VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
Interesting. I need to re-read U2K. It's just kind of a slog reading the full script with the blurry low-res pages.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 10:13:04 am Use Omar's mistake of showing U2K Phil holding Solar #1 from VALIANT instead of Doctor Solar from Gold Key to explain that they were indeed all fictional, heh.
Shooter did include the "real" Solar in the story, serving a sentence in purgatory where he is forced to rewatch the fusion meltdown for all eternity.
I guess I don't like the part that the VH1 characters were erased at the end. So they basically brought Shooter in to kill his own universe? Maybe that's why the story isn't any good.
If magic ink and wish machines are the explanation, then any combination of characters can be kept.
Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
JJ Abrams Star Trek...
Remaking a classic by total reboot is hard to do. I'm sure there are examples that have worked, but I'm drawing a blank. I think it's even harder in comics, where the history and continuity is such a big deal.
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
No. Nononononononono NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. That movie was not a real movie and cannot hurt me anymore.
Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
Struck a nerve there. I'll use this next time Kelvin timelineChiclo wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 1:39:56 pmNo. Nononononononono NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. That movie was not a real movie and cannot hurt me anymore.
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
As I see it, Alien/DMG needs to stay committed to Dines's VEI reboot. NO MORE REBOOTS, no backtracking, etc.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 1:31:46 pmInteresting. I need to re-read U2K. It's just kind of a slog reading the full script with the blurry low-res pages.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 10:13:04 am Use Omar's mistake of showing U2K Phil holding Solar #1 from VALIANT instead of Doctor Solar from Gold Key to explain that they were indeed all fictional, heh.
Shooter did include the "real" Solar in the story, serving a sentence in purgatory where he is forced to rewatch the fusion meltdown for all eternity.
I guess I don't like the part that the VH1 characters were erased at the end. So they basically brought Shooter in to kill his own universe? Maybe that's why the story isn't any good.
If magic ink and wish machines are the explanation, then any combination of characters can be kept.
That doesn't mean that an explanation of the relationship between the three universes shouldn't be published. I've laid out what my version would be, which I believe respects everything that came before.
Comics are like a Rorschach test, everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
That was Star Trek for dummies. For really dumb dummies. Even The Stupids thought it was too stupid for them.Chiclo wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 1:39:56 pmNo. Nononononononono NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. That movie was not a real movie and cannot hurt me anymore.
Comics are like a Rorschach test, everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
VEI's reboot is to VH 1 what DC's Post Crisis was to the Silver Age.
To go back to VH 1 would make as much sense as it would to go back to the Silver Age, which is none.
What VEI lacks is merely a bridge between the three iterations of VALIANT the way DC had between the Golden, Silver, and Modern Ages.
To go back to VH 1 would make as much sense as it would to go back to the Silver Age, which is none.
What VEI lacks is merely a bridge between the three iterations of VALIANT the way DC had between the Golden, Silver, and Modern Ages.
Comics are like a Rorschach test, everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
I don't see why they can't just co-exist, just like Marvel 2099, DC Elseworlds, etc. etc. The VEI continuity keeps continuing through the new comics, and the VH1 universe can be used in special projects with a distinction like Valiant Classic or something. No explanations needed.
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
It would be cutting off their nose to spite their face, though. Publishing one version of X-O Manowar for fans of the VH 1 version and another for fans of the VEI version. Publishing comics is not cheap.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:27:56 pm I don't see why they can't just co-exist, just like Marvel 2099, DC Elseworlds, etc. etc. The VEI continuity keeps continuing through the new comics, and the VH1 universe can be used in special projects with a distinction like Valiant Classic or something. No explanations needed.
Imagine if when VALIANT reimagined Doctor Solar fans of the Gold Key original had insisted that they also publish a separate series with the original version.
Comics are like a Rorschach test, everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
Separate imprints with different continuities are common throughout comics and have been for a long time. I don't think it's comparable to Gold Key Solar.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:42:00 pmIt would be cutting off their nose to spite their face, though. Publishing one version of X-O Manowar for fans of the VH 1 version and another for fans of the VEI version. Publishing comics is not cheap.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:27:56 pm I don't see why they can't just co-exist, just like Marvel 2099, DC Elseworlds, etc. etc. The VEI continuity keeps continuing through the new comics, and the VH1 universe can be used in special projects with a distinction like Valiant Classic or something. No explanations needed.
Imagine if when VALIANT reimagined Doctor Solar fans of the Gold Key original had insisted that they also publish a separate series with the original version.
In your version, if Vh1 is so irrelevant that it can't stand on its own, then there's no reason to incorporate them into VEI. May as well just continue with VEI and subtly make the characters more like Vh1 if that's what you want. No need to involve magic ink or wish machines.
