Serious question...what did Heather Antos actually *do*?

[Oxmyx]

Besides *SQUEE* all sorts of people off on social media, and probably be adored by a few people who aren't buying Valiant, and be a bad face for DMG Valiant, what did she actually do?

I mean, certainly she was present during the downfall of modern Valiant, but I can't blame her for THAT

But what effect did she have on the comics themselves?

I ask because I've run into her name and presence again in looking into the IDW book Star Trek GODSHOCK. Apparently her social politics are felt there, too, and unlike this board, she is greeted with appreciation by some. Not all.

[ManofTheAtom]

I've been asking the same thing.

Some people answered me in one of these threads. Try searching for her name and see what pops up.

[nycjadie]

I know she was editing books for Valiant that were never released.

I saw her on a panel and she mixed up Valiant characters. She seemed more interested in flipping her hair and looking cute than showing knowledge and excitement for the stories.

That’s not to say I don’t think she was not a good editor, I’m just saying that was my experience.

And I would have left Valiant too if I was working on things that never got published.

I’m not sure why she has been the source of vitriol, much of it mysoginistic. But there has to be someone for those nut jobs to pick on.

[Oxmyx]

I've been asking the same thing.

Some people answered me in one of these threads. Try searching for her name and see what pops up.

Excellent advice. I kinda did. Might keep looking.

http://www.valiantfans.com/forum/viewto ... 8#p1120988

[greg]

That’s not to say I don’t think she was not a good editor, I’m just saying that was my experience.

confusedmath.jpg

[Oxmyx]

That’s not to say I don’t think she was not a good editor, I’m just saying that was my experience.

confusedmath.jpg

Haha! Good one, Greg.

I found more thoughts:
http://www.valiantfans.com/forum/viewto ... 8#p1119363

[nycjadie]

That’s not to say I don’t think she was not a good editor, I’m just saying that was my experience.

confusedmath.jpg

Us attorneys love the doubles and triples.

[ManofTheAtom]

I've been asking the same thing.

Some people answered me in one of these threads. Try searching for her name and see what pops up.

Excellent advice. I kinda did. Might keep looking.

http://www.valiantfans.com/forum/viewto ... 8#p1120988

Nice.

[Sunlight on Snow]

The problem is HW2 -- what was promised and what was actually published.

It turned out to be a really *SQUEE* event and putting flagship characters like Bloodshot and XO in weird situations, while turning Livewire into a persona non grata. Which is the weirdest thing! I'm still asking myself why they'd done it? Because in the VU no hero is truly safe.... or to kick DMG in the nuts!?!

[ManofTheAtom]

The problem is HW2 -- what was promised and what was actually published.

It turned out to be a really *SQUEE* event and putting flagship characters like Bloodshot and XO in weird situations, while turning Livewire into a persona non grata. Which is the weirdest thing! I'm still asking myself why they'd done it? Because in the VU no hero is truly safe.... or to kick DMG in the nuts!?!

How much time did it take them to create the replacement story?

it sounds a lot like what happened with VH 2's Final Solution, particularly Troublemakers #19. They ended up scrapping what they intended to publish to instead wrap it all up in 22/24 pages.

[IMJ]

The role in the decline of the books for elements of virtue-signaling and SJW themes was obvious even during their publication, but I think more importantly it is very telling that there are people here who previously dug-in violently on their defense of that and denial of these themes as "problems", yet now would post here in this thread as if they saw the truth regarding this woman all along.

And so as the dust clears from the last years of disastrously failed comic books, I can honestly say that I don't know what was worse - the racism that was the woke-agenda or the peasant-thinkers who defended it and revealed themselves to literally be the same people that stormed Frankenstein's castle and burned witches at the stake in Salem. You know who you aaaarrrreeeeeee.....

And it's the revealing of these personalities that galvanize me into action - it was never actually the books, they are just comics after all. But the witch-hunters are real creatures out in society believing that they are the main character.

[ManofTheAtom]

The role in the decline of the books for elements of virtue-signaling and SJW themes was obvious even during their publication, but I think more importantly it is very telling that there are people here who dug-in on their defense of that and denial of these themes as "problems" yet now would post here in this thread as if they saw the truth regarding this woman all along.

And so as the dust clears from the last years of disastrously failed comic books, I can honestly say that I don't know what was worse - the racism that was the woke-agenda or the peasant-thinkers who defended it and revealed themselves to literally be the same people that stormed Frankenstein's castle and burned witches at the stake in Salem. You know who you aaaarrrreeeeeee.....

