Random thoughts on the DMG takeover for Valiant...

[greg]

I have posted elsewhere about my thoughts and thanks for Dinesh and Warren's Valiant 2012-2017. That's not what this post is about.

I have read other posts elsewhere about the fears for Valiant with the DMG takeover, particularly if non-Valiant people (suits) are calling the shots. That's sorta what this post is about.

What this post is about would be the possibilities that MAY be opening up, regardless of how old-school (that is me and most of you) Valiant fans feel about it.

TEN THINGS I wouldn't be surprised to see (but also wouldn't be surprised if we never see), now that DMG is completely in control:

1) Valiant High is being turned into an actual comic book, which establishes that DMG will allow alternate-universe (out-of-continuity) Valiant stories in comic book form.

2) Valiant High is being promoted by DMG to establish Valiant's first ALL-AGES title.

3) Mel Caylo is now at Valiant/DMG after being Marketing Manager for BOOM! Studios - which has four different imprints - and features 39 different series on their website: http://www.boom-studios.com/SERIES/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Clearly, the expansion beyond 8 or 9 monthly titles for Valiant under DMG is a possibility.

4) Joe Illidge is now at Valiant/DMG after being DC's liaison to the WB animation team. Clearly, the creation of Batman Beyond style animation for Valiant characters under DMG is a possibility.

5) DMG highlights their Valiant properties and their Brandon Sanderson literary and fantasy novels as the DMG IP Universe. Clearly, literary and fantasy novels for Valiant under DMG are a possibility.

6) Dan Mintz (the implied "DM" in "DMG") specifically stated, "Our priority is to build upon Valiant's vast universe of characters from a filmmaker's perspective. I'm excited to immerse Valiant's fans well beyond the stories we tell cinematically — from publishing to gaming to theme parks and beyond."

7) The same article states: "Valiant is the third largest universe of superhero characters in entertainment, sitting alongside Warner Bros’ DC Comics and Disney’s Marvel." It's unlikely that DMG believes that comic books and movies are how DC and Marvel are making their money. In 2016, entertainment/character licensing overall accounted for $113.2 billion. All movies, regardless of subject, totalled $39billion in 2016 and only about 1/3rd is from the U.S. and Canada. Comic books sales, all publishers, is about $1billion annually for U.S. and Canada. DMG isn't hoping to make $100million on comics. They might be hoping to make $100million on movies in the U.S. and Canada, but if DMG is going to turn their investment into profit, it's probably going to come from global licensing.

8) Valiant is about 27 years old. When DC was 27 years old, it was 1965. The Adam West Batman movie and TV series hadn't started yet. Nothing but comics and a few weird toys. Christopher Reeve wouldn't become Superman for 13 more years. When Marvel was 27 years old, it was 1988. No movies, no theme parks, some Saturday morning cartoons, lunchboxes, a few cool toys... the Hulk television show, and some weird live-action Spider-man stuff, and a Howard the Duck movie. Two horrible movies would come along in 1989 and 1990. Valiant isn't far behind where Marvel and DC were at the same age... but Valiant is decades behind them right now.

9) Let's get realistic. Valiant isn't going to rival Marvel or DC anytime soon. Valiant has maybe 2%-3% of Marvel and DC's comic sales. Marvel and DC made an average of $250million per movie. 2%-3% of that would be $5million to $8million. If Valiant can make even $20million on a movie, they'll be leaps-and-bounds ahead of where they've been in the Marvel and DC comparison.

10) Valiant has spent 6 years focused on the North American and English-speaking European market. DMG is headquartered in Beverly Hills, California, but their "claim to fame" is all about China. Their "Who-We-Are" webpage features four Valiant properties and four non-Valiant properties. It's safe to assume DMG will focus on Valiant properties in China.

Put it all together:

Valiant has been primarily a strong-continuity comic book publisher focused on the PG-13 market of North American and English-speaking countries. There are non-American, all-ages, and not-in-continuity Valiant products, but they have not been a long-term focus.

Valiant will likely be primarily a global licensing media company focused on the all-ages market for movies, comics, novels, animations, games, toys, and other licensing opportunities in China. There will be American PG-13 strong-continuity comics, but they're not likely to be the long-term focus.

[TheeBaldMoose]

I wonder, doesn't China make comic books illegal? If so, would Valiant be the first of their kind there? I know there are pockets where they are more liberal regarding comic books, but mainland and bigger cities...

