Valiant in Wizard Mag again!

IanAlexavier · Post by **IanAlexavier** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 12:04 pm

Well, I partially blame Wizard.. but I partially blame us, the collectors.

Wizard is the 5th Avenue of comics.. the comic public tend to buy what the Wizard tells us what to buy.

Its operates off of our insecurities and greed. Plain and simple.

If we dont buy into it and read what we enjoy, read what is worth of reading, collect what we enjoy and believe is worthy of keeping, then or insecurities, and greed cannot be massaged and manipulated by Wizard.

mobstirr · Post by **mobstirr** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 1:06 pm

IanAlexavier wrote:Well, I partially blame Wizard.. but I partially blame us, the collectors.

Wizard is the 5th Avenue of comics.. the comic public tend to buy what the Wizard tells us what to buy.

Its operates off of our insecurities and greed. Plain and simple.

If we dont buy into it and read what we enjoy, read what is worth of reading, collect what we enjoy and believe is worthy of keeping, then or insecurities, and greed cannot be massaged and manipulated by Wizard.

Well said.

Second_Death · Post by **Second_Death** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 1:26 pm

mobstirr wrote:
IanAlexavier wrote:Well, I partially blame Wizard.. but I partially blame us, the collectors.

Wizard is the 5th Avenue of comics.. the comic public tend to buy what the Wizard tells us what to buy.

Its operates off of our insecurities and greed. Plain and simple.

If we dont buy into it and read what we enjoy, read what is worth of reading, collect what we enjoy and believe is worthy of keeping, then our insecurities, and greed cannot be massaged and manipulated by Wizard.
Well said.

Agreed. Its true that Wizard fed the monster but the monster already existed and wanted to be fed. There is plenty blame to go around.

Darques_Emporium · Post by **Darques_Emporium** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 2:45 pm

I was happy somewhat when the bottom fell out. It taught the comic industry that it did matter what was between the covers and that the hot artist wasn't always the most important aspect. It's sad that it took the industry falling apart to do that though.

Daniel Jackson · Post by **Daniel Jackson** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 2:48 pm

Darques_Emporium wrote:I was happy somewhat when the bottom fell out. It taught the comic industry that it did matter what was between the covers and that the hot artist wasn't always the most important aspect. It's sad that it took the industry falling apart to do that though.

Yeah, but too bad it never dawned on them to lower the prices so more people would start reading again.

Darques_Emporium · Post by **Darques_Emporium** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 5:07 pm

Daniel Jackson wrote:
Darques_Emporium wrote:I was happy somewhat when the bottom fell out. It taught the comic industry that it did matter what was between the covers and that the hot artist wasn't always the most important aspect. It's sad that it took the industry falling apart to do that though.
Yeah, but too bad it never dawned on them to lower the prices so more people would start reading again.

It's a sad fact that the prices keep going up. It appears that this is what you pay for what they decide is quality. I believe you can thank Image for that.

Daniel Jackson · Post by **Daniel Jackson** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 5:22 pm

Darques_Emporium wrote:
Daniel Jackson wrote:
Darques_Emporium wrote:I was happy somewhat when the bottom fell out. It taught the comic industry that it did matter what was between the covers and that the hot artist wasn't always the most important aspect. It's sad that it took the industry falling apart to do that though.
Yeah, but too bad it never dawned on them to lower the prices so more people would start reading again.
It's a sad fact that the prices keep going up. It appears that this is what you pay for what they decide is quality. I believe you can thank Image for that.

3 bucks a pop is just way too much for my blood. I will start collecting the new VU and occasional issues here and there from Marvel and DC, but nothing like I used to. Most of the recent books I've been able to get in the back issue or on ebay for less than a buck a piece anyhow. So I can't see spending big $$ every week on new stuff.

Dr. Solar · Post by **Dr. Solar** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 5:40 pm

About prices, just for some perspective, from what I remember, VALIANT really led this charge to some degree, with books costing $2.25 and $2.50 when most other books were between $1.25 and $1.75.

Book prices only went up to $3 in the last year or two, so considering that it is up from $2.50 about 15 years ago, it isn't too huge a price hike.

[/devil's advocate]

But on topic, I guess I should start buying Wizard again!!

Wait, no I shouldn't.

mobstirr · Post by **mobstirr** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 7:32 pm

I avoid anything by Marvel. But as Marvel goes, so goes the entire industry...

Darques_Emporium · Post by **Darques_Emporium** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 7:51 pm

I mainly stick to Graphic Novels these days. More bang for the buck and you don't have to wait for the next issue in big story arcs. Doesn't IDW charge $3.99 for their books? I almost had a heart attack.

IanAlexavier · Post by **IanAlexavier** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 8:13 pm

I used to faithfully buy 4-6 books a week for under $20.

I havent bought a new book in just over a year.

My grand plan is to get my VH1 collection finished before DNV comes out so I can buy my 3 VALIANT books each week

Regarding prices. Hey, I want a raise too, plus take a look at the paper that they are usign now. I think we tend to forget what comics looked like back in the 80's. HUGE difference here, at least in quality of materials begin used. Im not so sure that art or writing has improved.

Daniel Jackson · Post by **Daniel Jackson** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 8:33 pm

I'm not a big fan of the fancy glossy paper they're using now. I'd rather have that cheap ol' stuff they used to use.

mobstirr · Post by **mobstirr** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 8:58 pm

Daniel Jackson wrote:I'm not a big fan of the fancy glossy paper they're using now. I'd rather have that cheap ol' stuff they used to use.

Definitely!