And it's the revealing of these personalities that galvanize me into action - it was never actually the books, they are just comics after all. But the witch-hunters are real creatures out in society believing that they are the main character.

What form did that virtue signaling and SJW themes take in the books she edited? How were they portrayed?

[IMJ]

The role in the decline of the books for elements of virtue-signaling and SJW themes was obvious even during their publication, but I think more importantly it is very telling that there are people here who dug-in on their defense of that and denial of these themes as "problems" yet now would post here in this thread as if they saw the truth regarding this woman all along.

And so as the dust clears from the last years of disastrously failed comic books, I can honestly say that I don't know what was worse - the racism that was the woke-agenda or the peasant-thinkers who defended it and revealed themselves to literally be the same people that stormed Frankenstein's castle and burned witches at the stake in Salem. You know who you aaaarrrreeeeeee.....

And it's the revealing of these personalities that galvanize me into action - it was never actually the books, they are just comics after all. But the witch-hunters are real creatures out in society believing that they are the main character.

What form did that virtue signaling and SJW themes take in the books she edited? How were they portrayed?

Nah, there is no need for citation or rampant exemplification of this content anymore. When information has permeated the public domain so widely there is no need for me to play your game. So sorry. You lost. You only have your continued banter of BS. It's over. Woke $#!( has diminished the entire industry so badly that they don't even want to report sales figures anymore.

But by all means, please keep believing otherwise.

MOTA hanging on to his nonsense at all costs:




Keep fighting the good fight, buddy! Wear a fire blanket though when you are box diving for appearances of Snowflake and Safespace......

[leonmallett]

The role in the decline of the books for elements of virtue-signaling and SJW themes was obvious even during their publication, but I think more importantly it is very telling that there are people here who dug-in on their defense of that and denial of these themes as "problems" yet now would post here in this thread as if they saw the truth regarding this woman all along.

And so as the dust clears from the last years of disastrously failed comic books, I can honestly say that I don't know what was worse - the racism that was the woke-agenda or the peasant-thinkers who defended it and revealed themselves to literally be the same people that stormed Frankenstein's castle and burned witches at the stake in Salem. You know who you aaaarrrreeeeeee.....

And it's the revealing of these personalities that galvanize me into action - it was never actually the books, they are just comics after all. But the witch-hunters are real creatures out in society believing that they are the main character.

What form did that virtue signaling and SJW themes take in the books she edited? How were they portrayed?

Nah, there is no need for citation or rampant exemplification of this content anymore. When information has permeated the public domain so widely there is no need for me to play your game. So sorry. You lost. You only have your continued banter of BS. It's over. Woke $#!( has diminished the entire industry so badly that they don't even want to report sales figures anymore.

But by all means, please keep believing otherwise.

MOTA hanging on to his nonsense at all costs:




Keep fighting the good fight, buddy! Wear a fire blanket though when you are box diving for appearances of Snowflake and Safespace......

So no evidence that you can offer then?

[ManofTheAtom]

The role in the decline of the books for elements of virtue-signaling and SJW themes was obvious even during their publication, but I think more importantly it is very telling that there are people here who dug-in on their defense of that and denial of these themes as "problems" yet now would post here in this thread as if they saw the truth regarding this woman all along.

And so as the dust clears from the last years of disastrously failed comic books, I can honestly say that I don't know what was worse - the racism that was the woke-agenda or the peasant-thinkers who defended it and revealed themselves to literally be the same people that stormed Frankenstein's castle and burned witches at the stake in Salem. You know who you aaaarrrreeeeeee.....

And it's the revealing of these personalities that galvanize me into action - it was never actually the books, they are just comics after all. But the witch-hunters are real creatures out in society believing that they are the main character.

What form did that virtue signaling and SJW themes take in the books she edited? How were they portrayed?

Nah, there is no need for citation or rampant exemplification of this content anymore. When information has permeated the public domain so widely there is no need for me to play your game. So sorry. You lost. You only have your continued banter of BS. It's over. Woke $#!( has diminished the entire industry so badly that they don't even want to report sales figures anymore.

But by all means, please keep believing otherwise.

MOTA hanging on to his nonsense at all costs:




Keep fighting the good fight, buddy! Wear a fire blanket though when you are box diving for appearances of Snowflake and Safespace......

You lost me. What was that rant for?

[Oxmyx]

The role in the decline of the books for elements of virtue-signaling and SJW themes was obvious even during their publication...