[greg]

I wonder, doesn't China make comic books illegal? If so, would Valiant be the first of their kind there? I know there are pockets where they are more liberal regarding comic books, but mainland and bigger cities...

I doubt comic books are illegal. Marvel has recently focused on the Chinese market.

[SuperMage]

I'm fine with all these things. Especially with Mel Caylo expanding the publishing line. Valiant should consider an imprint focusing on licensed titles. Maybe a VH-1 imprint to? DMG could buy back the Gold Key characters if they felt like it, they have the cash. They could hire Jim Shooter to launch a VH-1 revival imprint that could be published alongside VEI. It'd be a smart way to win back all of the old school fans

I wonder, doesn't China make comic books illegal? If so, would Valiant be the first of their kind there? I know there are pockets where they are more liberal regarding comic books, but mainland and bigger cities...

Analyst agree that the future of the comic book industry is in China. It's an untapped market that's finally beginning to open up. The current competition is to see who can get their foot in the door first. Same for the film industry.

DMG's entire premise is being a global company that acts as a bridge between the U.S. and China. They have the advantage in both industries.

[greg]

DMG's entire premise is being a global company that acts as a bridge between the U.S. and China. They have the advantage in both industries.

DMG made money in China with Looper and Iron Man 3, but they didn't make as much as they could have made if they owned those properties.
Simply put, DMG knows they can make money in China... and they believe they can make more if they're not just a middleman.

[The Dirt Gang]

If the focus is on the Asian market, I for one would be all for Hong Kong style Valiant movies.

There is already an Indian Shadowman, so perhaps there is a market there as well.

[greg]

If the focus is on the Asian market, I for one would be all for Hong Kong style Valiant movies.

You can give me Ninjak and the Shadow Seven storyline in Crouching Tiger, Hidden Dragon style and I wouldn't care if every part was played by Zhang Ziyi.

There is already an Indian Shadowman, so perhaps there is a market there as well.

America already has a "Shadowman" movie, too. I don't think it's going to be a problem.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shadow_Man_(2006_film)

[BugsySig]

International markets are ripe for VALIANT. Marvel and DC don’t have the stranglehold there that they do here. VEI has several foreign language deals for publishing and movies are a logical progression.

I’d be all for animation. DC has really done well via that medium with their direct to dvd/DVR movies, and both Marvel and DC have had plenty of success in animated TV. Some form of “adult” superhero animation on TV could do well.

Licensing is something else that may come into play. Publishing licensed properties is what primarily keeps/kept Boom, Dynamite, Titan, IDW and Dark Horse afloat for years. It would be an easy way to turn a profit or break even in the publishing end.

Alternate “universes” are fine with me. I’m sure a few people wouldn’t mind a return to VH1 or even Acclaim for a few series, tie up loose ends, etc. Could be difficult without the GK3, but I wouldn’t put it past DMG to license them in the future either. Dino was against it unless they could be owned outright, but I doubt DMG would have any such reservations.

[SuperMage]

DMG's entire premise is being a global company that acts as a bridge between the U.S. and China. They have the advantage in both industries.

DMG made money in China with Looper and Iron Man 3, but they didn't make as much as they could have made if they owned those properties.
Simply put, DMG knows they can make money in China... and they believe they can make more if they're not just a middleman.

Every company know wants to be part of the franchise game. Whole reason why AT&T is trying to buy Warner Bros. DMG wants to make some that Chinese box office dollars, but they didn't have a library of IPs until they bought Valiant. I'm willing to bet that Bloodshot (2019) will have at least a few scenes filmed in China, and that a Chinese actress/actor will end up being cast in some sort of supporting role. Chinese audiences want to see themselves in their media. Especially if this is media that puts them on the global stage. One of the complaints from Chinese moviegoers attending Black Panther was that they didn't like the scenes filmed in South Korea. If Marvel wanted to film scenes in Asia, they'd have preferred it to take place in China. They're okay with stuff from Japan though. Dragon Ball Evolution, and Speed Racer both performed well in China. Meaning Chinese audiences tend to respond well to Japanese influenced cinema produced in the U.S. A Rai movie might become DMG's priority. I do know one thing for sure, they won't cast a Chinese actor as a villain. Harada will probably stay Japanese for that reason.

Alternate “universes” are fine with me. I’m sure a few people wouldn’t mind a return to VH1 or even Acclaim for a few series, tie up loose ends, etc. Could be difficult without the GK3, but I wouldn’t put it past DMG to license them in the future either. Dino was against it unless they could be owned outright, but I doubt DMG would have any such reservations.

