VALIANT December 2013 and End of Year Sales Discussion

[bygranddesign]

For those who don't want to sift through the list:

121 Unity 2* $3.99 Valiant 18,845
190 X-O Manowar 20 $3.99 Valiant 9,941
194 Eternal Warrior 4 $3.99 Valiant 9,645
197 Shadowman 13 $3.99 Valiant 9,403
199 Harbinger 19 $3.99 Valiant 9,237
208 Quantum & Woody 6 $3.99 Valiant 8,855
216 Archer & Armstrong 16 $3.99 Valiant 8,608
222 Bloodshot & Hard Corps 17 $3.99 Valiant 8,142

118 X-O Manowar Vol. 4 Homecoming $14.99 Valiant 1,043
150 Shadowman Vol. 3 Deadside Blues $14.99 Valiant 842
222 Valiant Masters Rai HC Vol. 1 $24.99 Valiant 563

awesome. Thanks for posting the numbers

If we use all the listings in the December 2013 Comic Sales report on Comichron.com, we get title averages of:
Marvel 35,388
DC 28,255
Image 12,343
Valiant 10,335
Dark Horse 9,505
Avatar 7,774
Abstract 7,581
IDW 7,522
NBM 7,271
Dynamic Forces 6,812
United Plankton 6,745
Bongo 6,390
Boom 6,152
Zenescope 5,854
Archie 4,439
Archaia 3,272

I think what Greg posted here is really important in trying to reconcile what the numbers mean ... VEI's LOWEST selling title Bloodshot still sold MORE (8,152) than the average sales of most other companies they are competing with.

I would love to see the numbers a little higher (over 10k for most of these title's) ... but right now I would have to think VEI is still doing really well compared to the competition.

They do need to bring in more new readers as they add more titles that much is clear .. but I think big things will be happening in 2014 and hopefully legit movie news will also help with positive momentum.

[400yrs]

Well, we're coming up on year three. Explode or implode. Take your pick.

Well, they said they have a 5 year plan (or was it 7?). Seeing the titles at the current numbers is pretty disappointing, but they can still get to a good place. How? I have no clue. Maybe bring something to market in another media? Not sure how you get readers away from the other companies....

Honestly, I don't think I've read a vei book since the first non-Fowler q&w. I've been buying x-o and harbinger, but they are sitting around waiting to be read. The other titles, I've been picking up for a dollar here and there, but haven't gotten around to reading them.

I'm starting to think that the whole Image revival is having an impact on vei sales. Why read stuff from a corporate comic company that may be hit or miss when you can try something brand new, fresh and original that a creator owns and pours their everything into it?

Vei needs to figure out how to steal Marvel AND DC readers.

[jmatt]

If they can last a few years they may solidify their position and start growing more.

This. They need longevity to prove to the market that they are here for the long haul.

[lorddunlow]

I'm starting to think that the whole Image revival is having an impact on vei sales. Why read stuff from a corporate comic company that may be hit or miss when you can try something brand new, fresh and original that a creator owns and pours their everything into it?

Vei needs to figure out how to steal Marvel AND DC readers.

Agree with both statements. I LOVE what VEI is putting out, but Image is doing everything right. I'm amazed that Image was able to stay in business with the model they employed, but they are definitely a success story. Image has so much great stuff because it is NOT a comic company - it is a comic creator nexus. Only the good stuff sticks and the creators can just keep throwing what they like out there.

I think VEI will see a big switch flipped once they start being recognized as a legitimate comic company with a shared universe and they start stealing lots of Marvel and DC readers (as they are far superior to those two). Getting to that point is the hard part as right now they have to rely on stealing most of their readers from Image, Dark Horse, etc. Who happen to be pretty loyal fans as far as I can tell.

[leonmallett]

Imagine you have 7 children and you are giving each of them their allowance in October.
All together, you handed the children a total of $77.