This isn't a game, so you aren't playing our game or anyone else's. It's a serious question. Your help is greatly appreciated...but your ranting is entirely unhelpful. I 100% can see wokeism in other publishers, like making Superman's son bi (IIRC) but what did Antos actually do? (besides not care about the characters/universe/titles, and social media)

[lorddunlow]

The role in the decline of the books for elements of virtue-signaling and SJW themes was obvious even during their publication, but I think more importantly it is very telling that there are people here who dug-in on their defense of that and denial of these themes as "problems" yet now would post here in this thread as if they saw the truth regarding this woman all along.

And so as the dust clears from the last years of disastrously failed comic books, I can honestly say that I don't know what was worse - the racism that was the woke-agenda or the peasant-thinkers who defended it and revealed themselves to literally be the same people that stormed Frankenstein's castle and burned witches at the stake in Salem. You know who you aaaarrrreeeeeee.....

And it's the revealing of these personalities that galvanize me into action - it was never actually the books, they are just comics after all. But the witch-hunters are real creatures out in society believing that they are the main character.

What form did that virtue signaling and SJW themes take in the books she edited? How were they portrayed?

Nah, there is no need for citation or rampant exemplification of this content anymore. When information has permeated the public domain so widely there is no need for me to play your game. So sorry. You lost. You only have your continued banter of BS. It's over. Woke $#!( has diminished the entire industry so badly that they don't even want to report sales figures anymore.

But by all means, please keep believing otherwise.

MOTA hanging on to his nonsense at all costs:




Keep fighting the good fight, buddy! Wear a fire blanket though when you are box diving for appearances of Snowflake and Safespace......

So no evidence that you can offer then?

[daniellew61]

A bunch of Livewire with Vita and Raul Allen, then Quantum & Woody y Christopher Hastings with art by Ryan Browne (the promo poster for it she worked on for me to send to retailers with QUANTUM AND WOODY doing Goat Yoga was super fun), X-O Manowar Dennis Hopeless w/ Emilio Laiso, Shadowman with Cullen Bunn and Jon Davis-Hunt was her till Lysa Hawkins took it over when she left, Savage with Max Bemis and Nate Stockman, and Harbinger with Jackson Lanzing, Collin Kelly, and Robbi Rodriguez Final Witness didn't get released. I'm pretty positive she also brought in a lot of cover artists for other titles too but I'm not sure which ones. That's the ones that all came out.

[slack]

A bunch of Livewire with Vita and Raul Allen, then Quantum & Woody y Christopher Hastings with art by Ryan Browne (the promo poster for it she worked on for me to send to retailers with QUANTUM AND WOODY doing Goat Yoga was super fun), X-O Manowar Dennis Hopeless w/ Emilio Laiso, Shadowman with Cullen Bunn and Jon Davis-Hunt was her till Lysa Hawkins took it over when she left, Savage with Max Bemis and Nate Stockman, and Harbinger with Jackson Lanzing, Collin Kelly, and Robbi Rodriguez Final Witness didn't get released. I'm pretty positive she also brought in a lot of cover artists for other titles too but I'm not sure which ones. That's the ones that all came out.

The XO was insultingly bad, Livewire was weak and just ruined the character, and I feel like the Savage sequel was truly awful.
Shadowman was pretty decent, Quantum and Woody always has potential, and I still want to know what Final Witness was gonna be... it had me really interested.

[ManofTheAtom]

A bunch of Livewire with Vita and Raul Allen, then Quantum & Woody y Christopher Hastings with art by Ryan Browne (the promo poster for it she worked on for me to send to retailers with QUANTUM AND WOODY doing Goat Yoga was super fun), X-O Manowar Dennis Hopeless w/ Emilio Laiso, Shadowman with Cullen Bunn and Jon Davis-Hunt was her till Lysa Hawkins took it over when she left, Savage with Max Bemis and Nate Stockman, and Harbinger with Jackson Lanzing, Collin Kelly, and Robbi Rodriguez Final Witness didn't get released. I'm pretty positive she also brought in a lot of cover artists for other titles too but I'm not sure which ones. That's the ones that all came out.

Ok, those were the comics and creators, which sounds cool. But, content-wise, what was woke about them?

When it comes to the term "wokeness", I've noticed that it doesn't take much for people to get upset about the slightest thing.

For instance, we're at a point that if Tomb Raider debuted today people would call her "woke Indiana Jones", when all she is is nothing more and nothing less than an adventurer in the vein of Jones who just happens to be a woman.

[ManofTheAtom]

People of late tend to be exceedingly reactionary when they see anything they deem to be "woke", which makes it difficult, and sometimes even impossible, to properly determine if what they are complaining about really rises to the level of being complete and utter *SQUEE*.