Bro, DMG has the money to buy the companies that own the Gold Key Three. It's a worthwhile investment. Hell, they could buy Dynamite while they're at it. Get the rights to Vampirella. The GK3 are distinct enough from Savage, Divinity, and War Mother that they could still coexist in the VEI universe. If they made a VH-1 imprint it'd be best for it to start out as a single book that reintroduces the entire universe kind of like what DC is doing with The Wild Storm, and James Robinson's Earth 2 comic.

EDIT: Never knew the forum automatically censored Dynamite if you typed it in. I just assumed everyone had the same mutual hatred for the company.

[BugsySig]

DMG's entire premise is being a global company that acts as a bridge between the U.S. and China. They have the advantage in both industries.

DMG made money in China with Looper and Iron Man 3, but they didn't make as much as they could have made if they owned those properties.
Simply put, DMG knows they can make money in China... and they believe they can make more if they're not just a middleman.

Every company know wants to be part of the franchise game. Whole reason why AT&T is trying to buy Warner Bros. DMG wants to make some that Chinese box office dollars, but they didn't have a library of IPs until they bought Valiant. I'm willing to bet that Bloodshot (2019) will have at least a few scenes filmed in China, and that a Chinese actress/actor will end up being cast in some sort of supporting role. Chinese audiences want to see themselves in their media. Especially if this is media that puts them on the global stage. One of the complaints from Chinese moviegoers attending Black Panther was that they didn't like the scenes filmed in South Korea. If Marvel wanted to film scenes in Asia, they'd have preferred it to take place in China. They're okay with stuff from Japan though. Dragon Ball Evolution, and Speed Racer both performed well in China. Meaning Chinese audiences tend to respond well to Japanese influenced cinema produced in the U.S. A Rai movie might become DMG's priority. I do know one thing for sure, they won't cast a Chinese actor as a villain. Harada will probably stay Japanese for that reason.

Alternate “universes” are fine with me. I’m sure a few people wouldn’t mind a return to VH1 or even Acclaim for a few series, tie up loose ends, etc. Could be difficult without the GK3, but I wouldn’t put it past DMG to license them in the future either. Dino was against it unless they could be owned outright, but I doubt DMG would have any such reservations.

Bro, DMG has the money to buy the companies that own the Gold Key Three. It's a worthwhile investment. Hell, they could buy Dynamite (sucks!) while they're at it. Get the rights to Vampirella. The GK3 are distinct enough from Savage, Divinity, and War Mother that they could still coexist in the VEI universe. If they made a VH-1 imprint it'd be best for it to start out as a single book that reintroduces the entire universe kind of like what DC is doing with The Wild Storm, and James Robinson's Earth 2 comic.

EDIT: Never knew the forum automatically censored Dynamite (sucks!) if you typed it in. I just assumed everyone had the same mutual hatred for the company.

They could buy Dreamworks? Not so sure on that one...but I get your point.

[SuperMage]

DMG's entire premise is being a global company that acts as a bridge between the U.S. and China. They have the advantage in both industries.

DMG made money in China with Looper and Iron Man 3, but they didn't make as much as they could have made if they owned those properties.
Simply put, DMG knows they can make money in China... and they believe they can make more if they're not just a middleman.

Every company know wants to be part of the franchise game. Whole reason why AT&T is trying to buy Warner Bros. DMG wants to make some that Chinese box office dollars, but they didn't have a library of IPs until they bought Valiant. I'm willing to bet that Bloodshot (2019) will have at least a few scenes filmed in China, and that a Chinese actress/actor will end up being cast in some sort of supporting role. Chinese audiences want to see themselves in their media. Especially if this is media that puts them on the global stage. One of the complaints from Chinese moviegoers attending Black Panther was that they didn't like the scenes filmed in South Korea. If Marvel wanted to film scenes in Asia, they'd have preferred it to take place in China. They're okay with stuff from Japan though. Dragon Ball Evolution, and Speed Racer both performed well in China. Meaning Chinese audiences tend to respond well to Japanese influenced cinema produced in the U.S. A Rai movie might become DMG's priority. I do know one thing for sure, they won't cast a Chinese actor as a villain. Harada will probably stay Japanese for that reason.

Alternate “universes” are fine with me. I’m sure a few people wouldn’t mind a return to VH1 or even Acclaim for a few series, tie up loose ends, etc. Could be difficult without the GK3, but I wouldn’t put it past DMG to license them in the future either. Dino was against it unless they could be owned outright, but I doubt DMG would have any such reservations.

