What type of Valiant Universe would you prefer?

[ZephyrWasHOT!!]

Just get Alan Moore to do it.

It'd be perfect.

Moore should stay away from it.

GAH!

There's NOBODY who does revivals better than Alan Moore, because he makes it make SENSE.

[Daniel Jackson]

Still no mention of the class clowns - Quantum and Woody. I think they are worthy of a title... Am I alone in that belief???

Actually, I don't know of too many people around here who wouldn't want to see them come back.

[k_c_collectibles]

Still no mention of the class clowns - Quantum and Woody. I think they are worthy of a title... Am I alone in that belief???

Check again

Oops... my bad!!!

I think you could incorporate them rather easily into the vh1 universe. I think Woody and Armstrong would get along well together! Who else are you going to use for comic relief? Humor has its place in comics - look what it did for the relaunch of the justice League in the 80s! Bwah, haa, haa!

Otay - that settles it. We get Keith Giffen and J.M. DeMattees to write the relaunch of Valiant Universe!

All kidding aside I really think Quantum and Woody have a place in the Valiant Universe and I am sure many people on this board will agree with me.

Chris

[ManofTheAtom]

Still no mention of the class clowns - Quantum and Woody. I think they are worthy of a title... Am I alone in that belief???

Check again

Oops... my bad!!!

I think you could incorporate them rather easily into the vh1 universe. I think Woody and Armstrong would get along well together! Who else are you going to use for comic relief? Humor has its place in comics - look what it did for the relaunch of the justice League in the 80s! Bwah, haa, haa!

Otay - that settles it. We get Keith Giffen and J.M. DeMattees to write the relaunch of Valiant Universe!

All kidding aside I really think Quantum and Woody have a place in the Valiant Universe and I am sure many people on this board will agree with me.

Chris

But do you want Q&W as a reboot or as a continuation?

[k_c_collectibles]

But do you want Q&W as a reboot or as a continuation?

Either is fine with me. I don't care as long as they are part of the Valiant Universe. I would LOVE to see a movie with them in it. I can see it now... Wesley Snipes and Woody Harrelson (or some other funny comedian - but DEFINATELY Snipes as Quantum!!).

That would be a funny movie and they have worked together before a few times so we know they have good chemistry.

Just food for thought Dino... or whoever has the character rights.
Chris

[Daniel Jackson]

He can be a spirit in Deadside.

Hell, it could even be that Jack's spirit inhabits Michael's body.

Michael by day, Jack by night.

Alive but not alive, dead but not dead.

That could work.

As for Master Darque, he's dead, more so than Jack, but his influence could still be felt.

Nature abhors a void, so once Darque falls someone else would take his place.

I really like this idea. By doing this we can legitimately keep Jack around without losing Michael.

Look at Stargate SG-1 as an example.Every time they kill a Gou'ld, a more powerful one takes his place

Nice reference.

[ManofTheAtom]

Either is fine with me. I don't care as long as they are part of the Valiant Universe. I would LOVE to see a movie with them in it. I can see it now... Wesley Snipes and Woody Harrelson (or some other funny comedian - but DEFINATELY Snipes as Quantum!!).

That would be a funny movie and they have worked together before a few times so we know they have good chemistry.

Just food for thought Dino... or whoever has the character rights.
Chris

But how would such a thing work?

One night Woody goes to bed in VH 2 and the next day he wakes up in VH 1?

I don't think a cosmic event is what VALIANT needs right now.

Things have to be as simple and streamlined as possible.

"Here's the VALIANT Universe, just as we left it in 1996 but nine years later, no fuss, no muss."

I think that it be best for Q&W to be printed as part of their own imprint, like Armed & Dangerous and the other non-VALIANT heroes comics that Acclaim published before Nicieza and before VH 2.

And that's even assuming that this is an issue. Remember, VIP, the people talking with Priest and Bright, are't the same as the ones who bought the rights to the characters.

[ManofTheAtom]

GAH!

There's NOBODY who does revivals better than Alan Moore, because he makes it make SENSE.

Look, as much sense as "being trapped in time bubbles until Tom Strong freed them" makes for the characters in Terra Obscura, such an approach wouldn't make sense for VALIANT.

One of the important things to consider is VALIANT's unspoken motto

"Heroes outside your window"

This means that there has to be a certain degree of credibility and realism to the VALIANT Universe.

It doesn't mean we can't have God-like characters like Solar and time travelers like Ivar, it just means that there has to be a meassure of realism to it.

To have all the VALIANT characters (heroes, villains, and supporting characters alike) suddenly "reappear" in 2005 straight out of either 92 (Unity) or 94 (Chaos) is neither realistic nor credible.

There's really no need to ignore what came after Shooter (except for VH 2 and U2K), all we need is writers with talent who can tell stories that make sense.

Let me put it like this:

What needs to happen with the VALIANT Universe is akin to what happened to Captain America over at Marvel.

While Captain America was frozen within ice, the world around him changed. Heroes fell (the Invaders) and others took their place (the Avengers).

If we view someone like Solar as Captain America and his being part of the sun akin to being inside ice... well, you can see where I'm going.

As I said above, jumping over the last nine years isn't really all that necessary.