Case in point, Marvel's New Warriors was absolutely and unquestionably a giant pile of depthless wokeness wrapped up in a superhero costume. It was superficial *SQUEE*, so much so that all one needed to dismiss it as such as to literally judge it based on its cover.

Without any similar concrete evidence, though, it is difficult to determine if the same is true of Antos' VALIANT because, unlike New Warriors, the images alone are not enough to tell the whole story. One needs to know more about the specific details to properly determine if it was indeed "woke crap".

All I know about Antos is that people got really upset with her because she got a milkshake like a decade ago or something.

374206576_10159590466402267_413564401089233832_n.jpg

[ManofTheAtom]

I would say that "wokeness" is when fiction fails to properly reflect the world outside our window in terms of inclusion, diversity, and such things.

So, the question becomes, where does the intersection between VALIANT being set in the world outside our window and properly reflecting that world lay? And how can it avoid coming off as woke?

People who object to wokeness would likely point their accusing finger at Jack Boniface being a Creole man cast in a major role in a superhero comic book.

In the '90s, VALIANT managed to do inclusion and diversity considerably better than most comic books, TV shows, and movies do today.

For instance, Trinity Angels aside, which don't much count as VALIANT-esque, VALIANT proper spared us from the bad girl trend that objectified women.

[Sunlight on Snow]

A bunch of Livewire with Vita and Raul Allen, then Quantum & Woody y Christopher Hastings with art by Ryan Browne (the promo poster for it she worked on for me to send to retailers with QUANTUM AND WOODY doing Goat Yoga was super fun), X-O Manowar Dennis Hopeless w/ Emilio Laiso, Shadowman with Cullen Bunn and Jon Davis-Hunt was her till Lysa Hawkins took it over when she left, Savage with Max Bemis and Nate Stockman, and Harbinger with Jackson Lanzing, Collin Kelly, and Robbi Rodriguez Final Witness didn't get released. I'm pretty positive she also brought in a lot of cover artists for other titles too but I'm not sure which ones. That's the ones that all came out.

The XO was insultingly bad, Livewire was weak and just ruined the character, and I feel like the Savage sequel was truly awful.
Shadowman was pretty decent, Quantum and Woody always has potential, and I still want to know what Final Witness was gonna be... it had me really interested.

Nope, HW2 ruined Livewire's character! -- And there really isn't any arguing about that.

Livewire, the series, was weak but the character was already ruined.

You're spot on about everything else.

[slack]

A bunch of Livewire with Vita and Raul Allen, then Quantum & Woody y Christopher Hastings with art by Ryan Browne (the promo poster for it she worked on for me to send to retailers with QUANTUM AND WOODY doing Goat Yoga was super fun), X-O Manowar Dennis Hopeless w/ Emilio Laiso, Shadowman with Cullen Bunn and Jon Davis-Hunt was her till Lysa Hawkins took it over when she left, Savage with Max Bemis and Nate Stockman, and Harbinger with Jackson Lanzing, Collin Kelly, and Robbi Rodriguez Final Witness didn't get released. I'm pretty positive she also brought in a lot of cover artists for other titles too but I'm not sure which ones. That's the ones that all came out.

The XO was insultingly bad, Livewire was weak and just ruined the character, and I feel like the Savage sequel was truly awful.
Shadowman was pretty decent, Quantum and Woody always has potential, and I still want to know what Final Witness was gonna be... it had me really interested.

Nope, HW2 ruined Livewire's character! -- And there really isn't any arguing about that.

Livewire, the series, was weak but the character was already ruined.

You're spot on about everything else.

I'll give you the HW2, but Ayala made it worse.

[IMJ]

And the blabbering and circular logic continues... But where it used to the mania on a ratio of 15:100 maniacs to normal and relatively silent majority while cities burned, now it's down to the three or four remnant posters who simply can't see or explain - gasp- the world outside their window.

Call it a "rant", call it "seeing woke in your sleep!", but that's all some of you guys have got - circular point making and pretend-analysis while the hobby burns around you. True insanity and lack of perspective exchanged for 'zingers' (i.e., "everyone sees "woke" in everything!") as movies fail. comic sales are non-existent.

Unbelievable.

I'll be clear, all some of you guys, like MOTA, have is a "comeback" (i.e., "people are just seeing 'woke' in their sleep"). Okay, it's just "words". You've got nothing of merit other than digging in, blind to the reality of the whole thing. And I'm honestly fine with my point here stands as written - the very few of you will just keep it up until you are talking to an empty room about defending this nonsense.

Let me guess for the peasant-thinkers - "rant" rather than "Truth", right?