The Official Armor Hunters as a Whole Thread

[KXXX]

Someone asked for it, and now everyone has it! Whether they like it or not!

I will not lie, overall I am just a bit underwhelmed. The first month of books was strong, but realizing that it will all basically be over this month is disappointing. It feels like the crossover as a whole is picking up some steam (despite some turds, like Unity #10) and the idea that it all comes to a close this month stinks. I think it's more the 'decompressed' story-telling people keep referring to. Basically, I want more.

Now don't get me wrong, this crossover has brought lasting change, much more so than Harbinger Wars. However, the idea that this takes place over, like, a day while taking four months to tell is bothersome. I would have preferred more events over a longer period. It's like watching anime, although anticipating the deaths of the remaining hunters smashed into one month of books is a lot less so.

So as far as the individual books....

I still have so many questions about XO and the tale of the Hunters, the most burning of which is the role of humanity in the Valiant universe.

Seriously.

Rebo and Malgam appear to be very human, and the hunters make mention of having never heard of The Vine, presumably with the combined knowledge of all the hunters. The hunters themselves seem to be made up of many different races and I believe Rebo and Malgam may even be from different planets.

So...

... this leads me to believe that Earth and the Vine are occupying a slice of galaxy very, VERY far away from everything else. So how and why are we so far away and different from these other humans whose homeworlds are part of some structure, however loose, consisting of enough worlds to provide for the many different races seen so far?

There's not much for me to say about the main book. I like it and being that it's the backbone of the event I can't complain about anything.

The AH Harbinger issues are decent, and I'm happy to have Torque continuing to be seen. I'm a little disappointed that the story basically consists of them fighting one of possibly many biological weapons of the hunters, which feels too much like a side-story being so far removed from the rest of the action.

Unity feels a little bit the same, but more so because of the stuff that gets rehashed. I did not like the GIN-GR issue very much as it was a short read and goofy.

My favorite of the last three is Bloodshot. This mini is far enough away from the action to be enjoyable as it's own story, yet close enough it doesn't feel like it has no impact.

[ShadowTuga]

Is it just me or the line "our logs show the human's planet of origin as Earth" is indicative that there are more human species out there in the Universe? I mean, if it was only "us", they would already have deducted Aric's original planet, right? Just by knowing he was human?

I didn't read old Valiant, save for the first issues of Shadowman and the Harbinger hardcover, so I don't know if there were "human aliens" before.

I asked this question exactly, 2 years and 4 days ago, it was about X-O#4.
The last issues seem to be the answer that I didn't get back then.

But the point is, the idea of Human Aliens may have been set in stone from the beginning. Reebo and Malgam are human, I am 99% sure.

[KXXX]

Is it just me or the line "our logs show the human's planet of origin as Earth" is indicative that there are more human species out there in the Universe? I mean, if it was only "us", they would already have deducted Aric's original planet, right? Just by knowing he was human?

I didn't read old Valiant, save for the first issues of Shadowman and the Harbinger hardcover, so I don't know if there were "human aliens" before.

I asked this question exactly, 2 years and 4 days ago, it was about X-O#4.
The last issues seem to be the answer that I didn't get back then.

But the point is, the idea of Human Aliens may have been set in stone from the beginning. Reebo and Malgam are human, I am 99% sure.

Good catch two years ago! I didn't even blink when I read that issue.

[ShadowTuga]

Is it just me or the line "our logs show the human's planet of origin as Earth" is indicative that there are more human species out there in the Universe? I mean, if it was only "us", they would already have deducted Aric's original planet, right? Just by knowing he was human?

I didn't read old Valiant, save for the first issues of Shadowman and the Harbinger hardcover, so I don't know if there were "human aliens" before.

I asked this question exactly, 2 years and 4 days ago, it was about X-O#4.
The last issues seem to be the answer that I didn't get back then.

But the point is, the idea of Human Aliens may have been set in stone from the beginning. Reebo and Malgam are human, I am 99% sure.

Good catch two years ago! I didn't even blink when I read that issue.

And some say reading Bat-books doesnt' pay...