In November, you have 7 children who get a total of $68 in allowance AND you spend another $60 to adopt an 8th child.

In December, you have 8 children who need to get an allowance.

You might consider splitting $68 or $77 eight ways, because there are now 8 children.
If so, each child would get less money, but the total of $68 or $77 would be the same.

Instead, in December you spread $83 across all 8 children because you also added additional family income.

Is the family doing OK?

This is the story of Valiant comic sales from October to December 2013.

October, 7 titles, 77,000 copies.
November, 7 titles, 68,000 copies plus Unity #1 at 60,000 copies.
December, 8 titles, 83,000 copies.

Problem with that analogy is that as sales per book go down, so do profits, as costs rise relative to to books sold. You lose the economies of scale of bigger print runs.

[lorddunlow]

Imagine you have 7 children and you are giving each of them their allowance in October.
All together, you handed the children a total of $77.

In November, you have 7 children who get a total of $68 in allowance AND you spend another $60 to adopt an 8th child.

In December, you have 8 children who need to get an allowance.

You might consider splitting $68 or $77 eight ways, because there are now 8 children.
If so, each child would get less money, but the total of $68 or $77 would be the same.

Instead, in December you spread $83 across all 8 children because you also added additional family income.

Is the family doing OK?

This is the story of Valiant comic sales from October to December 2013.

October, 7 titles, 77,000 copies.
November, 7 titles, 68,000 copies plus Unity #1 at 60,000 copies.
December, 8 titles, 83,000 copies.

Problem with that analogy is that as sales per book go down, so do profits, as costs rise relative to to books sold. You lose the economies of scale of bigger print runs.

That's true, but we don't know where the cutoffs lie as far as print runs vs. cost. As long as each title doesn't drop below a threshold, greg's analogy would hold true.

[leonmallett]

Imagine you have 7 children and you are giving each of them their allowance in October.
All together, you handed the children a total of $77.

In November, you have 7 children who get a total of $68 in allowance AND you spend another $60 to adopt an 8th child.

In December, you have 8 children who need to get an allowance.

You might consider splitting $68 or $77 eight ways, because there are now 8 children.
If so, each child would get less money, but the total of $68 or $77 would be the same.

Instead, in December you spread $83 across all 8 children because you also added additional family income.

Is the family doing OK?

This is the story of Valiant comic sales from October to December 2013.

October, 7 titles, 77,000 copies.
November, 7 titles, 68,000 copies plus Unity #1 at 60,000 copies.
December, 8 titles, 83,000 copies.

Problem with that analogy is that as sales per book go down, so do profits, as costs rise relative to to books sold. You lose the economies of scale of bigger print runs.

That's true, but we don't know where the cutoffs lie as far as print runs vs. cost. As long as each title doesn't drop below a threshold, greg's analogy would hold true.

The point of overall sales is true, but the profitability is a different matter. As you say there may be plenty of leeway, but total sales of all books other than Unity actually dropped from November to December.

I still enjoy 7 of the 8 books, but it would be great if the core audience for each book would grow.

[Scarlet-Batman]

One thing the diamond numbers do not show is how many people are buying the comics digitally. I personally am buying 5 titles regularly via ComiXology and only one title in print (the remaining two are held off for 99 cent sales). From Diamond's chart's perspective, I am only buying 1 title and thus my entire contribution to Valiant is only counted as a single tick, rather than 6. Think a fair number of other new readers are in a similar boat as myself, especially after the latest 99 cent sale.

I am a new reader. I picked up Valiant books because I heard they were really good from Reviewers, Bloggers, Podcasters and forum goers. Word of mouth is what brought me into the fold. The best thing Valiant can do is to continue to pump out excellent comics and generate as much positive buzz as possible. Long term quality is rewarded by comic fans, especially when you are writing comics that are related to the superhero genre.

