Q on Lost Land in the Accliam Turok issues

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Sat Jun 26, 2004 5:48 pm

I had a Birthquake preview thing that had two page of most of the comics in it. On the Turok pages it showed Turok returning to the Lost Land with the ruins of Mother God's fortress. How is this possible and was it ever explained? At the end of Unity #1 all of the Lost Land was consumed by a black hole, there shouldn't have been a Lost Land left after the Unity conflict. Thanks for any help.

Jaknife · Post by **Jaknife** » Sat Jun 26, 2004 8:54 pm

chaos effect. at the end, it was recreated using the necromantic energies. somehow, the rainbow tower was remade, but i was always confused about that.

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Sun Jun 27, 2004 1:20 pm

Jaknife wrote:chaos effect. at the end, it was recreated using the necromantic energies. somehow, the rainbow tower was remade, but i was always confused about that.

That is confusing.

I always thought that they were trying to lead up to some sort of sequel to Unity that got tanked by Birthquake. Or maybe they just didn't care since most of the people that would remember Unity had stopped reading by then.

I still can't get over the Lost Land being made of necromatic energy

DJSpecter · Post by **DJSpecter** » Sun Jun 27, 2004 8:14 pm

I thought that Geoff and Archer and Armstrong arrived to the Lost Land before the Unity War. This based on the words "A great war is coming and our part will be very different this time around" I remember hearing those words. Can anybody verify one way or the other?

-Dave

Of course at the end of Unity the claim is that Solar destroyed the black hole making the lost land never existent, which doesn't fit into the Valiant style of Time Travel, but the lost land is out of time so why not, right?

I dunno.

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 11:25 am

DJSpecter wrote:I thought that Geoff and Archer and Armstrong arrived to the Lost Land before the Unity War. This based on the words "A great war is coming and our part will be very different this time around" I remember hearing those words. Can anybody verify one way or the other?

-Dave

Of course at the end of Unity the claim is that Solar destroyed the black hole making the lost land never existent, which doesn't fit into the Valiant style of Time Travel, but the lost land is out of time so why not, right?

I dunno.

Yes you're remembering the words from Chaos Effect Omega correctly, which makes this all the more confusing, but perhaps they were planning two seperate but similar conflicts to happen in the Lost Land(s)? Remember what Gilad 4001 said about remembering a different, shorter conflict?

I've got a feeling the whole the "Lost Land never existed thing" may have been a line that was put in their by whoever wrote the script (Shooter did the plot of Unity #1 but was booted before he could script it. Judging from U2000, he had VERY different plans for the Lost Land). Valiant time travel hadn't really been invented yet so they were just kinda winging it

.

magnusr · Post by **magnusr** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 11:57 am

DJSpecter wrote:I thought that Geoff and Archer and Armstrong arrived to the Lost Land before the Unity War. This based on the words "A great war is coming and our part will be very different this time around" I remember hearing those words. Can anybody verify one way or the other?

-Dave.

Close: "A great war is coming and our part is to be played in a different time".

/Magnus

DJSpecter · Post by **DJSpecter** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 12:13 pm

The Valiant version of time travel is Ivar's not the one with the stickin butterfly.

In other words, based on Unity, everything happens at the same time. If you are in one time, you were always in that time. If you go back and do something you can't fix or change anything you can just make it happen. You can't mess up time, you can just live it. So just go ahead and try to make time come out differently, it will never work.

Now why you brought in the butterfly I don't know.

-Dave

DJSpecter · Post by **DJSpecter** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 1:40 pm

Good question: Suppose you killed your father before you were conceved.

VH1: Impossible, you are likely to end up killing yourself by trying. or the man who you thought was your father, wasn't your father (Hi Mr. King).

VH2: You would create two time streams, one where you existed and one where you didn't. The funny thing of course is that you would live in the time stream where you weren't born and would have dissappeared from the time stream where you were. (This is based on the Man of the Atom issue. (This may have developed differently, this is one of the handful of VH2's that I've read.)

Neither Valiant version of time travel is the same as Michael J. Fox's (where if you killed your father you would dissappear on the spot, making a much more confusing version of time travel based on the question, "who killed him", based on your father never baring you.)

-Dave

GJB · Post by **GJB** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 3:09 pm

Knight_333,

I wanted to comment on that butterfly story. I'm not sure of the stories name, but we listened to the audio version in English class back in high school. The way I remember it, there was a close presidential election before they left for the hunting trip, something like the guy elected stood for our current freedoms, but he barely won for some reason. They went on the trip, the guy killed the butterfly, and when they got back, the other guy won illustrating how a small alteration in the past changed their present reality.

I think the guy that won was a Stalin type. Sorry for going off subject here.

GJB · Post by **GJB** » Mon Jun 28, 2004 10:00 pm

Knightt_333,

It's funny you mention that because I remember that story scaring me a little bit also.

The world was a bigger place,(no internet), and the cold war was still in full swing. It was one of those "1984" or "Brave New World" kind of scares.

Was it a Ray Bradbury story?

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Tue Jun 29, 2004 7:58 am

Knightt_333 wrote:
GJB wrote:Knightt_333,

It's funny you mention that because I remember that story scaring me a little bit also.

The world was a bigger place,(no internet), and the cold war was still in full swing. It was one of those "1984" or "Brave New World" kind of scares.