And about you not liking Unity 10-
KXXXX, BRO, C'MON: What about some GIN-GR Mayhem with "Spacelord Mudafugga" as the backnoise?

[KXXX]

Is it just me or the line "our logs show the human's planet of origin as Earth" is indicative that there are more human species out there in the Universe? I mean, if it was only "us", they would already have deducted Aric's original planet, right? Just by knowing he was human?

I didn't read old Valiant, save for the first issues of Shadowman and the Harbinger hardcover, so I don't know if there were "human aliens" before.

I asked this question exactly, 2 years and 4 days ago, it was about X-O#4.
The last issues seem to be the answer that I didn't get back then.

But the point is, the idea of Human Aliens may have been set in stone from the beginning. Reebo and Malgam are human, I am 99% sure.

Good catch two years ago! I didn't even blink when I read that issue.

And some say reading Bat-books doesnt' pay...

And about you not liking Unity 10-
KXXXX, BRO, C'MON: What about some GIN-GR Mayhem with "Spacelord Mudafugga" as the backnoise?

This is quickly becoming to KXXX and ShadowTuga Awesome Metal *SQUEE* Festival thread

I just didn't like it. Technorganic life was cool for the armor, we didn't need it for the giant robots. Everyone is inside of that thing. Just hanging out. It's weird.

[BugsySig]

I think the tie in issues and minis have been very well done. Compared with other events, VEI has really interwoven the titles well.

XO and Harbinger, while not integral to the main story, establish the background and long reaching consequences of the event, respectively.

Bloodshot and Unity are more directly interwoven into the main story. Bloodshot in particular has been excellent. Unity, while the weakest in terms of story thus far, has allowed for some added characterization for characters without their own ongoing titles: Gilad, Nijak and Livewire.

The main story has been a bit of a let down. While well written and drawn, and including some massive, world-changing events, there has still been no interaction between the Armor Hunters and Aric. That should really be at the heart of the entire event, and leaving one issue to do so does not seem sufficient.

Overall, I'd give it an 8.5/10. A solid B. If Aric was more directly involved and Unity were a little better, it would easily be an A+.

[lorddunlow]

Everyone is inside of that thing. Just hanging out. It's weird.

I keep thinking the cockpit might be the uterus which would make the entry... you know...

[KXXX]

[bygranddesign]

There is still a huge portion of the story still to go .. I'm not sure how anyone can judge it as a whole at this point

But up to this point ... its been superior to Harbinger Wars which was well written but truly underwhelming as it was not an actual WAR. More like a significant skirmish.

This is truly epic in scale ... and the Aric verse Armor Hunters is obviously going to happen in the final showdown. The final act is usually when the main hero has his epic clash with the main "villains".

The only title a bit underwhelming in the crossover is the Bloodshot. And thats mainly because of the art. Hairsine Art is either brilliant or it looks like he is mailing it in. And although its had some cool story moments - it feels a bit like a generic action flick.

I also had some issues with Unity in the crossover. Livewire choosing to end her life if she thought she was infected - felt heavy handed and silly.

But the main story ... and the XO backstory have completely lived up to the hype, IMO. Its been truly EPIC and world changing with fantastic art and some of Vditti's best writing.

The Dysart issues are really interesting and fun ... I appreciate him telling a side story that shows the fallout from a grounded level. Plus he is really planting some interesting ideas and seeds into this story that I think will have long lasting ramifications.

I agree with Bugsy's 8.5/10 so far ... but a huge part of the grade is how they end it and there are I think 4 more issues PLUS Aftermath to go - plenty of more story to dig into!

[Keith]

Right now, I'm loving Armor Hunters. Do I think it's the perfect example of a crossover? No. But is it pretty damn good? Hellz yes.

Top of the list is the main mini-series and all the "big scenes" in it. Mexico City, the Hounds assault, GIN-GR pancaking Los Angeles... fantastic! Same with Harbinger Wars, you really aren't missing anything if you just read that title alone. That being said, I also wish to see Aric engage the Hunter's, and expect that will be in the next issue. Hopefully a slobberknocker will ensue, but I'm worried that there will be a lot of ground to cover in just one issue and everything will be compressed because of it. I wonder if that is the reason why they added the Aftermath issue. The final issue of AH will show the cataclysmic battle, and all the fallout type items are then moved into the Aftermath issue.