[BugsySig]

Unity #1 was best selling non-premier comic of 2013!

http://www.previewsworld.com/Home/1/1/7 ... eID=143914

Here's where the VALIANT books fell in the Top 100 Non-Premier Comics:

(RANK/OVERALL RANK/OVERAL DOLLAR RANK/DESCRIPTION/PRICE/VENDOR)

1 235 176 UNITY #1 $3.99 VAL
35 1360 1206 UNITY #2 $3.99 VAL
42 1436 1103 QUANTUM & WOODY #1 $3.99 VAL
44 1478 1186 HARBINGER WARS #1 $3.99 VAL
51 1571 1276 ETERNAL WARRIOR #1 $3.99 VAL
54 1604 1266 X-O MANOWAR #9 $3.99 VAL
61 1687 1349 X-O MANOWAR #11 $3.99 VAL
67 1734 1830 HARBINGER WARS #2 $3.99 VAL
69 1752 1412 HARBINGER #0 $3.99 VAL
78 1844 1679 HARBINGER #11 $3.99 VAL
79 1848 1504 HARBINGER WARS #3 $3.99 VAL
83 1861 1512 X-O MANOWAR #10 $3.99 VAL
85 1882 1564 X-O MANOWAR #15 $3.99 VAL
91 1913 1737 BLOODSHOT #10 $3.99 VAL
93 1929 1604 SHADOWMAN #3 $3.99 VAL
97 1945 1628 X-O MANOWAR #12 $3.99 VAL
99 1950 1637 X-O MANOWAR #13 $3.99 VAL
100 1954 1643 X-O MANOWAR #14 $3.99 VAL

As for the Top 100 Non-Premier Trades:

21 350 893 HARBINGER TP VOL 01 OMEGA RISING $9.99 VAL
28 414 1059 ARCHER & ARMSTRONG TP VOL 01 $9.99 VAL
48 549 1305 BLOODSHOT TP VOL 01 $9.99 VAL
63 648 898 X-O MANOWAR TP VOL 02 ENTER NINJAK $14.99 VAL
70 734 1608 SHADOWMAN TP VOL 01 BIRTH RITES $9.99 VAL
72 747 1042 HARBINGER TP VOL 02 RENEGADES $14.99 VAL
81 800 1714 QUANTUM & WOODY TP VOL 01 WORLDS WORST $9.99 VAL
89 845 1710 X-O MANOWAR TP VOL 01 BY THE SWORD $9.99 VAL

Comments: Besides the success of Unity, XO was VALIANT's biggest seller by far in 2013 in terms of consistency. I know we all would like to see VEI competing with the big boys, but if we recognize them as the small, upstart, non-premier publisher they are then they are doing very well. I think the success of the trades when compared to other like-sized publishers is substantial, as well. It's easy to overlook that when the Big 3 dominate the TPB charts the way they do.

[greg]

Unity #1 was best selling non-premier comic of 2013!

http://www.previewsworld.com/Home/1/1/7 ... eID=143914

Comments: Besides the success of Unity, XO was VALIANT's biggest seller by far in 2013 in terms of consistency. I know we all would like to see VEI competing with the big boys, but if we recognize them as the small, upstart, non-premier publisher they are then they are doing very well. I think the success of the trades when compared to other like-sized publishers is substantial, as well. It's easy to overlook that when the Big 3 dominate the TPB charts the way they do.

Another thing to notice is how FEW comics in the Top 100 Non-Premier are not #1 issues... and how many are far from #1 like #15+ or #20+.

X-O and Adventure Time. A couple of Sonic the Hedgehog at the bottom. That's it... everything else is under #10... with the majority at #1 or #2.

Anybody can slap a #1 on a cover (or a dozen variants of a #1) and make this list.

Try doing it with a comic issue #15, WITHOUT a tv show or video game.