Bro, DMG has the money to buy the companies that own the Gold Key Three. It's a worthwhile investment. Hell, they could buy Dynamite (sucks!) (sucks!) while they're at it. Get the rights to Vampirella. The GK3 are distinct enough from Savage, Divinity, and War Mother that they could still coexist in the VEI universe. If they made a VH-1 imprint it'd be best for it to start out as a single book that reintroduces the entire universe kind of like what DC is doing with The Wild Storm, and James Robinson's Earth 2 comic.

EDIT: Never knew the forum automatically censored Dynamite (sucks!) (sucks!) if you typed it in. I just assumed everyone had the same mutual hatred for the company.

They could buy Dreamworks? Not so sure on that one...but I get your point.

I mean it might be a tough sell. It's Dreamworks>Classic Media>Gold Key Catalog. Dreamworks isn't really doing anything with the Gold Key characters. They're mostly focused on He-Man, and Voltron. It's hard to tell if they see them as valuable or if they'd be willing to sell them if DMG was interested in buying.

[jmatt]

Greg, thanks for cheering me up.

[jxm640]

If the focus is on the Asian market, I for one would be all for Hong Kong style Valiant movies.

There is already an Indian Shadowman, so perhaps there is a market there as well.

A more international flavoured Valiant movie set up would be amazing. I think that is what the market needs to be distinct.

Also (correct me if I am wrong!!), DMG has a massive advantage of Disney and Warner Bros with regards to breaking into China. To do business with China, foreign companies need to partner with a Chinese company, to the best of my recollection. As DMG has already created a Chinese company (Shanghai-based), which circumvents any of the legal hurdles that Marvel and DC would need to go through in order to further penetrate the Chinese market.

[Jace]

I'm fine with all these things. Especially with Mel Caylo expanding the publishing line. Valiant should consider an imprint focusing on licensed titles. Maybe a VH-1 imprint to? DMG could buy back the Gold Key characters if they felt like it, they have the cash. They could hire Jim Shooter to launch a VH-1 revival imprint that could be published alongside VEI. It'd be a smart way to win back all of the old school fans

I wonder, doesn't China make comic books illegal? If so, would Valiant be the first of their kind there? I know there are pockets where they are more liberal regarding comic books, but mainland and bigger cities...

Analyst agree that the future of the comic book industry is in China. It's an untapped market that's finally beginning to open up. The current competition is to see who can get their foot in the door first. Same for the film industry.

DMG's entire premise is being a global company that acts as a bridge between the U.S. and China. They have the advantage in both industries.

Mel is a marketing guy .... it isn't up to him to create new titles, that falls more under the purview of Joseph Illidge.

Never say never, but I would find it highly unlikely that Jim Shooter would work with Valiant again. He screwed them and was looking out for himself. I doubt they would trust him to bring him on, plus it has been so long since Shooter was relevant or had people who wanted to work with him. I know people like to look back with fondness on the days of yesteryear, but VH1 is over. Shooter and Valiant are over. Let it go.

[Jace]

3) Mel Caylo is now at Valiant/DMG after being Marketing Manager for BOOM! Studios - which has four different imprints - and features 39 different series on their website: http://www.boom-studios.com/SERIES/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false; Clearly, the expansion beyond 8 or 9 monthly titles for Valiant under DMG is a possibility.

4) Joe Illidge is now at Valiant/DMG after being DC's liaison to the WB animation team. Clearly, the creation of Batman Beyond style animation for Valiant characters under DMG is a possibility.

8) Valiant is about 27 years old. When DC was 27 years old, it was 1965. The Adam West Batman movie and TV series hadn't started yet. Nothing but comics and a few weird toys. Christopher Reeve wouldn't become Superman for 13 more years. When Marvel was 27 years old, it was 1988. No movies, no theme parks, some Saturday morning cartoons, lunchboxes, a few cool toys... the Hulk television show, and some weird live-action Spider-man stuff, and a Howard the Duck movie. Two horrible movies would come along in 1989 and 1990. Valiant isn't far behind where Marvel and DC were at the same age... but Valiant is decades behind them right now.

Interesting points and I don;t have a lot to say about most of them. As you say Greg they are all possibilities, but anything is possible right now because we have no idea what DMG is planning and we are likely to never know. This is a multi-national conglomerate working on many projects are many different angles. So to think we might ever be privy to the inner machinations is foolish. There plans will change as things tend to do when the markets are constantly in flux and tastes change. Ultimately we will know some of what DMG plans as we will see it come to fruition. Other things we will never know about or we will never know how they have changed form conception to implementation.

