New Universe fans...

Knightt · Post by **Knightt** » Wed Nov 16, 2005 10:01 pm

Well if that is the case then... NO NO NO.... very clever Ric, but this G.I. aint gonna fall for it... nope nope nope...

Just how less we talkin' ?

Knightt · Post by **Knightt** » Thu Nov 17, 2005 1:24 am

Ahhh ok... I'm in.

NOW I just need to get some !! New Universe books that is...

Byrneout · Post by **Byrneout** » Thu Nov 17, 2005 4:25 am

Well, a mostly complete checklist would look like this:

New Universe (starting in 1986)

DP7 #1-#32
DP7 Annual #1

Justice #1-#32

Kickers, Inc. #1-#12

Marc Hazzard, MERC #1-#12
Marc Hazzard, MERC Annual #1

Nightmask #1-#12

Psi-Force #1-#32
Psi-Force Annual #1

Spitfire (& the Troubleshooters) #1-#13

Star Brand #1-#19
Star Brand Annual #1

**Note: Star Brand was published bi-monthly starting with issue #6, so although it has fewer issues than the longest running titles, it ran concurrently with the other titles until the cancellation of the New Universe.

The Pitt
The Draft
The War #1-#4

**Note: The Pitt and The Draft were graphic novels that brought about the end of the New Universe, and tied into the monthly titles around issue #30-#31 of each title.

Non "New Universe" published Crossovers:

Marvel Age #44, 47, 48, 50, 59
Quasar #31, 44, 45, 46, 54, 55, 56, 57
Exiles #72 (and presumably #73 and #74).

And according to some checklists I've seen:
Spider-Man 2099 #12, 13, 14, 25, 40, 41, 42, 44

So, all told to own EVERY appearance of the New Universe published by the New Universe:
174 books

To own EVERY appearance of the New Universe produced by Marvel:
198 (this includes the two unpublished issues of Exiles that will be coming out).

PS - Doesn't Marvel have a title coming out called the 198? Odd.

myron · Post by **myron** » Thu Nov 17, 2005 11:12 am

Byrneout wrote:<snip>

PS - Doesn't Marvel have a title coming out called the 198? Odd.

no...even...

(sorry for being OT...I couldn't resist...

)

davidb · Post by **davidb** » Thu Nov 17, 2005 11:50 am

I think that the 198 refers to how many mutants are left after House of M. Still, who knows anything about what's going on with Marvel anymore?

Byrneout · Post by **Byrneout** » Thu Nov 17, 2005 12:18 pm

Watch, gentlemen, as I borrow from one of my nutcase coworkers and create a semi-vapid (yet oddly plausible) conspiracy.

Marvel's "New Universe" tied into 198 issues of comics.

Marvel has stated that there will be a "New Universe" event in February.

A book titled "House Of M: The 198" is coming out.

What does this mean?

The New Universe is being folded into the Marvel Universe as a result of the Scarlet Witch's muddling with reality in the House Of M.

Woo!

Knightt · Post by **Knightt** » Thu Nov 17, 2005 12:30 pm

Nice...

If sales are down or if we just want to change $hit, all we have to do is devise a reality altering significant event. Heck, we can even bring dead characters back to life.

I grow tired of these things...

myron · Post by **myron** » Thu Nov 17, 2005 12:40 pm

Knightt wrote:Nice...

If sales are down or if we just want to change $hit, all we have to do is devise a reality altering significant event. Heck, we can even bring dead characters back to life.

I grow tired of these things...

basic marvel handwaving...

rkjock1 · Post by **rkjock1** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 3:07 pm

Um....

Not to be a spoil sport, but you fogot to add the Starblast Limited Series (#1-4) which would make the total number of New Universe issues 203 not 198. (Read below for the the 5th issue.)

And I don't think you can count the Marvel Age issues since those weren't comics, it was a news magazine. But if you are going to count it there was a really well done article on the New Universe comics before they were cancelled that laid out the next year of stories for the line in Marvel Age Annual #2.

So the 198 conspricy is out.

Just tryin ta help.

Byrneout · Post by **Byrneout** » Tue Dec 06, 2005 10:50 pm

rkjock1 wrote:Um....

Not to be a spoil sport, but you fogot to add the Starblast Limited Series (#1-4) which would make the total number of New Universe issues 203 not 198. (Read below for the the 5th issue.)

And I don't think you can count the Marvel Age issues since those weren't comics, it was a news magazine. But if you are going to count it there was a really well done article on the New Universe comics before they were cancelled that laid out the next year of stories for the line in Marvel Age Annual #2.