[FormerReader]

One thing the diamond numbers do not show is how many people are buying the comics digitally. I personally am buying 5 titles regularly via ComiXology and only one title in print (the remaining two are held off for 99 cent sales). From Diamond's chart's perspective, I am only buying 1 title and thus my entire contribution to Valiant is only counted as a single tick, rather than 6. Think a fair number of other new readers are in a similar boat as myself, especially after the latest 99 cent sale.

I am a new reader. I picked up Valiant books because I heard they were really good from Reviewers, Bloggers, Podcasters and forum goers. Word of mouth is what brought me into the fold. The best thing Valiant can do is to continue to pump out excellent comics and generate as much positive buzz as possible. Long term quality is rewarded by comic fans, especially when you are writing comics that are related to the superhero genre.

Welcome.

[GGSAE]

Unity #1 was best selling non-premier comic of 2013!

http://www.previewsworld.com/Home/1/1/7 ... eID=143914

Comments: Besides the success of Unity, XO was VALIANT's biggest seller by far in 2013 in terms of consistency. I know we all would like to see VEI competing with the big boys, but if we recognize them as the small, upstart, non-premier publisher they are then they are doing very well. I think the success of the trades when compared to other like-sized publishers is substantial, as well. It's easy to overlook that when the Big 3 dominate the TPB charts the way they do.

Another thing to notice is how FEW comics in the Top 100 Non-Premier are not #1 issues... and how many are far from #1 like #15+ or #20+.

X-O and Adventure Time. A couple of Sonic the Hedgehog at the bottom. That's it... everything else is under #10... with the majority at #1 or #2.

Anybody can slap a #1 on a cover (or a dozen variants of a #1) and make this list.

Try doing it with a comic issue #15, WITHOUT a tv show or video game.

Good points, Greg. I would really like to see how digital readership and sales are calculated, because I'm actually considering switching to digital. A year ago I would have never considered it!

[BugsySig]

Unity #1 was best selling non-premier comic of 2013!

http://www.previewsworld.com/Home/1/1/7 ... eID=143914

Comments: Besides the success of Unity, XO was VALIANT's biggest seller by far in 2013 in terms of consistency. I know we all would like to see VEI competing with the big boys, but if we recognize them as the small, upstart, non-premier publisher they are then they are doing very well. I think the success of the trades when compared to other like-sized publishers is substantial, as well. It's easy to overlook that when the Big 3 dominate the TPB charts the way they do.

Another thing to notice is how FEW comics in the Top 100 Non-Premier are not #1 issues... and how many are far from #1 like #15+ or #20+.

X-O and Adventure Time. A couple of Sonic the Hedgehog at the bottom. That's it... everything else is under #10... with the majority at #1 or #2.

Anybody can slap a #1 on a cover (or a dozen variants of a #1) and make this list.

Try doing it with a comic issue #15, WITHOUT a tv show or video game.

Good points, Greg. I would really like to see how digital readership and sales are calculated, because I'm actually considering switching to digital. A year ago I would have never considered it!

Digital sales are not calculated at all. Comixology and the individual publishers know (and maybe Apple) but they're not published anywhere. The closest guess is probably 8-10% of print considering the increase in digital readers and day and date availability over the past two years or so.

[rjrjr]

This is the story of Valiant comic sales from October to December 2013.

October, 7 titles, 77,000 copies.
November, 7 titles, 68,000 copies plus Unity #1 at 60,000 copies.
December, 8 titles, 83,000 copies.

January, 8 titles, 74,000 copies.

If you include the Must Read Valiant Greatest Hits:

January, 9 titles, 76,000 copies.

It's making sense now why VEI wants to get more number 1s out on the stands like the upcoming Shadowman 1.

[Captain Craig]

Like everyone else it baffles me that the titles largely remain in a downward slide. Especially Archer & Armstrong.

The 2013 VEI Market Share: 1.06%
The 2012 VEI Market Share: 0.58%

With only 8 months of publishing and 5 titles, this is VEI's starting ground ending 2012= .58%
With 12 months of publishing and 8 titles, VEI came very close to doubling at end 2013= 1.06%

So it seems the story to date is a win/lose proposition. More market share with more output but existing output is declining which isn't sustainable longterm. We now know VEI will be expanding output, the question is can a reversal or at minimum a leveling off of issues per book sold be done?

