Adv. Of Archer & Armstrong #12 Discussion

[grendeljd]

If anyone would like to hear our OTV:VCR podcast discussing/reviewing this issue [and Faith #8], please follow the link;

http://onlythevaliant.com/episodes/vcr102/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thanks to any who listen in

[grendeljd]

I've had a mixed bag (pun intended) of feelings about this series since it began. It has had some really funny moments, some fun (if maybe a little too silly) scenarios and also some great character development arcs throughout.

But overall I think it did almost nothing to forward these two characters and I think that's a giant waste in the end. We got very little in terms of cool discoveries about any secrets of the overall valiant universe (something I loved about FVL's run), other than shedding some light on how Arams satchel works... and personally I could have done entirely without ever being introduced to Davey The Mackerel or Oliver Dumpbucket.

As this series now wraps, nothing that happened to Aram seems to have had any lasting impact on him. He even returns to the bar we first saw him in, in A&A#1 from FVL's run. Archer keeps dating Faith (and that was all great stuff), but otherwise he might have even regressed a little as a character. Where were any of the signs of the philosophical Archer who will eventually inspire the Archies religion that constructs the Faraway? Lost in a series of wacky adventures that meant nothing in the long run.

One of the coolest things that happened in this series was the revelation near the end of this issue that Andromeda was actually appearing as an old lady on purpose to keep Aram from hanging around her... I was immediately very interested in seeing where that thread was going to lead, she's got tons of potential as a new character for the VEI universe.

Books that rely purely on wacky adventure humour to propel the story do not generally appeal to me, I like it far more when the humour is a layer of icing on a more substantial cake. That alone does not make this a bad series, as that's a personal bias of mine. But I still felt this volume was a little to hit-&-miss overall.

[Donovan]

...I like it far more when the humour is a layer of icing on a more substantial cake.

Like Quantum & Woody!

BRING 'EM BACK!

[jmatt]

But overall I think it did almost nothing to forward these two characters and I think that's a giant waste in the end. ...As this series now wraps, nothing that happened to Aram seems to have had any lasting impact on him. He even returns to the bar we first saw him in, in A&A#1 from FVL's run.

While I agree with most of what you stated, I don't really need to see characters 'progress' in every story arc. The writer will have them grow and change when they need to.

This was fun but a little on the zany side for my tastes.

[jeremycoe]

I thought it was a great end to the series. Could have used more Mary-Maria, though.

[jmatt]

I thought it was a great end to the series.

Given what it is, I agree.

Although Andy's use of magic seemed to come from nowhere. Yeah, I know her background but I don't think we've seen her use it prior to this. The rituals, yes, but shooting bolts from her hands or wand? Or have I forgotten?

[pixierosa]

I have to agree with Grendel. Part of it is my preference for less-silliness as well, but I wanted a bit more movement out of the characters. The series opened with all of that good back history of Aram and his sidekick at the time, highlighting how his choices and behavior ultimately alienates him from those he cares about. I wasn't expecting him to stop drinking, and he did show that he is loyal, but he's always been loyal, just prone to putting himself first. The series started like it might be some sort of redemption story, but it wasn't. It was more reaction to circumstances they were thrust into while in pursuit of what was supposed to be the goal -- like the circus/Russians/1% drugs wackiness when the point for the arc was to find his wife and make amends. I feel like that got lost. After this series, I understand how frustrated the Eternal Warrior is with him because I'm frustrated by him.

As for Archer, I'm glad it was touched upon that he is aware of and trying to develop his ability to connect to the Akashic record. I'd love to see that continued.

Mary-Maria had good story development. She had the most forward momentum, and now that she's clear of the Sisters entanglement, they can pull her and her group more easily into other storylines.

It seems like the tone of this title was trying to bridge both the 2012 Archer and Armstrong and Quantum and Woody.

[nonplayer]

I didn't get this title. Raffer stories bugs me. Glad it's coming to an end. Hopefully no new Raffer titles will surface in the future on serious titles. unless he's wrighting for twelve year olds. He may do a good job on sponge bob or invader zim.
Hopefully Harby renegade doesn't bomb next issue. He's a great Guy I hear but unfortunately kinda silly

[jmatt]

As for Archer, I'm glad it was touched upon that he is aware of and trying to develop his ability to connect to the Akashic record. I'd love to see that continued.

Mary-Maria had good story development. She had the most forward momentum, and now that she's clear of the Sisters entanglement, they can pull her and her group more easily into other storylines.