So the 198 conspricy is out.

Just tryin ta help.

Actually, you ASSIST my conspiracy theory!

See, I'll discount all five Marvel Age magazines, as you are correct that they were not truly comics. That brings my total down to 193.

Add in Starblast #1-4, which brings my total to 197.

Then I add in one more forgotten gem: Gambit #19. In that issue, Quiet Bill actually pierced the veil between dimensions to interact with Star Brand from the New Universe.

New total: 198

See? No amount of evidence will hinder me from my theory! Fact and coherent thought are MEANINGLESS when it comes time for a good CONSPIRACY!

davidb · Post by **davidb** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 12:18 pm

Straight from Newsarama's coverage of the Marvel conference call:

Getting to the anticipated announcement from the event, (Warren) Ellis’ next Marvel project will be the ongoing series Newuniversal (a working title). “They’re giving me the New Universe to play with,” Ellis revealed.
"I'm going to be doing many terrible things with the old New Universe books - clean stuff, as if the books had never been published before, so I won't be beholden to any of the older work."

Ellis' new take on the New Univese will include a "chunk of the old stuff and a slightly smaller chunk of new stuff, just to get the best story out of it."

Ellis named Nightmask as one of the more interesting concepts of the previous New Universe incarnation.

Asked if he was concerned about attaching himself to a failed experiiment from Marvel's past, Ellis equated his New Universe take to the revamped Battlestar Galactica series on the Sci-Fi Channel comapred to the original 70's ABC series.

Newuniversal will be an ongonig title, and will feature all of the characters of the New Universe. "I wanted to write a big ensemble book," Ellis said, "and the idea that hit me as I was flipping through the [original] stuff was that it all should have been one big story. To me, the people lost sight of that when they did it."

Ellis said that it will be written at a Marvel UNiverse level, and Marvel editors said that it would most likely be rated "T+".

The stories of Newuniversal will not be self-contained, Ellis said. "It will roll along."

The series is slated to be launched at the end of the summer.

Coinciding with the release of Newuniversal, there will be collections of the original New Universe titles released.

Editor Mark Pannicia will also be editing a preceding "New Universe" event celebrating the 20th Anniversary of the line. This New Universe event will feature stories set in the original continuity, however, pre-The Pitt.
Paniccia explained that the "Untold Tales of the New Universe" - which will be published a couple of months before the launch of Newuniversal - will feature five one-shots: StarBrand, NightMask, Justice, Psi-Force, and DP7. The other New Universe properties - Merc, Spitfire, and Kickers, Inc will appear as 8 page back-up stories - the first two in Amazing Fantasy, while Kickers, Inc will appear in New Avengers.

When asked what the attraction of the New Universe was for him, Ellis said that he's always wanted to take an old, forgotten franchise and "mess with it" as a technical challenge, to see if he can find what excited people about it in the first place, and bring that back out to the surface." ,p>"At the heart of it, it's science fiction, of course," Ellis said. "It's an event that suddenly, overnight, in the space of a minute, appears to literally change the laws of physics on Planet Earth."

svair · Post by **svair** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 12:24 pm

This months Previews does mention something about The New Universe Event

Byrneout · Post by **Byrneout** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 1:05 pm

Ellis is at the helm...

The Conspiracy grows, it beckons... maybe...

When The Scarlet Witch expend her power to reduce the number of mutants in Earth 616, all of their power (energy is neither created nor destroyed, only changed) creates a new "White Event" in a new universe!

The 198 will be the tie-in between Witch's actions and the creation of the new New Universe.

THE CONPIRACY HUNGERS...!

rkjock1 · Post by **rkjock1** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 4:28 pm

Hey, so now that the New Universe has been announced as an new ongoing is it still a Dead Universe??

We need to rethink this.

Knightt · Post by **Knightt** » Thu Dec 08, 2005 9:29 pm

I have never 'really' considered New Universe to be a 'dead universe' as Marvel still produces books and it seems that they just put NU on the back burner. Great news that this will once again see the light of day so it seems.

I guess to me a dead universe also encompasses the 'company'. Ultraverse is 'dead'... Crossgen is 'dead'... Continuity is 'dead'... and yes Valiant is also 'dead' but like New Universe it may hopefully one day live. Marvel is still around...

rkjock1 · Post by **rkjock1** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 1:22 pm

Well, I see your analogy and it bears weight, but...