They say there is a 5 year plan and with output increasing we have to trust that despite what our analysis is we don't have all the details. So running around screaming the sky is falling helps no one. At best we see dark clouds, let's hope they part.

Possible Out of the Box thought:
Remember when Paramount put a bid in for VALIANT the first time only to lose out to ACCLAIM? What if what is needed is that larger media push that a large media conglomorate like Paramount can offer. Diversity of output, something Acclaim didn't have+they meddled in the publishing side too much. If Paramount bought VEI and allowed them to publish in the same manner that Warners and Disney allow DC&Marvel to do so while their media arms mine the universies for cartoon, tv and film. Some DDVD films and/or an XO cartoon are what could grab more eye balls ultimately back to the printed page. It's no coincidence that Guardians of the Galaxy got a new ongoing book and that Disney is discussing a cartoon on the heels of the film. Multi platform promotion, that is something VEI could use. A Universe needs worlds to play in and Paramount has those worlds in animation, tv and film.

[kjjohanson]

…If Paramount bought VEI and allowed them to publish in the same manner that Warners and Disney allow DC&Marvel to do so while their media arms mine the universies for cartoon, tv and film…

You don't seriously think that the corporate parents are hands-off, do you? I could point to plenty of evidence that suggests that creative is being directed by the sales and marketing departments.

[Captain Craig]

…If Paramount bought VEI and allowed them to publish in the same manner that Warners and Disney allow DC&Marvel to do so while their media arms mine the universies for cartoon, tv and film…

You don't seriously think that the corporate parents are hands-off, do you? I could point to plenty of evidence that suggests that creative is being directed by the sales and marketing departments.

No of course not. Just thinking of ways to have access to "protection" from a profit margin perspective so to speak.

[Chiclo]

Possible Out of the Box thought:
Remember when Paramount put a bid in for VALIANT the first time only to lose out to ACCLAIM? What if what is needed is that larger media push that a large media conglomorate like Paramount can offer. Diversity of output, something Acclaim didn't have+they meddled in the publishing side too much. If Paramount bought VEI and allowed them to publish in the same manner that Warners and Disney allow DC&Marvel to do so while their media arms mine the universies for cartoon, tv and film. Some DDVD films and/or an XO cartoon are what could grab more eye balls ultimately back to the printed page. It's no coincidence that Guardians of the Galaxy got a new ongoing book and that Disney is discussing a cartoon on the heels of the film. Multi platform promotion, that is something VEI could use. A Universe needs worlds to play in and Paramount has those worlds in animation, tv and film.

I cannot imagine Valiant being comfortable with this sort of means to their ends. I heard Dino once say that Sony owns more of Spiderman than Marvel does and he was using that statement as a warning against precisely the sort of thing you are talking about.

[Captain Craig]

I'd be curious for more explanation from Dinesh then.
Sony only controls the live action movie rights.
Disney has animation and via Marvel publishing rights.
I'd wager video gaming could be at another party but if Sony has it, it's a separate contract.


Circling back, I'm also thinking that sustained longevity will ultimately help. The original Valiant U went roughly 5yrs and Acclaim about the same +/- a slight margin. So when we read Dinesh and Co. have a 5yr plan I'm hoping that's with the intent to get past the point when prior VALIANT Universe endeavors had to close shop and in doing so show the industry that their readership is solid. In turn allowing for other outlets to perhaps make use of the properties in some other media outlet gaining broader exposure.

Still struggle with how some of their better titles, their cream books, are under 10K?! But as long as the profit/loss point is much lower than we suspect we should remain optimistic. That's not hard, the product is great and eventually people will either return or come into the fold somehow, someway.