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
Well, as I see it, that connection can make that work. Such as, for instance, Archer retaking his journey to become a spiritual leader, something that hasn't been present since VH 2 took that away.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 3:26:55 pmSeparate imprints with different continuities are common throughout comics and have been for a long time. I don't think it's comparable to Gold Key Solar.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:42:00 pmIt would be cutting off their nose to spite their face, though. Publishing one version of X-O Manowar for fans of the VH 1 version and another for fans of the VEI version. Publishing comics is not cheap.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:27:56 pm I don't see why they can't just co-exist, just like Marvel 2099, DC Elseworlds, etc. etc. The VEI continuity keeps continuing through the new comics, and the VH1 universe can be used in special projects with a distinction like Valiant Classic or something. No explanations needed.
Imagine if when VALIANT reimagined Doctor Solar fans of the Gold Key original had insisted that they also publish a separate series with the original version.
In your version, if Vh1 is so irrelevant that it can't stand on its own, then there's no reason to incorporate them into VEI. May as well just continue with VEI and subtly make the characters more like Vh1 if that's what you want. No need to involve magic ink or wish machines.
Comics are like a Rorschach test, everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
Did you see much benefit to the Q2 mini series?
Comics are like a Rorschach test, everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
I'm just speaking from a practicality standpoint. They're already doing stories with Archer as Faith's boyfriend. I just don't think the universes are compatible without a major, reality altering event and I don't think that's practical right now.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 3:47:35 pm Well, as I see it, that connection can make that work. Such as, for instance, Archer retaking his journey to become a spiritual leader, something that hasn't been present since VH 2 took that away.
Personally, no. But that's only because I'm not very interested in Q&W or VH2.
Now if it had been a mini-series of Bob Hall picking up where he left VH1 Jack or Shooter doing Harbinger in VH1 continuity I would have definitely loved that and seen a lot of benefit.
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
They can't co-exist, that's for sure.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 4:27:34 pmI'm just speaking from a practicality standpoint. They're already doing stories with Archer as Faith's boyfriend. I just don't think the universes are compatible without a major, reality altering event and I don't think that's practical right now.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 3:47:35 pm Well, as I see it, that connection can make that work. Such as, for instance, Archer retaking his journey to become a spiritual leader, something that hasn't been present since VH 2 took that away.
Personally, no. But that's only because I'm not very interested in Q&W or VH2.
Now if it had been a mini-series of Bob Hall picking up where he left VH1 Jack or Shooter doing Harbinger in VH1 continuity I would have definitely loved that and seen a lot of benefit.
Those types of stories would be great extras in the reprints.
Comics are like a Rorschach test, everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
8 or 10 pagers in the back of reprints just aren't enough, as we've seen. Q2 got 5 issues. The fact that it took place in VH2 instead of VEI had no harmful effects on the main VEI books.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 4:44:01 pm
They can't co-exist, that's for sure.
Those types of stories would be great extras in the reprints.
All I'm saying is the same thing could be done with VH1, and it wouldn't affect the mainline VEI-continuity comics they're putting out. There doesn't need be a Crisis/Unity 2K for that to happen.
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
Yeah, VALIANT never would have printed an Original Solar comic.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:42:00 pmIt would be cutting off their nose to spite their face, though. Publishing one version of X-O Manowar for fans of the VH 1 version and another for fans of the VEI version. Publishing comics is not cheap.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:27:56 pm I don't see why they can't just co-exist, just like Marvel 2099, DC Elseworlds, etc. etc. The VEI continuity keeps continuing through the new comics, and the VH1 universe can be used in special projects with a distinction like Valiant Classic or something. No explanations needed.
Imagine if when VALIANT reimagined Doctor Solar fans of the Gold Key original had insisted that they also publish a separate series with the original version.
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
Those were reprints. Of which only the Magnus, and, arguably, Turok ones can be considered canonical.Chiclo wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 7:16:16 pmYeah, VALIANT never would have printed an Original Solar comic.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:42:00 pmIt would be cutting off their nose to spite their face, though. Publishing one version of X-O Manowar for fans of the VH 1 version and another for fans of the VEI version. Publishing comics is not cheap.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:27:56 pm I don't see why they can't just co-exist, just like Marvel 2099, DC Elseworlds, etc. etc. The VEI continuity keeps continuing through the new comics, and the VH1 universe can be used in special projects with a distinction like Valiant Classic or something. No explanations needed.
Imagine if when VALIANT reimagined Doctor Solar fans of the Gold Key original had insisted that they also publish a separate series with the original version.
Comics are like a Rorschach test, everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
It's not about the effect it would have on canon, but the effect it would have on the production expenses. I don't think it would be wise for Alien to spend time, money, and resources on publishing comics with two or three disparate versions of the same characters.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 6:33:32 pm8 or 10 pagers in the back of reprints just aren't enough, as we've seen. Q2 got 5 issues. The fact that it took place in VH2 instead of VEI had no harmful effects on the main VEI books.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 4:44:01 pm
They can't co-exist, that's for sure.
Those types of stories would be great extras in the reprints.
All I'm saying is the same thing could be done with VH1, and it wouldn't affect the mainline VEI-continuity comics they're putting out. There doesn't need be a Crisis/Unity 2K for that to happen.