Good points, there's some character development.

[hawkeyeps]

I've had a mixed bag (pun intended) of feelings about this series since it began. It has had some really funny moments, some fun (if maybe a little too silly) scenarios and also some great character development arcs throughout.

But overall I think it did almost nothing to forward these two characters and I think that's a giant waste in the end. We got very little in terms of cool discoveries about any secrets of the overall valiant universe (something I loved about FVL's run), other than shedding some light on how Arams satchel works... and personally I could have done entirely without ever being introduced to Davey The Mackerel or Oliver Dumpbucket.

As this series now wraps, nothing that happened to Aram seems to have had any lasting impact on him. He even returns to the bar we first saw him in, in A&A#1 from FVL's run. Archer keeps dating Faith (and that was all great stuff), but otherwise he might have even regressed a little as a character. Where were any of the signs of the philosophical Archer who will eventually inspire the Archies religion that constructs the Faraway? Lost in a series of wacky adventures that meant nothing in the long run.

One of the coolest things that happened in this series was the revelation near the end of this issue that Andromeda was actually appearing as an old lady on purpose to keep Aram from hanging around her... I was immediately very interested in seeing where that thread was going to lead, she's got tons of potential as a new character for the VEI universe.

Books that rely purely on wacky adventure humour to propel the story do not generally appeal to me, I like it far more when the humour is a layer of icing on a more substantial cake. That alone does not make this a bad series, as that's a personal bias of mine. But I still felt this volume was a little to hit-&-miss overall.

[jmatt]

One of the coolest things that happened in this series was the revelation near the end of this issue that Andromeda was actually appearing as an old lady on purpose to keep Aram from hanging around her... I was immediately very interested in seeing where that thread was going to lead, she's got tons of potential as a new character for the VEI universe.

Thought: So if Gub-gub is actually one of the gods we heard her talk of earlier in the series, I suppose that like her, he really doesn't look like that in his Earthly persona (and if he willingly chose that, it'd be an odd choice). I'm guessing that if we see him again, he won't look like that and he won't be called Gub-gub.

But now that I think about it, if he really is some kind of god, what the heck was he doing in that circus in the first place? And why would he let any of what we saw take place?

[jeremycoe]

One of the coolest things that happened in this series was the revelation near the end of this issue that Andromeda was actually appearing as an old lady on purpose to keep Aram from hanging around her... I was immediately very interested in seeing where that thread was going to lead, she's got tons of potential as a new character for the VEI universe.

Thought: So if Gub-gub is actually one of the gods we heard her talk of earlier in the series, I suppose that like her, he really doesn't look like that in his Earthly persona (and if he willingly chose that, it'd be an odd choice). I'm guessing that if we see him again, he won't look like that and he won't be called Gub-gub.

But now that I think about it, if he really is some kind of god, what the heck was he doing in that circus in the first place? And why would he let any of what we saw take place?

I was thinking that when Andromeda switched Archer and Gub-Gub back she put that spirit? that was trying to contact her earlier in Gub-Gub's body.

[greg]

One of the coolest things that happened in this series was the revelation near the end of this issue that Andromeda was actually appearing as an old lady on purpose to keep Aram from hanging around her... I was immediately very interested in seeing where that thread was going to lead, she's got tons of potential as a new character for the VEI universe.

Thought: So if Gub-gub is actually one of the gods we heard her talk of earlier in the series, I suppose that like her, he really doesn't look like that in his Earthly persona (and if he willingly chose that, it'd be an odd choice). I'm guessing that if we see him again, he won't look like that and he won't be called Gub-gub.

But now that I think about it, if he really is some kind of god, what the heck was he doing in that circus in the first place? And why would he let any of what we saw take place?

I was thinking that when Andromeda switched Archer and Gub-Gub back she put that spirit? that was trying to contact her earlier in Gub-Gub's body.

That's what I think, too. She wasn't finished with the ritual during the fights, so probably finished it after all the other stuff ended.

Archer was controlling the other body during the fight, so there's probably no reason a celestial being's mind needed Archer's help.

[mateo107]

Unfortunately this series was pretty forgettable. The FVL series really expanded this new Valiant universe and introduced a lot of concepts that readers wanted to see more of. But I think fans could skip this series entirely and not have missed anything about the overall universe or even the main characters. The stories weren't terrible, but there was really nothing that I could say I wanted to see more of.