monk.

[BugsySig]

Well, Shadowman #0/10 have officially been unseated as the best VEI story told to date. This was so awesome. The Bleeding Monk has been my favorite character since Harbinger #1. His origin is beyond my wildest speculation. So freaking awesome!

I cannot wait to see what he brings in the further issues.

I, too, would love to see an interchange of philosophy between the Bleeding Monk and Ivar. I bet they see thing very differently. Also, it would be almost impossible for the two not to know of one another from their knowledge of all time. I wouldn't be surprised if a secondary battle broke out between factions following Ivar and those following the Monk.

Definite potential for a major rivalry between the two. It would be very cool to have the next event after Armor Hunters involve the timestream and include Ivar, Bleeding Monk, Rai, 4001, The Immortal Brothers, WWII Unity, past/future Shadowmen, etc.

[apainter]

This wasn't what I was expecting. Pixierosa floated a theory that the Monk was behind things like Livewire's (first) betrayal of Harada and the vision of Joe that lead Pete away from the Foundation. I liked that theory so much that I want to see it in print, and thought this special was the perfect place to do it.

Anyway, I liked the issue. The only complaint I have is that I loved the current storyline and don't like it being put on hold for a month.

Art

[agent_graves]

At the end of "Harbinger: Bleeding Monk" #0, readers are left to ponder their own existence. Have they just read a comic or merely thought they read a comic while thinking about a comic book being read?*

My feelings exactly, to many riddles in the narrative, the story covers many era's, but it just didn't gel well for me, maybe upon second reading, but I'm not reading Harbinger anymore so...

*Cbr review

[xodacia81]

Well, Shadowman #0/10 have officially been unseated as the best VEI story told to date. This was so awesome. The Bleeding Monk has been my favorite character since Harbinger #1. His origin is beyond my wildest speculation. So freaking awesome!

I cannot wait to see what he brings in the further issues.

I, too, would love to see an interchange of philosophy between the Bleeding Monk and Ivar. I bet they see thing very differently. Also, it would be almost impossible for the two not to know of one another from their knowledge of all time. I wouldn't be surprised if a secondary battle broke out between factions following Ivar and those following the Monk.

Definite potential for a major rivalry between the two. It would be very cool to have the next event after Armor Hunters involve the timestream and include Ivar, Bleeding Monk, Rai, 4001, The Immortal Brothers, WWII Unity, past/future Shadowmen, etc.

I'm down for that.

[lorddunlow]

Well, Shadowman #0/10 have officially been unseated as the best VEI story told to date. This was so awesome. The Bleeding Monk has been my favorite character since Harbinger #1. His origin is beyond my wildest speculation. So freaking awesome!

I cannot wait to see what he brings in the further issues.

I, too, would love to see an interchange of philosophy between the Bleeding Monk and Ivar. I bet they see thing very differently. Also, it would be almost impossible for the two not to know of one another from their knowledge of all time. I wouldn't be surprised if a secondary battle broke out between factions following Ivar and those following the Monk.

Definite potential for a major rivalry between the two. It would be very cool to have the next event after Armor Hunters involve the timestream and include Ivar, Bleeding Monk, Rai, 4001, The Immortal Brothers, WWII Unity, past/future Shadowmen, etc.

This is exactly what I was envisioning.

[SJS4]

I enjoyed the issue, but wasn't really blown away. I am glad to have learned more about the Monk's history, and it was a lot more deep than i expected.

Still, i am mainly interested in the character only in as much as it effects the renegades, so that is the "payoff" i am looking forward to.

[Brother Darque]

Valiant needs to make a Bleeding Monk statue that has a running fake blood fountain from the monks chest.

like the Kiss blood fountain.