[Tannerman]

On the Sony/Spider-man topic, Sony actually has less to gain financially with the franchise now, as in 2011 they gave up all merchandising rights back to Disney (in exchange for the Mouse giving Sony back their percentage of participation). When you do the math, the product side is far more lucrative, thus Sony can only benefit from the film/video releases themselves.

[agent_graves]

Unity #4 10,644
X-O Manowar #22 9,808
Archer & Armstrong Archer #0 8,671
Harbinger #21 8,473
Quantum & Woody #8 7,992
Bloodshot & Hard Corp #0 7,895
Eternal Warrior #6 7,862
Bloodshot & Hard Corps #19 7,281
Shadowman #15 7,239*

Well over 70k as a whole, but 4 out of 8 ongoing's, are under 8k, that can't be good...

*Feb 2014 Sales chart...

[bamaphilosopher]

Wow, and here I thought, just by going to my local comic shop, that Valiant was thriving. But wow, these numbers look pitifully low, like pre-Unity sales before the original Valiant hit big. Dang, I think the original Rai 3 that was so hard to find had a bigger print run...I'm assuming I'm reading your numbers right?

I don't see how they can survive, but then again, they seem to be doing a lot better than some of the other Indies, based on the lists you guys have shown.

Hopefully, the company is doing well financially. I'll keep buying them, that's for sure.

Except for the 8-bit covers. I refuse to buy them. I think the company got the message...I see they haven't been doing those lately. Good! Maybe others like them, but they don't look like real comic books to me.

Otherwise, I hope they keep doing what they're doing, story-wise. It seems to me that the stories are even better than pre-Unity and Unity, and that's saying something coming from me!

[kjjohanson]

Unity #4 10,644
X-O Manowar #22 9,808
Archer & Armstrong Archer #0 8,671
Harbinger #21 8,473
Quantum & Woody #8 7,992
Bloodshot & Hard Corp #0 7,895
Eternal Warrior #6 7,862
Bloodshot & Hard Corps #19 7,281
Shadowman #15 7,239*

Well over 70k as a whole, but 4 out of 8 ongoing's, are under 8k, that can't be good...

*Feb 2014 Sales chart...

There's an entirely separate thread for the February numbers.

[BugsySig]

Wow, and here I thought, just by going to my local comic shop, that Valiant was thriving. But wow, these numbers look pitifully low, like pre-Unity sales before the original Valiant hit big. Dang, I think the original Rai 3 that was so hard to find had a bigger print run...I'm assuming I'm reading your numbers right?

I don't see how they can survive, but then again, they seem to be doing a lot better than some of the other Indies, based on the lists you guys have shown.

Hopefully, the company is doing well financially. I'll keep buying them, that's for sure.

Except for the 8-bit covers. I refuse to buy them. I think the company got the message...I see they haven't been doing those lately. Good! Maybe others like them, but they don't look like real comic books to me.

Otherwise, I hope they keep doing what they're doing, story-wise. It seems to me that the stories are even better than pre-Unity and Unity, and that's saying something coming from me!

We discuss the numbers on a monthly basis. There's different opinions, but overall VEI is doing very well. Considering they only ship 9 books in a month, they produce similar % dollar and unit shares to BOOM! which ships 3x as many titles. If you take sales per title, VEI is still ahead of all but the top 5 publishers. All without any licensed characters like Transformers, TMNT, Adventure Time, MLP, etc, etc.

Keep in mind, almost all of VALIANT's titles are in at least their 3rd or 4th arc. There is always a natural drop in sales the further a book continues, hence why Marvel and DC just reboot their titles every 2 years or so, and why we are seeing the "VALIANT Firsts" initiative. At this point, many readers may have switched from monthlies to trades, or are more likely to pick up the books for the first time in trade form as whole arcs.

VEI also has other areas of income including digital sales, international sales, foreign language sales, reorders of trades and hard covers and merchandise sales and licenses.