We have been so spoiled for so long to have been in the know for so much of what VEI was dong because of the team that was there. Those days are gone. Expect Valiant to be mush more like DC or Marvel now when it comes to news and announcements. Anyone notice the continuing trend in the last 6 months of comic publishers buying up independent comic news sites? It's tough to find unbiased reviews and a site that covers everything evenly. Might DMG buy up a site soon? I could see that pretty easily.

Anyway ... a few thoughts about the three points you made above.

3) Caylo is a marketing guy, you are right he did promote a ton of books at Boom! while he was there because Boom! was putting out a ton of books. Keep in mind they scaled back massively from those 39 books once the realized that they were better off focusing on quality not quantity. Regardless, this is coincidental in regards to Mel, the amount of books produced falls under editorial not marketing. So I don;t think his hire translates into more books, that's a false equivalency.

4) Similar to #3, Illidge was the liason between the Batman Beyond comic and cartoon. He basically made sure that the stories of one did not contradict or step on the toes of the other. Much like the Mel hire I don't see how this translates into Valiant cartoons. If DMG were to bring on someone with experience in both realms like Chuck Patton, then hell yeah Valiant cartoons! That would be great!

8) As for this point ... man, it would be nice to think Valiant has the future of Marvel or DC ahead of it and it will be around as long as those two. Still I feel like this is comparing apples to oranges. The comic book market is so different now, as is the whole entertainment industry. This is the time of instant gratification, binging TV shows, I want it when I want it , how I want it, on the device I want it on. I don't think Marvel and DC had those kinds of barriers to overcome when they were 27 years old.

Just my thoughts, curious what others might think.

[SuperMage]

Never say never, but I would find it highly unlikely that Jim Shooter would work with Valiant again. He screwed them and was looking out for himself. I doubt they would trust him to bring him on, plus it has been so long since Shooter was relevant or had people who wanted to work with him. I know people like to look back with fondness on the days of yesteryear, but VH1 is over. Shooter and Valiant are over. Let it go.

Oh, I'm completely apathetic to Shooter. I only started reading Valiant in 2012. I could care less what he does. I'm not even sure if the guy's still alive. I was literally a fetus when VH-1 was a thing so it's impossible for me to be nostalgic for a period I wasn't alive for. I was just bringing it up as a hypothetical scenario. I do have opinions on Jim Shooter though. I'd prefer not to share those opinions. I might upset some of the older fans. DMG being in charge means that basically anything is possible now. So who knows?

As far as the line growing, I feel like Mel kind of confirmed that's their plan with the release of the Bloodshot film. It's too soon to speculate on what Summer of Valiant 2019 will be,but I'm guessing it's going to be Bloodshot centric. The current editorial is only just beginning to settle in so chances are the next four months will be spent planning the next year of Valiant and possibly beyond.

I'm going to positive about all this. I know the entertainment industry is competitive, but DMG has a distinct advantage due its relations with China.

I would definitely be interested in a series of Valiant shows similar to Marvel's Netflix series. Maybe on Hulu orin print?

DMG has money so they can pretty much buy whatever they want. They could buy an animation studio, and produce Valiant cartoons. They could buy a news website to promote Valiant. They could buy other independent publishers that lack a parent company. And they can pay people to oversee all those projects.

Sky's the limit. I mostly want some cartoons, and some expansion in the publishing line. Acclaim 2.0? Troublemakers, Trinity Angel's, Doctor Tomorrow, etc.

[The Chosen 1]

Great post Greg!

I'm happy to wait and see how things move forward instead of prophesying doom and gloom. I can't see DMG holding back the publishing line. Perhaps influence the direction of the stories, but the comics will be the storyboards for the movies, hence them wanting the writers to be across all the lines.
I didn't think of the things like novels and licensing, but you raised some very positive points.

[Ryan]

I wonder, doesn't China make comic books illegal? If so, would Valiant be the first of their kind there? I know there are pockets where they are more liberal regarding comic books, but mainland and bigger cities...

Comic books aren't illegal, but the publishing industry is regulated and controlled by the government.

I've been living in China for the last 3 years, and I think the bigger hurdle is that there is just no such thing as a comic book industry or market here. I live in a city of 8 million plus people and I've tried to find a place that sells comic books a few times with no luck. If young people grow up reading comics at all, it's some of the well known Japanese series that have been translated over (like One Piece, Naruto, Dragon Ball [which is based on a classical Chinese story] etc.)