Was it a Ray Bradbury story?
You know, it just might HAVE been a Bradbury story. I remember seeking out his works as a kid.

Yes, it was one of Bardbury's classics. I actually have an adaption of it in the back of an X-FIles digest comic (Topps reprinted stories from their Ray Bradbury comics as back-up stories to take up space, not that I minded

). It was actually made fun of in a Simpson's Treehouse of Horror one year.

GJB · Post by **GJB** » Tue Jun 29, 2004 8:32 pm

No, never read Piers Anthony. Nice new picture Knightt_333!

Is that called an avatar?

sonicdan · Post by **sonicdan** » Tue Jun 29, 2004 10:50 pm

I think the butterfly story is "The Sound of Thunder" by Ray Bradbury.
I read it in the 8th grade and it always stuck with me. Classic!
DAN

MiamiLoco · Post by **MiamiLoco** » Wed Jun 30, 2004 2:21 am

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myron · Post by **myron** » Wed Jun 30, 2004 8:19 am

Too weird...

... Hey everyone, Knights got esp!

whetteon · Post by **whetteon** » Wed Jun 30, 2004 8:47 am

It was a 30 minute short made into a 2 hour movie? augh! I wonder if they will keep the storyline intact where they kill the hunter for breaking the rules by stepping off the path.

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Wed Jun 30, 2004 9:34 am

Knightt_333 wrote:They printed extra stories in those X-Files Digests ? As in drawn comic form stories ? I remember getting the Topps X-Files comics but passed on the digest formatted books. Were they any good ?

I enjoyed the first two. These are the comic digests with original X-Files stories in them, printed in the little bitty digest format. The first two were done by the original creative team for the comic who I thought were great. I didn't really care for the issues right after they left the comic and stopped buying it then, so I can't vouch for digest #3 and on (if they exist).

DJSpecter · Post by **DJSpecter** » Thu Jul 01, 2004 12:34 am

Back on topic, there is a problem with our original assumtion that the Lost Land came back after the Chaos effect. The issue before the Chaos effect in Turok, Turok throws Captain Red into a portal to the Lost Land. Meaning that Chaos did not "recreate" the lost land, it was always there, in a certain sense. Maybe this can be somehow related to the repeating dream of Erica "I wish that daddy wouldn't come..."

Hmmm, well, actually, Solar returned to "unreality" on a number of occasions.

I dunno.

-Dave

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Thu Jul 01, 2004 7:52 am

DJSpecter wrote:Back on topic, there is a problem with our original assumtion that the Lost Land came back after the Chaos effect. The issue before the Chaos effect in Turok, Turok throws Captain Red into a portal to the Lost Land. Meaning that Chaos did not "recreate" the lost land, it was always there, in a certain sense. Maybe this can be somehow related to the repeating dream of Erica "I wish that daddy wouldn't come..."

Hmmm, well, actually, Solar returned to "unreality" on a number of occasions.

I dunno.

-Dave

Not sure which "unreality" trip you're refering to, but most of "unreality" existed apart from the Lost Land.

Sending necromatic energy back to the beginning of time to form the Lost Land seemed silly since the Lost Land existed outside of time (Plus it's supposed to made out of necromatic energy?!? What were they thinking?!?).

In Unity 2000, Shooter inadvertantly gave credience to those later VH-1 Lost Land stories by having his characters return to the Lost Land. How? Different times in reality corresponded to moments in "absolute time" (the Lost Land). For instance the days in 1991 and in 4001 were the heroes entered the land corresponded with Unity Day 1. In order to go back to the Lost Land all you would have to do is find dates in "real time" that corresponded with a time BEFORE the events that destroyed the Lost Land, which is what happened to all the characters in U2000 #1 and Shooter's Shadowman on 9/9/1999 (he was eaten alive by an alligator when he was trying to get to the Lost Land, but saved by Elya on the other side).

Thus, in theory, the end of Chaos Effect correspended with the beginning of the Lost Land, so the necromatic energy could have been sent to that moment in "absolute time" (yeah, I still hate this "origin" for the Lost Land). It still doesn't help them with the ruins of Mothergod's fortress in the Lost Land...

DJSpecter · Post by **DJSpecter** » Thu Jul 01, 2004 8:15 am

Well sure, that is an interesting way to explain alot.

Since there are near random times that correspond with Lost Land times, looking at the lost land from the world would be like a really really bad case of epilepsy. Therefore, things could technically happen even after Solar destroyed the lost land.

Of course, once you say that you'd have to say that Solar couldn't really send everybody back exactly where they belonged, he'd have to send them to the nearest conducter of that lost land time corresponding to their original time.

Thats an interesting and very different approach to lost land philosophy.

Kudos.

Ryan · Post by **Ryan** » Thu Jun 20, 2024 9:54 am

Very interesting theories on the Lost Land. The problem with trying to figure out a 'science' to how the Lost Land works is that it's clear even the writers hadn't worked it out.

They rhyme and reason behind how Lost Land time worked relative to 'outside Earth' time is just whatever was needed for the current story that the writers were writing.

Shooter may have had some ideas on the matter but he didn't even script Unity 1 so how that played out was probably different than he intended (Turok going to 1987, Andar going to the 1800s, etc.)

So there's nothing to figure out, it just amounts to fans after the fact trying to piece together a theory based on lots of contradictory and arbitrary decisions made by the writers.

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