My next favorite part has been the Harbinger mini-series. Dysart has knocked this one out of the park, far as I'm concerned. For those that are arguing that this title doesn't have anything to do with the main AH story, I disagree. Sure, it doesn't tie in directly, but at the same time the menace the kids are fighting is a direct result of that storyline... especially after reading issue #3. I get the sense (and I hope I'm right) that much of what he has setup here with gen Zero, Faith & Torque, and the mysterious baby psiot, will now be carried over to the Harbinger: Omega minis.

X-O is next on the list... love the origin story of the Hunters. I agree with what others have been asking... "How come we have never seen what the armors are supposedly doing to these planets?" And I'm leaning less towards thinking that Reebo and Malgam are humans. Frankly, I'm not even sure it's a big deal if they are or aren't.

Unity has been mostly ok. Feels "filler-ish" in some ways. I'm ready to get past AH and get Unity back on track with Kindt's plans for the book. And GIN-GR get's my vote for the new teammate. A giant robot joining the team makes my inner 5 year old giddy.

Biggest disappointment of the bunch has been the Bloodshot mini. While I am ok with how Bloodshot and other characters have been portrayed (great use of his abilities!!), and also ok with the story of him fighting Malgam and Lilt at MERO, I just feel that there has been a severe disconnect on this mini from the rest of the AH story. Continuity has been tossed out the window, things are happening that contradict what we've seen in other titles, so I have to ask why editorial is not stepping in and fixing them? Example: In the main title, we see that Livewire is just coming from seeing Malgam the first time when the Hunters launch the Hounds, and Capshaw instructs her to lock herself away. But in the Bloodshot series, Livewire is already locked away way before the Hounds get launched. I tried to synch up the Bloodshot issues vs. the rest of the story... it doesn't work.

[KXXX]

There is still a huge portion of the story still to go .. I'm not sure how anyone can judge it as a whole at this point

Someone in another thread mentioned having a thread dedicated to the whole crossover. I was hoping this would serve that purpose. I don't feel like there's a ton of story left, just the resolution to what are almost separate arcs (XO and Harby) and a few issues focusing on the main event which may or may not be parallel.

But up to this point ... its been superior to Harbinger Wars which was well written but truly underwhelming as it was not an actual WAR. More like a significant skirmish.

Yes, agreed. Worst thing about Harbinger Wars was a lack of lasting, real-world consequences. Between Omegas and this, the Valiant earth isn't likely to change.

This is truly epic in scale ... and the Aric verse Armor Hunters is obviously going to happen in the final showdown. The final act is usually when the main hero has his epic clash with the main "villains".

We hope so, to be sure. I don't think I'm alone in having hoped, from the outset, this would be a clash of giants (XO vs Hunters) with everyone else caught helplessly in the middle.

The only title a bit underwhelming in the crossover is the Bloodshot. And thats mainly because of the art. Hairsine Art is either brilliant or it looks like he is mailing it in. And although its had some cool story moments - it feels a bit like a generic action flick.

To each his own. I can definitely understand your view on Hairsine, I think his style has been very fitting for certain arcs (prelude to Planet Death) and books, but I don't think Bloodshot is one of them. I'm enjoying it as a good side-story.

I also had some issues with Unity in the crossover. Livewire choosing to end her life if she thought she was infected - felt heavy handed and silly.

You know, I had forgotten about that. Absolutely agree.

But the main story ... and the XO backstory have completely lived up to the hype, IMO. Its been truly EPIC and world changing with fantastic art and some of Vditti's best writing.

Agreed to an extent. I was expecting a little more here, but I'm not disappointed. The backstory was unexpected but welcomed for me.

The Dysart issues are really interesting and fun ... I appreciate him telling a side story that shows the fallout from a grounded level. Plus he is really planting some interesting ideas and seeds into this story that I think will have long lasting ramifications.

Ditto, for the most part. Most excited Torque is still in the picture.

