Harbinger: Renegade #4 Discussion

[grendeljd]

If anyone would like to hear our OTV:VCR podcast discussing/reviewing this issue [and Divinity III #3], please follow the link;

http://onlythevaliant.com/episodes/vcr105/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thanks to any who listen in

[Keith]

I enjoyed this issue and the arc overall. I thought it did a great job explaining what Solomon is all about as well as introducing the current worldview that, along with Solomon's manipulations, bring the Renegades back together.

Stormbringer = Jay Tucker. Calling it now.

[jmatt]

I still get the sense that everything is going according to Solomon's plan. And that Jay is a plant. Or being controlled somehow (or will be).

[nonplayer]

I liked it. Solomon is interesting. Can't wait to see more powers.

[Dallow Spicer1]

Good issue, good first arc. Apart from some dubious dialogue in issue #3 I think Roberts has done an excellent job with this series so far and I'm looking forward to see how he continues to flesh out these characters. Solomon has been a great addition to the VEI character fold and I'm optimistic for what they can do with this character.

Not overly keen on Robertson's art but it's ok. Peter seems to have physically matured considerably with the beard and on the preview for 'Massacre' he's also been draw like a fully grown man rather than the late teen he was before, not sure if this is on purpose or just artist interpretation.

4/5 - enjoyable

[jmatt]

Peter seems to have physically matured considerably with the beard and on the preview for 'Massacre' he's also been draw like a fully grown man rather than the late teen he was before, not sure if this is on purpose or just artist interpretation.

Well, it's been five years since we first met Pete. If he was 17 or 18 then, he's 22 or 23 now.

[Dallow Spicer1]

Peter seems to have physically matured considerably with the beard and on the preview for 'Massacre' he's also been draw like a fully grown man rather than the late teen he was before, not sure if this is on purpose or just artist interpretation.

Well, it's been five years since we first met Pete. If he was 17 or 18 then, he's 22 or 23 now.

Yes but presumably VEI characters are not ageing in 'real time'? If they did then this would be a pretty radical approach over the long term for the VEI Universe in terms of the longevity of characters.

[Keith]

I think the original solicits said it's only been six months since the PRS leak that brought down Harada, so the gang hasn't had a chance to age much. I say artist interpretation.

[jmatt]

Yes but presumably VEI characters are not ageing in 'real time'? If they did then this would be a pretty radical approach over the long term for the VEI Universe in terms of the longevity of characters.

I'm all for that, actually. I don't want Pete Stanchek to be 20 forever like Peter Parker. They should grow old, that's more interesting than watching them stay young forever. That makes room for new crops of young heroes to fill the universe.

[Dallow Spicer1]

Yes but presumably VEI characters are not ageing in 'real time'? If they did then this would be a pretty radical approach over the long term for the VEI Universe in terms of the longevity of characters.

I'm all for that, actually. I don't want Pete Stanchek to be 20 forever like Peter Parker. They should grow old, that's more interesting than watching them stay young forever. That makes room for new crops of young heroes to fill the universe.

Yeah, I'd be down for that, it'd certainly be interesting from a readers perspective. Might be risky from a business point of view when characters age past their prime. Looking at the Big 2, how often can they successfully replace major characters? They've tried it a few times with GL, Batman etc but always end up going back to the status quo or hitting the reboot button!

I believe Marvel have Peter Parker as some sort of millionaire now, not sure if he's still married but I expect they'll find some whacky way of hitting the reset button when the stories of him being rich run dry.

[grendeljd]

Yes but presumably VEI characters are not ageing in 'real time'? If they did then this would be a pretty radical approach over the long term for the VEI Universe in terms of the longevity of characters.

I'm all for that, actually. I don't want Pete Stanchek to be 20 forever like Peter Parker. They should grow old, that's more interesting than watching them stay young forever. That makes room for new crops of young heroes to fill the universe.

Yeah, I'd be down for that, it'd certainly be interesting from a readers perspective. Might be risky from a business point of view when characters age past their prime. Looking at the Big 2, how often can they successfully replace major characters? They've tried it a few times with GL, Batman etc but always end up going back to the status quo or hitting the reboot button!

I believe Marvel have Peter Parker as some sort of millionaire now, not sure if he's still married but I expect they'll find some whacky way of hitting the reset button when the stories of him being rich run dry.

It's certainly a daring thing that Valiant could do differently than other stale corporate IP-protective companies, having their characters age enough to be eventually replaced by a newer generation. The VU has always had a slightly more realistic tinge to its superhero characters, that I think it would work well for them to do it. Maybe not have them age in real time, but allow it to happen organically over the years of publishing so that someday we find we're reading about Pete in his 40's training a batch of new teens or something along that line. (Better yet, I would love to see the modern Harbinger world progressively evolve toward Dysarts Book Of Death future utopia).

[slack]

I find it interesting that Jay announced that he's ready to be activated, then I see the awesome promo for Massacre... but no Jay in the group shot.
I immediately questioned WHY he wasn't included... Anyone else?

[TheeBaldMoose]

I find it interesting that Jay announced that he's ready to be activated, then I see the awesome promo for Massacre... but no Jay in the group shot.
I immediately questioned WHY he wasn't included... Anyone else?

Damn if I wasn't thinking that exact same thing! Even spent time looking for him just to see if he could be a background character. Maybe he doesn't play a huge roll?

[Dallow Spicer1]

Yes but presumably VEI characters are not ageing in 'real time'? If they did then this would be a pretty radical approach over the long term for the VEI Universe in terms of the longevity of characters.

I'm all for that, actually. I don't want Pete Stanchek to be 20 forever like Peter Parker. They should grow old, that's more interesting than watching them stay young forever. That makes room for new crops of young heroes to fill the universe.

Yeah, I'd be down for that, it'd certainly be interesting from a readers perspective. Might be risky from a business point of view when characters age past their prime. Looking at the Big 2, how often can they successfully replace major characters? They've tried it a few times with GL, Batman etc but always end up going back to the status quo or hitting the reboot button!

I believe Marvel have Peter Parker as some sort of millionaire now, not sure if he's still married but I expect they'll find some whacky way of hitting the reset button when the stories of him being rich run dry.

It's certainly a daring thing that Valiant could do differently than other stale corporate IP-protective companies, having their characters age enough to be eventually replaced by a newer generation. The VU has always had a slightly more realistic tinge to its superhero characters, that I think it would work well for them to do it. Maybe not have them age in real time, but allow it to happen organically over the years of publishing so that someday we find we're reading about Pete in his 40's training a batch of new teens or something along that line. (Better yet, I would love to see the modern Harbinger world progressively evolve toward Dysarts Book Of Death future utopia).

+1 I'd like to see that too!

[jmatt]

Might be risky from a business point of view when characters age past their prime.

With the way the trend is with mini-arcs, they two are not mutually exclusive. They can have a new crop of characters emerge as the years roll on and still bring back a 40 year old Pete et al when there's a good story to be told about them.

In fact they're already doing it with the Renegades hiatus. And what are some of their best sellers? The new characters like Divinity and Savage.

And I can think of three characters who never age, so there's some continuity there. And we've already seen the characters much older in the BoD one-shots.

Aging is more interesting than not aging. It also adds some interest in that there's no guarantee that everyone will live forever at the ripe old age of 25.

[Brapbrap]

In Book of Death i think peter was like 200 years old but looked 60 and harada was still alive too, so either high level psiots live for ages or in future valiant they find some way to extend their lives