As far as American style mainstream comics, they are pretty much ignored or non-existent. People love the Marvel movies but could care less about the comics. I think it would be a lot harder for an American publisher to make some sort of dent into the Chinese market than just making a few Chinese superheroes or translating the books into Chinese. Steps one through ten of building an actual market here would have to be done first. But who knows, there's certainly a lot of potential, you can see kids wearing Marvel and even Captain America gear everywhere you look.

There's also definitely a lot of potential in the film market, I think it was smart to cast Vin Diesel as Bloodshot. Fast and Furious movies are huge over here, he's one of the few truly bankable crossover stars who fans will come out for. The challenge will be that they will be going head-to-head with the Marvel movies, so if any aspect of the quality doesn't reach the bar that Marvel has set, viewers will quickly turn away.

[Jace]

Never say never, but I would find it highly unlikely that Jim Shooter would work with Valiant again. He screwed them and was looking out for himself. I doubt they would trust him to bring him on, plus it has been so long since Shooter was relevant or had people who wanted to work with him. I know people like to look back with fondness on the days of yesteryear, but VH1 is over. Shooter and Valiant are over. Let it go.

Oh, I'm completely apathetic to Shooter. I only started reading Valiant in 2012. I could care less what he does. I'm not even sure if the guy's still alive. I was literally a fetus when VH-1 was a thing so it's impossible for me to be nostalgic for a period I wasn't alive for. I was just bringing it up as a hypothetical scenario. I do have opinions on Jim Shooter though. I'd prefer not to share those opinions. I might upset some of the older fans. DMG being in charge means that basically anything is possible now. So who knows?

As far as the line growing, I feel like Mel kind of confirmed that's their plan with the release of the Bloodshot film. It's too soon to speculate on what Summer of Valiant 2019 will be,but I'm guessing it's going to be Bloodshot centric. The current editorial is only just beginning to settle in so chances are the next four months will be spent planning the next year of Valiant and possibly beyond.

I'm going to positive about all this. I know the entertainment industry is competitive, but DMG has a distinct advantage due its relations with China.

I would definitely be interested in a series of Valiant shows similar to Marvel's Netflix series. Maybe on Hulu orin print?

DMG has money so they can pretty much buy whatever they want. They could buy an animation studio, and produce Valiant cartoons. They could buy a news website to promote Valiant. They could buy other independent publishers that lack a parent company. And they can pay people to oversee all those projects.

Sky's the limit. I mostly want some cartoons, and some expansion in the publishing line. Acclaim 2.0? Troublemakers, Trinity Angel's, Doctor Tomorrow, etc.

Nuff said about Shooter.

You are right to say anything can happen for sure. I actually expect the line to grow, I just don't see that as a result of Mel. It is a combination of things, not least of which will be a desire to have a greater presence on the comic book racks as a directive from DMG. This will fall to the editorial staff to implement without watering down the line and I am sure Mel will have input in the timing and subsequent announcement of these additional books, but not the creation of them.

Hoping to have Mel and Joe on the podcast soon and then we can have some solid info I hope and less of this speculation.

[greg]

Anyway ... a few thoughts about the three points you made above.

3) Caylo is a marketing guy, you are right he did promote a ton of books at Boom! while he was there because Boom! was putting out a ton of books. Keep in mind they scaled back massively from those 39 books once the realized that they were better off focusing on quality not quantity. Regardless, this is coincidental in regards to Mel, the amount of books produced falls under editorial not marketing. So I don;t think his hire translates into more books, that's a false equivalency.

4) Similar to #3, Illidge was the liason between the Batman Beyond comic and cartoon. He basically made sure that the stories of one did not contradict or step on the toes of the other. Much like the Mel hire I don't see how this translates into Valiant cartoons. If DMG were to bring on someone with experience in both realms like Chuck Patton, then hell yeah Valiant cartoons! That would be great!

8) As for this point ... man, it would be nice to think Valiant has the future of Marvel or DC ahead of it and it will be around as long as those two. Still I feel like this is comparing apples to oranges. The comic book market is so different now, as is the whole entertainment industry. This is the time of instant gratification, binging TV shows, I want it when I want it , how I want it, on the device I want it on. I don't think Marvel and DC had those kinds of barriers to overcome when they were 27 years old.

Just my thoughts, curious what others might think.

These are good points. Rebuttal?