I agree with Bugsy's 8.5/10 so far ... but a huge part of the grade is how they end it and there are I think 4 more issues PLUS Aftermath to go - plenty of more story to dig into!

I just don't see it as four more issues as only a couple are of the main event. I suppose it's a good thing, but I want MORE!

[Sven the Returned]

Is it just me or the line "our logs show the human's planet of origin as Earth" is indicative that there are more human species out there in the Universe? I mean, if it was only "us", they would already have deducted Aric's original planet, right? Just by knowing he was human?

I didn't read old Valiant, save for the first issues of Shadowman and the Harbinger hardcover, so I don't know if there were "human aliens" before.

I asked this question exactly, 2 years and 4 days ago, it was about X-O#4.
The last issues seem to be the answer that I didn't get back then.

But the point is, the idea of Human Aliens may have been set in stone from the beginning. Reebo and Malgam are human, I am 99% sure.

Reebo and Malgam are Sebaceans.

[JonesyAZ]

So I reread the entire AH event from "Prelude..." to AH Harby 3 yesterday and barring a few editorial mishaps, I really, really enjoyed it. A lot. It truly is an epic and enjoyable read. I can't wait to have the last five books in my hands and see how everything wraps up.

[lorddunlow]

Is it just me or the line "our logs show the human's planet of origin as Earth" is indicative that there are more human species out there in the Universe? I mean, if it was only "us", they would already have deducted Aric's original planet, right? Just by knowing he was human?

I didn't read old Valiant, save for the first issues of Shadowman and the Harbinger hardcover, so I don't know if there were "human aliens" before.

I asked this question exactly, 2 years and 4 days ago, it was about X-O#4.
The last issues seem to be the answer that I didn't get back then.

But the point is, the idea of Human Aliens may have been set in stone from the beginning. Reebo and Malgam are human, I am 99% sure.

Reebo and Malgam are Sebaceans.

[ShadowTuga]

Is it just me or the line "our logs show the human's planet of origin as Earth" is indicative that there are more human species out there in the Universe? I mean, if it was only "us", they would already have deducted Aric's original planet, right? Just by knowing he was human?

I didn't read old Valiant, save for the first issues of Shadowman and the Harbinger hardcover, so I don't know if there were "human aliens" before.

I asked this question exactly, 2 years and 4 days ago, it was about X-O#4.
The last issues seem to be the answer that I didn't get back then.

But the point is, the idea of Human Aliens may have been set in stone from the beginning. Reebo and Malgam are human, I am 99% sure.

Reebo and Malgam are Sebaceans.

[Domixt]

I was going to do a reread before the final release on Wednesday. Anyone figured out a good reading order yet?

This is what I'm going with:

X-O Manowar 23,24,25
X-O Manowar 26-28

Armour Hunters 1
Unity 8
Armour Hunters 2
Unity 9

AH: Bloodshot 1-3
AH: Harbinger 1-3

Armour Hunters 3
Unity 10-11

For some reason I don't want to split the limited series....

Dom

[comicsyte95]

Is it just me or the line "our logs show the human's planet of origin as Earth" is indicative that there are more human species out there in the Universe? I mean, if it was only "us", they would already have deducted Aric's original planet, right? Just by knowing he was human?

I didn't read old Valiant, save for the first issues of Shadowman and the Harbinger hardcover, so I don't know if there were "human aliens" before.

I asked this question exactly, 2 years and 4 days ago, it was about X-O#4.
The last issues seem to be the answer that I didn't get back then.

But the point is, the idea of Human Aliens may have been set in stone from the beginning. Reebo and Malgam are human, I am 99% sure.

Reebo and Malgam are Sebaceans.

