Valiantcomics.com vs. Overstreet

[shaxper]

I just saw the new Overstreet Guide today and was a little amazed that Valiant prices didn't go up this year. There's still a huge discrepancy between the Valiantcomics.com price guide and the Overstreet.

So, this leaves me with a two part question (aren't they all?):


1. Why the discrepancy? Is it because Overstreet isn't monitoring ebay? Is Harbinger #0 still fetching only $20 at conventions and stores? Or is there some other difference between the two guides' sources that I don't know of.

2. Since guides set prices as well as report them, which source has more influence over the asking price of these titles?

As one of many fans, who's waiting for a Valiant comeback in the market (whether or not we ever see one), it's troublesome to see Overstreet listing issues for half or less of what VC.com says. Which one is a better reflection of the market? I'd always assumed, with the increased interest in Valiant over the past year or so, that the last Overstreet Guide had simply been published too early to reflect the change.

[greg]

http://www.valiantcomics.com/valiant/ov ... tiples.asp

ValiantComics.com price guide values reflect Ebay auction averages
for near mint books sold individually including shipping costs.

[shaxper]

Ah, that's very helpful. You've thought of everything on this site, haven't you?


Incidentally, how do you track every ebay auction? It must be time consuming.

[cinlach@aol.com]

i'd be willing to bet that 99% of the stores and dealers use the overstreet price guide when pricing valiant books. which is fine with me...that means better deals when i buy.
their loss.

[wrunow]

I cleaned a LCS out of pre unity stuff a few weeks ago, nothing had prices and the owner charged me 50-75% of overstreet because no one had bought any VALIANTS at the shop in years. Just stood there and read something while he looked the books up for 15 minutes or so. Got and X-O gold for $2 in the bunch.

[DawgPhan]

I just saw the new Overstreet Guide today and was a little amazed that Valiant prices didn't go up this year. There's still a huge discrepancy between the Valiantcomics.com price guide and the Overstreet.

So, this leaves me with a two part question (aren't they all?):


1. Why the discrepancy? Is it because Overstreet isn't monitoring ebay? Is Harbinger #0 still fetching only $20 at conventions and stores? Or is there some other difference between the two guides' sources that I don't know of.

2. Since guides set prices as well as report them, which source has more influence over the asking price of these titles?

As one of many fans, who's waiting for a Valiant comeback in the market (whether or not we ever see one), it's troublesome to see Overstreet listing issues for half or less of what VC.com says. Which one is a better reflection of the market? I'd always assumed, with the increased interest in Valiant over the past year or so, that the last Overstreet Guide had simply been published too early to reflect the change.

I would not hold my breath on the valiant comeback...as much as we would like to see it there are people would dont want it to happen.
One. Why would anyone put money up for a comic book company right now...
Two. I think that ZWH said it best....There are no NEW fans joining the fold. If there was still a comic being published or something like that you might expect it, but with out new people you are looking at the collectors. I mean there are probably only 200-300 diehard valiant fans out there..People currently buying/reading/collecting valiants...

As for OS v VC..they are both just guides...take them with a grain of salt. I would say that OC has more influence since it is used by more people...also $20 for harbinger pink is not that big a deal...it is when OS has CEAR listed at like $3 and it sells for around 80-100...of course OS has always had problems with books that are not heavily traded...I think that Albeido #2 is a great example of this...(Did I spell that right?)

[x-omatic]

It is really a simple answer.

Use Overstreet when buying.

Use Gregs when selling.

[ZephyrWasHOT!!]

1. Why the discrepancy? Is it because Overstreet isn't monitoring ebay? Is Harbinger #0 still fetching only $20 at conventions and stores? Or is there some other difference between the two guides' sources that I don't know of.

You and I and everyone who deals with back issue comics in any way HAVE to understand that Overstreet prices are dictated, as they have been from day 1, by people who HAVE the books and wish to SELL them, not by actual market conditions. Therefore, it would be a conflict of interest to the advisors to Overstreet to report that a comic (ANY comic) that they have and wish to sell is worth LESS than it was last year....and only when Overstreet is hit over the head by the cold harsh light of reality does it reflect anything DOWN. That's why New Mutants #87 was a $65 book well into the middle 90's, when it had lost steam right around mid-93.