Many, many VALIANT characters were placed in a position where time hasn't moved for them so they're safe, while the others who have experienced the passage of time (i.e. Harbinger, HARD Corps, Armorines, Ninjak) can actually benefit greatly from it.

[ManofTheAtom]

I really like this idea. By doing this we can legitimately keep Jack around without losing Michael.

Heh, thanks.

I think such an idea has potential.

Now here's the twist.

The new wielder of the magic that's more powerful than Darque Power?

Hwen and Carmen's son...

Now wouldn't that be something?

Nice reference.

Heh, thanks

I love that show.

[magnusr]

Quantum and Woody. I think they are worthy of a title... Am I alone in that belief???

No, you're not. They might legally and certainly creatively depend on Bright and Priest which could complicate thing, or it could be positive.

/Magnus

[ZephyrWasHOT!!]

GAH!

There's NOBODY who does revivals better than Alan Moore, because he makes it make SENSE.

Look, as much sense as "being trapped in time bubbles until Tom Strong freed them" makes for the characters in Terra Obscura, such an approach wouldn't make sense for VALIANT.

One of the important things to consider is VALIANT's unspoken motto

"Heroes outside your window"

This means that there has to be a certain degree of credibility and realism to the VALIANT Universe.

It doesn't mean we can't have God-like characters like Solar and time travelers like Ivar, it just means that there has to be a meassure of realism to it.

To have all the VALIANT characters (heroes, villains, and supporting characters alike) suddenly "reappear" in 2005 straight out of either 92 (Unity) or 94 (Chaos) is neither realistic nor credible.

There's really no need to ignore what came after Shooter (except for VH 2 and U2K), all we need is writers with talent who can tell stories that make sense.

Let me put it like this:

What needs to happen with the VALIANT Universe is akin to what happened to Captain America over at Marvel.

While Captain America was frozen within ice, the world around him changed. Heroes fell (the Invaders) and others took their place (the Avengers).

If we view someone like Solar as Captain America and his being part of the sun akin to being inside ice... well, you can see where I'm going.

As I said above, jumping over the last nine years isn't really all that necessary.

Many, many VALIANT characters were placed in a position where time hasn't moved for them so they're safe, while the others who have experienced the passage of time (i.e. Harbinger, HARD Corps, Armorines, Ninjak) can actually benefit greatly from it.

I'm sure you certainly understand, MOTA, that Moore doesn't just do ONE thing.

You've read Watchmen. And for God's sake, I HOPE you've read Miracleman.

I was really only half kidding when I said it, because Moore wouldn't do anything like this, but the point was: there needs to be something totally 180 degrees from anything that has gone before, but still remaining faithful to it.

That's why Moore is such a genius. He took Marvelman, a lame, lame, LAME Captain Marvel clone, and turned it on its ear...WITHOUT just 'deux et machina'ing it and tossing all that had gone before...instead, RESPECTING what had gone before, but taking it in a whole new direction.

Likewise with Swamp Thing...he basically created an entirely new character, with a new origin and all....and yet, not a single story PREVIOUSLY told was wholesale-y discarded.

He respected the work that had gone before.

Likewise....now, I've not read the Gold Key books, but this is what I gather...likewise, Jim Shooter didn't ditch the origins of Magnus and Solar, but, instead, BUILT upon what had gone before, and made it better.

That's really my point. We need someone to come up with a Moore-like solution for what's happened, and how do we clear up this mess, WITHOUT "crisis"ing everything that had gone before.

[ManofTheAtom]

You're thinking of Moore as he was 20 years ago.

In recent years, Moore had taken a completely different approach to his writing.

In Supreme he did toss out past continuity to replace Supreme with an extremely lame, lame, lame, LAME Superman clone (weird how things go around in circles, eh? He turns a Captain Marvel clone into a different hero and then he goes and turns a different hero into a Superman clone).

Moore's approach to comics isn't what it was in the 80's and before. Today his approach is too Silver Agey.

[ZephyrWasHOT!!]

You're thinking of Moore as he was 20 years ago.

In recent years, Moore had taken a completely different approach to his writing.

In Supreme he did toss out past continuity to replace Supreme with an extremely lame, lame, lame, LAME Superman clone (weird how things go around in circles, eh? He turns a Captain Marvel clone into a different hero and then he goes and turns a different hero into a Superman clone).

Moore's approach to comics isn't what it was in the 80's and before. Today his approach is too Silver Agey.

Fair enough. But by my examples, you understand my point. Moore of 20 years ago is what is needed.

And as far as Supreme goes....come on, it couldn't get much worse than it already was....Liefeld wrote it for crying out loud!

[ManofTheAtom]

Heh.

Good or bad, Liefeld's Supreme will always be something Moore's never was, an original idea (in spite of Liefeld admitting that he created Supreme to tell Superman-like stories, the two characters were completely different).

And yes, I do think we need someone who'll respect what came before, and I'm sure it can be done.

We need VALIANT: The Next Generation, VALIANT Deep Space Nine and even VALIANT Voyager.

What the next VALIANT needs to be is that TNG, DS9, and VOY were to the original Star Trek.

[DJSpecter]

We had Valiant Voyager... that got screwy before it was turned into The Acclaimed Valiant, which was cancelled to make room for The New Acclaimed Valiant.