[Aomalle27]

With the completion of the AH event, I think in the broad scope it was a failure. While it did have several great issues, the climax of the AH engagement was just plain awful. There was a monumental build up, and what we were left with was a quick knockout. A one rounder. Perhaps having the 18 issue parameter was limiting, but AH Bloodshot, Unity #11, and AH #4 all fel flat for me. Interesting plotlines, and charCter developments were just thrown in the wind with those 3 issues. What we were left with was; 1) Ninjak is some sort of clairvoyant, techno genius, stockpiling weapons for every possible scenario, 2) Eternal Warrior is now Superman, able to be cast miles from the sky into a concrete building, was emerge without a scratch 3) Bloodshot no longer hs the limitations and weaknesses hes displayed in his own title (he was burnt to a crisp, yet magically healed right away, that wasnt possible for him during Harbinger Wars) 4) livewire is now pretty much a God, able to hack into everything and anything 5) the Vei universe s a whole is unaware of the AH event, or just plain uninterested, Why didnt Harada get involved? Where were A&A? Wouldnt the distraction be of benefit to someone like Master Darque? etc 6) What started off as a great way to segue into a galaxy of possibilities was basically squandered with AH completion 7) Alot more questions then answers, just a few, what happened to the other Armor Hunters teams, the command post? The other armors? I just feel that the story had so many pluses like the Reebo/Malgam backstory, and the assemblage of the AH teams, but with the last 3 issues of the arc, it just came down to, well Earth wins, just because. Too convenient solutions, weak confrontation between the antagonists and our heroes (I mean Quartz, and Helix were dispatched in a single page?!) Add to that the inflation of our heroes abilities to near infinite capabilities, and you end up with a run of the mill big 2 event, versus something epic memorable and untimately worthwhile like Crisis on Infinite, or the original Unity event from VH1.

[jmatt]

the climax of the AH engagement was just plain awful. There was a monumental build up, and what we were left with was a quick knockout. A one rounder. ... weak confrontation between the antagonists and our heroes (I mean Quartz, and Helix were dispatched in a single page?!)

I can't agree with the assessment of awful, I very much enjoyed the event. But I do agree that it wrapped up lickedy split for the remaining Hunters.

But to counter, we saw the battle against Gin-GR spread across many issues, from Livewire's ruse to Ninjak's drone killers to Aric's downing her(?) with 'jak's aircraft.

The victory over the insect swarm was spread across two issues, too. And Malgam's capture and story was spread across the entire event.

Lilt's demise took two issues.

One big gripe I have is the way the entire solution to the core of the problem (the armor as virus) was dealt with so briefly and off-handed by Livewire. We never even saw the moment she refers to when she "turned off the armor's desire to spawn".

That in itself should have been half an issue or more, where we see her mentally probing the armor's psyche, finding cool nuggets of backstory and eventually persuading the armor to let go of that desire.

[jmatt]

Power-set takeways from the event:

Livewire is overpowered. She seems to be the answer to half of everything in this corner of the universe.

Ninjak's technology is overly convenient. We don't even know what Helix is and he liquidates her with magic bolos.

EW and the skyscraper thing. I hope we don't see much more of that, too indestructable.

And for a book about Armor Hunters, Aric was under-utilized. I'll have to reread to check if that's a fair statement, he did fight the Hounds.


Awesomeness:

Universe teeming with intelligent races.

Gen-Zero. Great issues.

Faith and Torque as a duo.

Malgam still around. Control is still out there (?)...

[Aomalle27]

Aomalle27 wrote:
the climax of the AH engagement was just plain awful. There was a monumental build up, and what we were left with was a quick knockout. A one rounder. ... weak confrontation between the antagonists and our heroes (I mean Quartz, and Helix were dispatched in a single page?!)


I can't agree with the assessment of awful, I very much enjoyed the event. But I do agree that it wrapped up lickedy split for the remaining Hunters.