As well, if they don't have it to SELL...they don't report anything about it, and prices that took YEARS to come down will take years to go back up.

No one HAS Valiant (for the most part) to sell, so no one (as far as Overstreet is concerned) cares.

Arnold may just be the only staff member who actually gives a rats *SQUEE* about actual market conditions.

2. Since guides set prices as well as report them, which source has more influence over the asking price of these titles?

Anyone who KNOWS VC.com understands that VC.com is an intellectually honest attempt to reflect market conditions AS THEY EXIST, not as one, two, or a group of people WISH it to exist. Unfortunately, VC.com is very much still a 'niche' site, a site I didn't discover until 2003 (and I've been buying Valiant since Day 3, and had done a large deal [uncompleted] with Joe Petrilak in late 99-early 00.) Therefore, the amount of people 'in the know' is going to still be relatively small until there's more press in the 'traditional' press sources (CBG, Wizard, etc.) And god help Greg's bandwidth when/if that happens.

As one of many fans, who's waiting for a Valiant comeback in the market (whether or not we ever see one), it's troublesome to see Overstreet listing issues for half or less of what VC.com says. Which one is a better reflection of the market? I'd always assumed, with the increased interest in Valiant over the past year or so, that the last Overstreet Guide had simply been published too early to reflect the change.

No. Please do understand that Overstreet is, essentially, self-serving: it exists to serve those people who advertise in it. While that may sound crass and short-sighted, it is very much true, and has been the 'insider joke' for the better part of 30 years. It's a great guide, and has done MUCH for the industry....but not out of any sense of altruism or economic honesty. It will never reflect actual (or even close to) market conditions for much of anything (as shown by the millions of comics sold every year for 20%...30%....50% of Guide...if they were WORTH what it says in the GUIDE....they'd sell for 100%, or right around that....right?)

And what's worse is that we've conditioned ourselves into BELIEVING that Overstreet is 'what it's actually worth, retail' so much that the guide ends up SETTING prices intead of merely reporting them. Hell, even Greg fell into that trap originally (and for several years) listing the 'value' of Valiants at about double their current market values, I would assume reasoning that 'hey, it's what Overstreet's done for decades, it's expected...right?' Thank god he changed that last year.


I love Overstreet, I wait patiently by the door of my LCS each April (even if I haven't bought a single new comic that year) and get it....but, I always keep the above firmly in the back of my mind. It's important stuff to know....

[willyt]

haxper
Speedshot - Level 1



Joined: 12 May 2004
Posts: 8
Location: Lakewood, OH
Posted: Mon May 17, 2004 10:46 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ah, that's very helpful. You've thought of everything on this site, haven't you?


Incidentally, how do you track every ebay auction? It must be time consuming.

YA GREG I WAS WONDERING THAT TOO, HOW DO YOU GET INFO LIKE THAT. I WAS WANTING TO DO THAT FOR MY OWN CURIOUSITIES?

[whetteon]

haxper
Speedshot - Level 1



Joined: 12 May 2004
Posts: 8
Location: Lakewood, OH
Posted: Mon May 17, 2004 10:46 pm Post subject:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Ah, that's very helpful. You've thought of everything on this site, haven't you?


Incidentally, how do you track every ebay auction? It must be time consuming.

YA GREG I WAS WONDERING THAT TOO, HOW DO YOU GET INFO LIKE THAT. I WAS WANTING TO DO THAT FOR MY OWN CURIOUSITIES?

It's rather easy. I've been traking all premium issues since April and while it takes about 30mins out of my day to do so, it's a labor of love. pm me with your email address if you would like to see the list. I don't claim it's 100% accurate as I've undoubtly miss alot of premiums that have sold but you get what you paid for

I assume someone else can easily keep track of the CGC comics but I personally find the CGCed ones unworthy of my time. I also started keeping track of sets that have been sold on Ebay because they've been hitting some new highs.