Marvel also owns and for a short time published the Ultraverse which was bought from Malibu during the height of the Speculator 90's, so by that logic it also is not dead. (Wasn't Black Knight a member of UltraForce for awhile?)

Or, you could look at it as New U was a completely seperate entity in the same way as Wildstorm is from DC. If they ceased to publish Wildstorm titles it would likely end up on the Dead Universe list as well.

Just my 2 cents.

Knightt · Post by **Knightt** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 2:46 pm

Yes, I just knew someone was going to go there... BUT the Ultraverse Universe was originally started by Malibu and now they no longer produce comics... the Marvel/Ultraverse hybrid was just TERRIBLE and the whole Marvel buy out is related by me in another thread. I 'collect' the V2 of Ultraverse but roll my eyes everytime I pick up one that I need... Malibu is a dead universe and even though Marvel bought those 'rights' (for the wrong reasons), I still consider and maintain my point... to 'me' New Universe was a universe that Marvel created and then put on hold. Ultraverse that was created by Malibu is dead (and just happens to to have been printed for a while by Marvel)... again, this is just IMO. Perhapns not fair or level headed in some respects but at least I know that I am screwed up. LOL

rkjock1 · Post by **rkjock1** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 3:43 pm

As you've stated that it's your opinion, I'm not gonna say you're right or wrong. That would just be silly.

But... How do you feel about these?

1) Charlton Comics was purchased by DC. The characters are used regularly in the DC Universe and as of now, with the Captian Atom LS, used also in the Wildstorm Universe. Even further, DC published thier likenesses in the Watchmen LS. They have preserved some of the Charlton history such as CA's origin and cast and the legacy of Blue Beetle.

This is a universe that was started somewhere else but has been picked up and used again. Much like the Ultraverse, although admittedly still being published if not all that often being used.

Dead Universe or not?

2) Fawcett Comics. Purchased by DC for the exact same reason Ultraverse was purchased by Marvel (well, mostly the same reason. Still, the parallel is there.) All the Fawcett stories are, for the most part, considered "in continuity."

Dead Universe or not?

3) Impact Comics. Started by Archie, picked up by DC who published some good stuff and some junk. No longer being published by either company, although trades have recently been published of the older Archie stuff by a third party.

Dead Universe or not?

Knightt · Post by **Knightt** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 3:46 pm

hmmmm head hurts, so I will say... go with your heart.

davidb · Post by **davidb** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 3:46 pm

Here's another update from Ellis's email newsletter, again copied from Newsarama:

Ellis wrote:

Twenty years ago, Marvel tried to launch an entire secondary line of action books that straddled that sometimes-amorphous space between superhero fiction and science fiction. Despite the presence of writers like Archie Goodwin and the young Peter David, it died within two or three years. It was under-funded, generic, and really stands out as a failure of nerve and ambition. And they called it The New Universe.

In summer 2006, I'm going to be launching an ongoing title at Marvel called newuniversal. No capital N, no capital U. We refer to it in-house as NU -- and I might have called it NU, if it didn't always suggest nu-metal to me.

The central concept, these days, also looks kind of generic. Wild Cards did it, Rising Stars did it, etc etc. Something called The White Event occurs, and afterwards a handful of people are found to have been made superhuman. So far so blah. But, in looking at this stuff on a webpage one night, it occurred to me that that's not what happened. What actually happened was that there was this huge astronomical event where the skies went white all over the world for a minute, and the aftermath was that the laws of physics had been changed.

There's a sf book by a writer called Vernor Vinge where the laws of physics are radically different
depending on which part of the galaxy you're in. Conventional physics' dirty little secret is that the speed of light appears to fluctuate.

There is, as I say, a whole library of science fiction about superhumanity. These are not superhero novels. Some lean closer than others, of course – Zelazny and Saberhagen's Coils comes to mind, and Slan was very clearly a precedent to the X-Men. But there's a lot more that speaks to, if you like, the superhuman condition. Melding that with the notion that suddenly the laws of physics can go and stay slightly nuts... In one six-hour session, I generated a bunch of notes about how and why this could happen, with some ideas from some old abandoned projects of mine (from the Loose Ideas folder) fitting themselves into it...

Sure, it's not exactly cut from whole cloth. Like I said, it's a writing challenge. Blows the cobwebs out a bit. Makes you focus on the craft a bit. Sometimes it's worth sitting down and thinking, what *does* make a Marvel character work? (Answer: tragedy.)

rkjock1 · Post by **rkjock1** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 3:49 pm

BTW,

As for my own opinion, I figure New U was dead. If it's a distinct and seperate universe and it ceases to be published, then I think it's dead. That goes for Bravura, Ultraverse, Malibu, Crossgen, etc. and I would think the same of Wildstorm if it went under.