How else do you assess an 18 part event comic, with 1/2 an issue dealing with a showdown against the Main antagonists There were several great pieces, for me all of the XO issues, especially the AH backstory, and some great reads like the 3 AH Harbinger, utilizing the new Gen Zero crew, while not feeling forced, but also incorporating Faith and Torque to give readers their OG Harbinger fix But so many turds as well, 3 of the final four issues were mighty disappointing, and thats supposed to be the powerful crecendo to this comic symphonetta Way too many mystery solutions, an uneventful final confrontation between our heroes and the AH's, and silly explosions of character power sets I liken it to this: imagine The death of Superman storyline, up until the point Supes squares off against Doomsdsy Now imagine that story with a single issue featuring Superman punching Doomsday and instantly killing him, maybe throw in some weird tech explanation too, like Batman handing Supes a glove of might he developed 10 years prior just in case there was ever a super destructive being that should ever appear Thats how poorly I view the AH as a whole, GREAT setup, but silly mishmash conclusion And possibly the biggest tragedy, XO, the focus of the event wasnt even a featured player! What should have been a heavy focus on Valiants apex titular character (supposedly to draw new readers in) instead focused on Unity players Ninjak, EW and Livewire, the AHs themselves in XO's self title, and a band of Harbingers we havent seen since Harbinger Wars ( yes they were in death of a renegade storyline but as bit players) An absurd way to attract new readers to your product, If Im intrigued to take a chance on VEI without having read their stuff to this point, basef on rave reviews for XO, what makes me think Xo is a worthwhile title after reading AH? It just doesnt feature XO enough Nevermind the fact that Im a VEI day 1 reader with all the knowledge of events that occurred before AH, and I was disappointed So I think awful is a fair assessment of the aH storyline as a whole,

[leonmallett]

My thoughts:

I was a little underwhelmed by the ending and specifically how easily the Armor Hunters appeared to be dispatched considering they had gone toe to toe with Manowar armors over the years. A longer final issue could have given that fight room to breathe and a truly epic quality. Not a terrible finale, but not the most satisfying of endings for me.

In addition, I think the whole has felt bloated while working towards that rather quick ending. I don't feel an 18 part series was really warranted; the bloodshot series did not really add a great deal IMHO. It was okay but not really needed IMHO, I think beats from that could or should have been folded into the main series, perhaps extending it by 1 or 2 issues.

Overall Armor Hunters has felt a little bloated for me, and the whole thing probably could have benefited from some more witness level stuff to put a little more focus on the massive changes the world has just been through (I think AH: Harbinger handled that best so far).

I do think the removal of the Hunters was probably the only logical story resolution, but it also seems a little wasteful with all this build-up, especially the X-O Manowar back story issues. Considering there is not much depth of recurring antagonists for VALIANT right now, it is a shame they are done.

In comparison to Harbinger Wars, quality wise I would say they felt about the same, although HW was a better length to my mind. This seemed like a determined effort to hit the magical number of 18 issues when I felt some of those were unnecessary.

[jmatt]

Considering there is not much depth of recurring antagonists for VALIANT right now, it is a shame they are done.

I would have been okay with Reebo jumping into an escape pod and jettisoning into the unknown. Then we could have had future stories with him hunting down and confronting Control, or colluding with them again for more AH-ish stories.

In the old Avengers books, we constantly saw Baron Zemo and Kang getting away at the end of a lost battle, to re-appear in future issues.

I like that Malgam is still around, but the universe would be more interesting with Reebo still out there.

[hawkeyeps]

Considering there is not much depth of recurring antagonists for VALIANT right now, it is a shame they are done.

I would have been okay with Reebo jumping into an escape pod and jettisoning into the unknown. Then we could have had future stories with him hunting down and confronting Control, or colluding with them again for more AH-ish stories.

In the old Avengers books, we constantly saw Baron Zemo and Kang getting away at the end of a lost battle, to re-appear in future issues.

I like that Malgam is still around, but the universe would be more interesting with Reebo still out there.

+1 when I seen the Armor Hunters get wasted so easily I thought what an unrealized potential especially considering the Hunter back story was the best part of the event IMO.

[leonmallett]

Considering there is not much depth of recurring antagonists for VALIANT right now, it is a shame they are done.

I would have been okay with Reebo jumping into an escape pod and jettisoning into the unknown. Then we could have had future stories with him hunting down and confronting Control, or colluding with them again for more AH-ish stories.

In the old Avengers books, we constantly saw Baron Zemo and Kang getting away at the end of a lost battle, to re-appear in future issues.

I like that Malgam is still around, but the universe would be more interesting with Reebo still out there.

Agreed. Compelling villains make for great friction and therefore dramatic tension. VEI could do with a few more key bad guys IMHO.