3) I agree that Mel Caylo won't be saying whether they expand beyond 8 or 9 titles at a time, but he comes from a company with 39 featured titles, for all ages. Why hire a marketing guy with that kind of experience and then give him less to do?

4) Illidge knows the people who did Batman Beyond animation for WB. Who you know... uh... matters.

8) I remember when there were three channels on my television. I remember when there were two screens at my movie theater. I remember when the idea that Netflix or Youtube would expand beyond other people's real (or home) movies was weird. All of those things (network channels, A-or-B choice theaters, streaming other people's stuff) gave way to the "next thing" when we got cable, multiplex theaters, Netflix originals and Youtube streaming everything. In each case, it was the "newer thing" that got big, not necessarily overnight, but eventually... very big. Marvel and DC are like the old network channels, the A-or-B theaters, and the "only comic media currently worth streaming"... with some individual/indie successes chipping away at them. Namely, Image is in the "network" mix now, the comic shelves are at least Marvel, DC, and "other" now, and things like The Walking Dead and Hellboy have shown that it's possible to beat the big two in live action media. Image doesn't have a full slate of interconnected universe ready for media. Someone else will have to "do it all" to compete. The next "full slate" for a universe of properties literally is Valiant... even if it's tiny now. Netflix was nothing in 1996. Youtube didn't exist in 2004. Valiant is older than both. There are a billion ways to fail, so the odds are against success... but Valiant has a ridiculous amount of more assets than some of the biggest media names did when they "went global".

[greg]

Dinesh wasn't upset because Valiant was failing and DMG needed to bail them out. Dinesh was upset because Valiant was succeeding, he wanted to keep doing so, and Valiant is "so close" to the bigtime. After all that investment on his part, someone else gets to be there for the "graduation ceremony" and "next steps into a larger world"... when he and his team were the ones who put in all the years of schoolwork. Imagine being a straight-A student, a decade of work behind you, a junior in high school, scholarships already offered, and then someone else walks in for senior year and buys your transcript saying "thanks, I'll take it from here". Success is imminent. The momentum is already there. There's no failure anywhere in the current Valiant story... it's a change in who gets to enjoy the fruits of the labor.

[TheeBaldMoose]

There's also definitely a lot of potential in the film market, I think it was smart to cast Vin Diesel as Bloodshot. Fast and Furious movies are huge over here, he's one of the few truly bankable crossover stars who fans will come out for.

Could DMG have done their research, looking for who might make the biggest splash in China, and chose to cast Diesel over others? If what Ryan is saying is true, that he is hugely successful in China, then it would totally make sense to target the market that will make the biggest splash. To us, Diesel may not be the best choice, but we are not the draw here, China is.

[greg]

There's also definitely a lot of potential in the film market, I think it was smart to cast Vin Diesel as Bloodshot. Fast and Furious movies are huge over here, he's one of the few truly bankable crossover stars who fans will come out for.

Could DMG have done their research, looking for who might make the biggest splash in China, and chose to cast Diesel over others? If what Ryan is saying is true, that he is hugely successful in China, then it would totally make sense to target the market that will make the biggest splash. To us, Diesel may not be the best choice, but we are not the draw here, China is.

That's absolutely right.

Here are the top movies in China for 2017: http://www.boxofficemojo.com/intl/china ... 017&p=.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Fate of the Furious made $393,000,000 over there. It only made $226,000,000 in the U.S.

Here's another interesting point... Fate of the Furious was the #2 movie in China in 2017.
#1 was a movie called "Wolf Warrior 2". Never heard of it? Me neither. China has... it made $854,000,000.
It was a homegrown action sequel about a Chinese special forces agent who comes out of retirement to fight Western mercenaries.

Following that model, Bloodshot should be the hero, and all of the villains should probably be American or European, plus Harada as Japanese.
Bloodshot's friends probably need to be Chinese heroes themselves... and that would be the only change from the comics.
Don't expect Bloodshot to make $854,000,000 in China. Wolf Warrior 2 was a sequel. Wolf Warrior made $80,000,000.
Establish Bloodshot in the Chinese market, and promote all the other Bloodshot items for two years. Then, the sequel.

Remember how I pointed out that Valiant's 2%-3% of Marvel and DC comic sales would correspond to about $5,000,000 in box office dollars?
Wolf Warrior 2 made $2,700,000 in the U.S., and the original Wolf Warrior wasn't even released here.