The point is you can keep track of sales if you care enough to try.

[greg]

I track the completed auctions on Ebay by hand...
it's time-consuming but it's different each time,
since there's no way to predict what will be sold
week-to-week, or how much it will sell (or not sell) for.

I created a "scratch pad" that lists the important & semi-important books
in columns, using my little "shorthand" codes.
("a0g" means Archer & Armstrong #0 Gold, etc.)

As a 'database-guy', I created several process shortcuts that make the
price guide updates more of an automated program than they used to be...
and the only "time-consuming part" is compiling the sales (which is still fun).

[shaxper]

Wow.

That's an astonishing amount of work. I'd always been under the assumption that after creating such a comprehensive, content filled web-site, you'd kick back and take it easy for a change.

[COMICKINGS]

1. Why the discrepancy? Is it because Overstreet isn't monitoring ebay? Is Harbinger #0 still fetching only $20 at conventions and stores? Or is there some other difference between the two guides' sources that I don't know of.

You and I and everyone who deals with back issue comics in any way HAVE to understand that Overstreet prices are dictated, as they have been from day 1, by people who HAVE the books and wish to SELL them, not by actual market conditions. Therefore, it would be a conflict of interest to the advisors to Overstreet to report that a comic (ANY comic) that they have and wish to sell is worth LESS than it was last year....and only when Overstreet is hit over the head by the cold harsh light of reality does it reflect anything DOWN. That's why New Mutants #87 was a $65 book well into the middle 90's, when it had lost steam right around mid-93.

As well, if they don't have it to SELL...they don't report anything about it, and prices that took YEARS to come down will take years to go back up.

No one HAS Valiant (for the most part) to sell, so no one (as far as Overstreet is concerned) cares.

Arnold may just be the only staff member who actually gives a rats *SQUEE* about actual market conditions.

2. Since guides set prices as well as report them, which source has more influence over the asking price of these titles?

Anyone who KNOWS VC.com understands that VC.com is an intellectually honest attempt to reflect market conditions AS THEY EXIST, not as one, two, or a group of people WISH it to exist. Unfortunately, VC.com is very much still a 'niche' site, a site I didn't discover until 2003 (and I've been buying Valiant since Day 3, and had done a large deal [uncompleted] with Joe Petrilak in late 99-early 00.) Therefore, the amount of people 'in the know' is going to still be relatively small until there's more press in the 'traditional' press sources (CBG, Wizard, etc.) And god help Greg's bandwidth when/if that happens.

As one of many fans, who's waiting for a Valiant comeback in the market (whether or not we ever see one), it's troublesome to see Overstreet listing issues for half or less of what VC.com says. Which one is a better reflection of the market? I'd always assumed, with the increased interest in Valiant over the past year or so, that the last Overstreet Guide had simply been published too early to reflect the change.

No. Please do understand that Overstreet is, essentially, self-serving: it exists to serve those people who advertise in it. While that may sound crass and short-sighted, it is very much true, and has been the 'insider joke' for the better part of 30 years. It's a great guide, and has done MUCH for the industry....but not out of any sense of altruism or economic honesty. It will never reflect actual (or even close to) market conditions for much of anything (as shown by the millions of comics sold every year for 20%...30%....50% of Guide...if they were WORTH what it says in the GUIDE....they'd sell for 100%, or right around that....right?)

And what's worse is that we've conditioned ourselves into BELIEVING that Overstreet is 'what it's actually worth, retail' so much that the guide ends up SETTING prices intead of merely reporting them. Hell, even Greg fell into that trap originally (and for several years) listing the 'value' of Valiants at about double their current market values, I would assume reasoning that 'hey, it's what Overstreet's done for decades, it's expected...right?' Thank god he changed that last year.


I love Overstreet, I wait patiently by the door of my LCS each April (even if I haven't bought a single new comic that year) and get it....but, I always keep the above firmly in the back of my mind. It's important stuff to know....

Awesome post! Hit Overstreet right (over) on the head!