Comics are like a Rorschach test, everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
Yes. VALIANT published a parallel version of Solar, closer to the Gold Key than VALIANT version, at the same time.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:04:56 pmThose were reprints. Of which only the Magnus, and, arguably, Turok ones can be considered canonical.Chiclo wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 7:16:16 pmYeah, VALIANT never would have printed an Original Solar comic.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:42:00 pmIt would be cutting off their nose to spite their face, though. Publishing one version of X-O Manowar for fans of the VH 1 version and another for fans of the VEI version. Publishing comics is not cheap.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:27:56 pm I don't see why they can't just co-exist, just like Marvel 2099, DC Elseworlds, etc. etc. The VEI continuity keeps continuing through the new comics, and the VH1 universe can be used in special projects with a distinction like Valiant Classic or something. No explanations needed.
Imagine if when VALIANT reimagined Doctor Solar fans of the Gold Key original had insisted that they also publish a separate series with the original version.
Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
Just a difference of opinion then. They're already publishing their VEI universe titles. You're suggesting a massive event that would change all the characters and their entire publishing plan. I'm saying it would be easier and more practical to publish a book like Q2 but with VH1 to test the waters and see if there's any interest in the old universe. But it's just my opinion, I could be wrong.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:06:02 pm It's not about the effect it would have on canon, but the effect it would have on the production expenses. I don't think it would be wise for Alien to spend time, money, and resources on publishing comics with two or three disparate versions of the same characters.
Not that I wouldn't like a big event comic like Crisis, that could be cool.
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
It wasn't new material, it was a reprint. Alien does reprints of the old material all the time.Chiclo wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:15:16 pmYes. VALIANT published a parallel version of Solar, closer to the Gold Key than VALIANT version, at the same time.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:04:56 pmThose were reprints. Of which only the Magnus, and, arguably, Turok ones can be considered canonical.Chiclo wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 7:16:16 pmYeah, VALIANT never would have printed an Original Solar comic.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:42:00 pmIt would be cutting off their nose to spite their face, though. Publishing one version of X-O Manowar for fans of the VH 1 version and another for fans of the VEI version. Publishing comics is not cheap.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 2:27:56 pm I don't see why they can't just co-exist, just like Marvel 2099, DC Elseworlds, etc. etc. The VEI continuity keeps continuing through the new comics, and the VH1 universe can be used in special projects with a distinction like Valiant Classic or something. No explanations needed.
Imagine if when VALIANT reimagined Doctor Solar fans of the Gold Key original had insisted that they also publish a separate series with the original version.
Comics are like a Rorschach test, everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
It need not be a big event, though. Just Tama, the current Geomancer, piercing the veil to see the truth about the nature of the universe.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:22:43 pmJust a difference of opinion then. They're already publishing their VEI universe titles. You're suggesting a massive event that would change all the characters and their entire publishing plan. I'm saying it would be easier and more practical to publish a book like Q2 but with VH1 to test the waters and see if there's any interest in the old universe. But it's just my opinion, I could be wrong.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:06:02 pm It's not about the effect it would have on canon, but the effect it would have on the production expenses. I don't think it would be wise for Alien to spend time, money, and resources on publishing comics with two or three disparate versions of the same characters.
Not that I wouldn't like a big event comic like Crisis, that could be cool.
Comics are like a Rorschach test, everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...
Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
Cool, I'd like to see it.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:29:57 pmIt need not be a big event, though. Just Tama, the current Geomancer, piercing the veil to see the truth about the nature of the universe.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:22:43 pmJust a difference of opinion then. They're already publishing their VEI universe titles. You're suggesting a massive event that would change all the characters and their entire publishing plan. I'm saying it would be easier and more practical to publish a book like Q2 but with VH1 to test the waters and see if there's any interest in the old universe. But it's just my opinion, I could be wrong.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:06:02 pm It's not about the effect it would have on canon, but the effect it would have on the production expenses. I don't think it would be wise for Alien to spend time, money, and resources on publishing comics with two or three disparate versions of the same characters.
Not that I wouldn't like a big event comic like Crisis, that could be cool.
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Re: VH 0 Phil and VH 1 Aric
Me too.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:36:36 pmCool, I'd like to see it.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:29:57 pmIt need not be a big event, though. Just Tama, the current Geomancer, piercing the veil to see the truth about the nature of the universe.Ryan wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:22:43 pmJust a difference of opinion then. They're already publishing their VEI universe titles. You're suggesting a massive event that would change all the characters and their entire publishing plan. I'm saying it would be easier and more practical to publish a book like Q2 but with VH1 to test the waters and see if there's any interest in the old universe. But it's just my opinion, I could be wrong.ManofTheAtom wrote: ↑Fri Feb 16, 2024 8:06:02 pm It's not about the effect it would have on canon, but the effect it would have on the production expenses. I don't think it would be wise for Alien to spend time, money, and resources on publishing comics with two or three disparate versions of the same characters.
Not that I wouldn't like a big event comic like Crisis, that could be cool.
Comics are like a Rorschach test, everyone has a different opinion on what they are and can be...