Think about it. The biggest movie in the history of China and the 2nd biggest in a single market in the history of the world is a character we've never heard of.
https://www.the-numbers.com/box-office- ... gle-market" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
If you asked someone in the U.S. to list single movie box office records, they'd miss #2 of all time (and also #9 and #10... both Chinese, and both ahead of #11 The Dark Knight).

Eight hundred fifty-four million dollars.

It's got to be one of the most amazing movies of all time with special effects and budget and insane visuals, right?

Nope. Looks to me like it should make about $2,700,000 at the box office.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGNAlvAZjIY" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Our definition of success is probably irrelevant to DMG.

P.S. The Wolf Warrior 2 trailer from 2017 starts with two guys in a control booth piloting a remote drone shooting at a kid. How did Bloodshot #1 from 2012 start again?

[TheeBaldMoose]

There's also definitely a lot of potential in the film market, I think it was smart to cast Vin Diesel as Bloodshot. Fast and Furious movies are huge over here, he's one of the few truly bankable crossover stars who fans will come out for.

Could DMG have done their research, looking for who might make the biggest splash in China, and chose to cast Diesel over others? If what Ryan is saying is true, that he is hugely successful in China, then it would totally make sense to target the market that will make the biggest splash. To us, Diesel may not be the best choice, but we are not the draw here, China is.

That's absolutely right.

Here are the top movies in China for 2017: http://www.boxofficemojo.com/intl/china ... 017&p=.htm" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
Fate of the Furious made $393,000,000 over there. It only made $226,000,000 in the U.S.

Here's another interesting point... Fate of the Furious was the #2 movie in China in 2017.
#1 was a movie called "Wolf Warrior 2". Never heard of it? Me neither. China has... it made $854,000,000.
It was a homegrown action sequel about a Chinese special forces agent who comes out of retirement to fight Western mercenaries.

Following that model, Bloodshot should be the hero, and all of the villains should probably be American or European, plus Harada as Japanese.
Bloodshot's friends probably need to be Chinese heroes themselves... and that would be the only change from the comics.
Don't expect Bloodshot to make $854,000,000 in China. Wolf Warrior 2 was a sequel. Wolf Warrior made $80,000,000.
Establish Bloodshot in the Chinese market, and promote all the other Bloodshot items for two years. Then, the sequel.

Remember how I pointed out that Valiant's 2%-3% of Marvel and DC comic sales would correspond to about $5,000,000 in box office dollars?
Wolf Warrior 2 made $2,700,000 in the U.S., and the original Wolf Warrior wasn't even released here.

Think about it. The biggest movie in the history of China and the 2nd biggest in a single market in the history of the world is a character we've never heard of.
https://www.the-numbers.com/box-office- ... gle-market" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;
If you asked someone in the U.S. to list single movie box office records, they'd miss #2 of all time (and also #9 and #10... both Chinese, and both ahead of #11 The Dark Knight).

Eight hundred fifty-four million dollars.

It's got to be one of the most amazing movies of all time with special effects and budget and insane visuals, right?

Nope. Looks to me like it should make about $2,700,000 at the box office.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=KGNAlvAZjIY" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Our definition of success is probably irrelevant to DMG.

P.S. The Wolf Warrior 2 trailer from 2017 starts with two guys in a control booth piloting a remote drone shooting at a kid. How did Bloodshot #1 from 2012 start again?

That's pretty much the road I was traveling down, without the facts to back it up, lol.

Vin Diesel to placate the American audience, I could see the Dr being removed from the comic book, and insert Chinese character here. That would be relevant enough, I think.... Sure he would get blotted out in the rest of the movies, but how much of a stickler will they be on continuity inside the movies with a minor (or mid level) character?

On that thread, I could imagine one of the Harbinger kids becoming Chinese American, or something along those lines.... Who though?

[greg]

Vin Diesel to placate the American audience, I could see the Dr being removed from the comic book, and insert Chinese character here. That would be relevant enough, I think.... Sure he would get blotted out in the rest of the movies, but how much of a stickler will they be on continuity inside the movies with a minor (or mid level) character?

On that thread, I could imagine one of the Harbinger kids becoming Chinese American, or something along those lines.... Who though?

Animalia. She's got unlimited potential across all ages and all types of licensing products. They'd be silly not to make her 100% Chinese. Monica Jim becomes Monica Jin. Done.

She could be a single child actor who conquers all media from Jurassic Park to Hello Kitty, bigger than Harry Potter for a billion people audience.

Or, they could just stick with what sells 10,000 copies of comics.