That having been said, I think Vertigo and the Ultimate lines are the 2 real exceptions to this since I don't consider them "distinct and seperate" from thier parent lines.

That having been said, I could not be more excited that New U is coming back. I loved the books in thier time, and I still enjoy reading them. The whole storyline that revolved around the Pitt/Draft/War was light years ahead of it's time and nothing like what anyone else was putting out. It's really a shame it never found it's audience then, I just hope to heck it can now.

I'm really happy they've attached Ellis to the project.

Nothing like a big name to bring in readers.

Knightt · Post by **Knightt** » Fri Dec 09, 2005 3:49 pm

Sounds good... whatever happens, I look forward to reading these books.

Not that I will be collecting these as I only collect Dead Universes.

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Sat Dec 10, 2005 8:09 am

davidb wrote:Straight from Newsarama's coverage of the Marvel conference call:

Getting to the anticipated announcement from the event, (Warren) Ellis’ next Marvel project will be the ongoing series Newuniversal (a working title). “They’re giving me the New Universe to play with,” Ellis revealed.

WOW

I knew something was up when NU was going to appear in a Marvel Handbook (why put a dead property in a Handbook?) but I thought it might be a appearance in a miniseries or crossover. Brief and quickly forgotten stuff.

But this is exactly how I pictured it really coming back (though I never thought would happen): a hot talent gets interested in it and they put out one title to follow all the characters. The reboot surprises me a little. I was hoping to see 17 years later stories but JMS is doing a fantastic thing with his "remake" of Squadron Supreme so NU could be good too. It'll be interesting at the very least. I'll definately give it a try.

The 20th aniversary of NU is funny. Celebrating the 20th anniversary of a universe that has been basically dead for 17 of those years...

And, yes, the old New Universe is still dead since it'll be another "New Universe" in the ongoing title. See? It still belongs here

Knightt · Post by **Knightt** » Sat Dec 10, 2005 12:11 pm

I have never read a single issue of this series of books. But I have researched and read the entire premise behind them and it sounds like a very good mix of super heroes based on a sci fi story. If I remember, these stories were 'thought' up by Jim Shooter ? And for that reason I may start to collect them. Hopefully on this 'rebirth' of the stories Marvel can put a new spin on them to make them interesting and scare up more interest than they did back in the day. There IS some kind of allure for these book that I have been trying to push off as that is ALL I need is ANOTHER set of books to collect.

But resistance may be futile... (<---- speaking of which, I have heard that statement or something like it for years... where is it from ? I am not trying to hijack the thread, just wanna know)

Another thing, if I am going to get these I better pick them up NOW as a resurgance may occur and these less than a quarter bin books may end up price hiking.

Todd Luck · Post by **Todd Luck** » Sat Dec 10, 2005 3:43 pm

Knightt wrote:I have never read a single issue of this series of books. But I have researched and read the entire premise behind them and it sounds like a very good mix of super heroes based on a sci fi story. If I remember, these stories were 'thought' up by Jim Shooter ? And for that reason I may start to collect them. Hopefully on this 'rebirth' of the stories Marvel can put a new spin on them to make them interesting and scare up more interest than they did back in the day. There IS some kind of allure for these book that I have been trying to push off as that is ALL I need is ANOTHER set of books to collect.

But resistance may be futile... (<---- speaking of which, I have heard that statement or something like it for years... where is it from ? I am not trying to hijack the thread, just wanna know)

Another thing, if I am going to get these I better pick them up NOW as a resurgance may occur and these less than a quarter bin books may end up price hiking.

"Resistance is futile" the tag line from the Borg on Star Trek, I believe.

Shooter came up with the CONCEPT behind the New Universe as a whole, that it would be a universe set "in the world outside your window." He wrote one book (Star Brand). He was blamed when it failed. That's about the extent of his involvement from what I understand.

He had almost no budget for the line so he took whatever concepts and talents he could get (the rest of the concepts were mainly created by Marvel editors). The writing quality on a lot of the books was lacking though their were plenty of bright spots like Peter David's work on Merc and Justice and Shooter's work on Star Brand.

ValiantFans.com Board - Since 2004

New Universe fans...

I don't think so on the 198 thing

Re: I don't think so on the 198 thing

New Universe

Dead is dead!

Ultraverse

NU