IanAlexavier · Post by **IanAlexavier** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:28 pm

Well maybe Dino will take a look at what paper is available and go with something a bit less glossy. Maybe use glossy for special books, like variants.

This may be a way to keep prices down and encourage readers to collect all 8-10 per month.

Darques_Emporium · Post by **Darques_Emporium** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:34 pm

I hate the glossy papoer when the light catches it just right and you can't really see what's up. Doesn't happen all the time, but in the occasion it doies it's irritating.

IanAlexavier · Post by **IanAlexavier** » Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:46 pm

I hate that as well.. its like I need to find where the indirect light is just perfect so I can see the whole page... It can be frustrating...

nickvasallo · Post by **nickvasallo** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 1:31 am

the prices were a BIG turn off for me too. Remember when Wolverine was $1.50 and that seemed like a lot, then you look at the coloring compared to $1.00 Uncanny X-Men and it was a big difference.

Yeah, we really bought into the chromium, gold embossed madness....Im glad it's over....I too, seek refuge in the bargain bins. I think the darkest time of recent comic hisory is when every artist, and I mean like 50% of comic covers had Erik Lefield type art....now I hate that style with a passion. Call me old fashioned but I still prefer Paul Smith, Art Adams, BWS, and even McFarlane

slym2none · Post by **slym2none** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 1:45 am

I know it wasn't the first, but that first Venom mini-series did it for me, you all know the one - with the red-foil cover, "Lethal Protector." That sucker was $2.95, and that was in 1993! VALIANT started out at $1.95, but quickly went to $2.25.

Now, I don't know about you, but knowing then what I knew then, I still picked out the VALIANT titles, because I don't care how pretty a bow you put on it, a turd is a turd is a turd.

-slym

Daniel Jackson · Post by **Daniel Jackson** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 6:37 am

nickvasallo wrote:the prices were a BIG turn off for me too. Remember when Wolverine was $1.50 and that seemed like a lot, then you look at the coloring compared to $1.00 Uncanny X-Men and it was a big difference.

Yeah, we really bought into the chromium, gold embossed madness....Im glad it's over....I too, seek refuge in the bargain bins. I think the darkest time of recent comic hisory is when every artist, and I mean like 50% of comic covers had Erik Lefield type art....now I hate that style with a passion. Call me old fashioned but I still prefer Paul Smith, Art Adams, BWS, and even McFarlane

It just seems like the price of books went from $1.25 to $2.50 way too quickly. Up until the last 80's the prices seemed to increase very slowly. Personally, I think they can be done far cheaper.

nickvasallo · Post by **nickvasallo** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 12:20 pm

Daniel Jackson wrote:
nickvasallo wrote:the prices were a BIG turn off for me too. Remember when Wolverine was $1.50 and that seemed like a lot, then you look at the coloring compared to $1.00 Uncanny X-Men and it was a big difference.

Yeah, we really bought into the chromium, gold embossed madness....Im glad it's over....I too, seek refuge in the bargain bins. I think the darkest time of recent comic hisory is when every artist, and I mean like 50% of comic covers had Erik Lefield type art....now I hate that style with a passion. Call me old fashioned but I still prefer Paul Smith, Art Adams, BWS, and even McFarlane
It just seems like the price of books went from $1.25 to $2.50 way too quickly. Up until the last 80's the prices seemed to increase very slowly. Personally, I think they can be done far cheaper.

oh yeah...books shouldn't cost more than $2 (and thats for the glossy old Marvel Fanfare printing) - and yeah the Venom mini-series was horrible...I think after Ghost Rider #18 (Glow in the Dark) and Silver Surfer #50 (Foil Embossed) and Bloodhsot #1 - the industry shot themselves in the face with their own load

slym2none · Post by **slym2none** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 1:54 pm

Daniel Jackson wrote:It just seems like the price of books went from $1.25 to $2.50 way too quickly. Up until the last 80's the prices seemed to increase very slowly. Personally, I think they can be done far cheaper.

And then from $2.50 to $2.95/$3.00 seemed like a month...

And I completely agree about the paper quality - the old-school newsprint was fine with me.

-slym (is now remembering that FF v/s the X-Men mini printed on Baxter paper)

Daniel Jackson · Post by **Daniel Jackson** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:00 pm

Yeah, it's amazing how they kept the price of comics fairly reasonable for over 50 years, but then decided to dramatically raise the price over the last 15 or so.

IanAlexavier · Post by **IanAlexavier** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:34 pm

Just because the paper is newsprint doesn't mean that the resolution should be altered, should it??

Cant we have a bit cheaper paper with high quality DPI?

Anyone know about this??

Does the newsprint absorb too much ink?? Is more ink used on the newsprint or the glassy paper??

Daniel Jackson · Post by **Daniel Jackson** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:40 pm

I'm sure they are not going to change the way they do things now anyway. But if they can print up an 80 page preview to Infinite Crisis for 99 cents then surely they make more that way if they choose to do so.

slym2none · Post by **slym2none** » Wed Jul 25, 2007 2:40 pm

IanAlexavier wrote:Just because the paper is newsprint doesn't mean that the resolution should be altered, should it??

Cant we have a bit cheaper paper with high quality DPI?

Anyone know about this??

Does the newsprint absorb too much ink?? Is more ink used on the newsprint or the glassy paper??

I think to get high-quality images onto more-porous newsprint, ink would have to be layered on, instead of the entire picture being porinted at once. That in turn would raise production costs, and probably wouldn't be viable.

I for one, didn't even really mind when the colour didn't stay in the lines, so to speak. It's a comic-book, for Pete's sake.....

-slym