CGC just raised their prices

Ricomortis · Post by **Ricomortis** » Fri Apr 28, 2017 2:51 pm

Moderns are now $20

nycjadie · Post by **nycjadie** » Fri Apr 28, 2017 2:56 pm

CGC has announced changes to its grading services and fees, effective June 1, 2017. All submissions received by CGC on or after June 1, 2017, will be processed at the new fees. These are the first comprehensive changes that CGC has made to its services and fees since January 2012.

Percentage discounts for paid CGC Collector Society Members and Authorized Dealers remain the same. CGC grading fees for other collectibles (magazines, concert posters, lobby cards, etc.) will also remain the same. There have been no changes to CCS fees.

The following changes apply to submissions of comic books received by CGC on or after June 1, 2017:

Handling Fee

Paper & PDF Forms – Changed to $8.00 per form. As before, each grading tier must be submitted on a separate form.
Online Form – Remains $5.00 per tier. The online form allows customers to do multiple submissions under the same tier and pay only one handling fee. The handling fee is applied for each tier of service.
Signature Series - Remains the same at $5.00 per submission form.
Grading Fees

Modern – Fee changed to $20 per book.
Value – Fee changed to $27 per book. Turnaround time changed to 50 business days. Minimum submission requirement is removed.
The removal of the 15-book submission requirement makes the Value tier a more affordable option for collectors with only one book or collectors who are just learning about CGC’s grading services.

Economy – Fee changed to $38 per book. Turnaround time changed to 35 business days.
CGC is very pleased that operational upgrades and new hires have enabled it to reduce the turnaround time for the Economy tier from 40 business days to 35 business days. We will continue to work hard to reduce our turnaround times and make other improvements to our services.

Standard – Fee changed to $65 per book.
Express – Fee changed to $100 per book.
WalkThru – Remains 3% of FMV. Minimum fee remains at $150. Maximum fee changed to $5,000.
Signature Series Modern – Fee changed to $30 per book.
Signature Series Value – Fee changed to $32 per book. Turnaround time changed to 50 business days. Minimum submission requirement is removed.
As with the Value tier, CGC has removed the 15-book minimum submission requirement from the Signature Series Value tier to make it easier and more affordable for collectors to submit just one book to CGC.

Signature Series Economy – Fee changed to $43 per book. Turnaround time changed to 35 business days.
CGC has matched the faster turnaround time of its Economy tier by reducing the turnaround time for Signature Series Economy by five business days.

Signature Series Standard – Fee changed to $70 per book.
Signature Series Express – Fee changed to $105 per book.
If you have any questions, please contact CGC Customer Service at 1-877-NM-COMIC (662-6642) or customerservice@CGCcomics.com.

StarBrand · Post by **StarBrand** » Fri Apr 28, 2017 3:11 pm

possumgrease · Post by **possumgrease** » Fri Apr 28, 2017 5:00 pm

How much of an increase is this? $2-3 per book?

nycjadie · Post by **nycjadie** » Fri Apr 28, 2017 6:15 pm

$2 on moderns, but up to $5 for others, as far as I can see. It will increase the cost for slabs across the board, I think.

maraxusofkeld · Post by **maraxusofkeld** » Fri Apr 28, 2017 9:13 pm

This might be to decrease the amount of nonsense being submitted to cut down on grading times across the board. The amount of garbage I see being graded and listed on ebay is unreal.

BloodShot · Post by **BloodShot** » Sat Apr 29, 2017 8:30 am

maraxusofkeld wrote:This might be to decrease the amount of nonsense being submitted to cut down on grading times across the board.

The amount of garbage I see being graded and listed on ebay is unreal.

Absolutely cannot disagree with that.

nycjadie · Post by **nycjadie** » Sat Apr 29, 2017 9:10 am

I think CGC just likes to grade as many comics as possible, garbage or not.

GGSAE · Post by **GGSAE** » Sat Apr 29, 2017 9:27 am

Dang I've had a batch of books I've been sitting on for months, better get it together!

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XOisTops1 · Post by **XOisTops1** » Sat Apr 29, 2017 11:02 am

Yes, same here...Looks like I will send in a batch before 6/1

michael · Post by **michael** » Sat Apr 29, 2017 12:33 pm

First off, full discloser, I quit CGC a year ago and only submit to CBCS so CGC increase doesn't affect me unless CBCS follows suite.

Is this math right?

Add up all the fees to get a yellow label from CGC vs CBCS. CGC: $32 fee added for signature series. CBCS: $5 is added . Hell even CBCS red label is now cheaper than a CGC yellow.

one book, CGC: $28 plus shipping, CBCS: $18 plus shipping or $16 CBCS member. Can we even submit directly to CGC without a membership?

If it's CGC trying to make up for lost business to CBCS, that's the business kiss of death when equal competition is underpricing you. They cant be that dumb... right? Although, it was about a year ago that CGC announced those wavy slabs. It must be a yearly thing now for CGC to try and *SQUEE* people off.

Time will tell, but I guess it open the door for CBCS to raise prices in the near future too.

nycjadie · Post by **nycjadie** » Sat Apr 29, 2017 5:09 pm

I do CGC by bulk, so my experiences might be different. My total per book is usually about $22, plus the book cost. Sometimes it's more or less. This will make it $24.

GGSAE · Post by **GGSAE** » Sat Apr 29, 2017 7:21 pm

nycjadie wrote:I do CGC by bulk, so my experiences might be different. My total per book is usually about $22, plus the book cost. Sometimes it's more or less. This will make it $24.

I think the price increase is negligible considering how much more CGC slabs sell for vs the competition.
I think seeing a higher increase in price might sway some people from submitting all those commons with little value. I guess some of the other big submitters will have to tell us if it's worthwhile to continue subbing 'non-valuable' commons in bulk.

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michael · Post by **michael** » Sun Apr 30, 2017 4:01 pm

GGSAE wrote:
nycjadie wrote:I do CGC by bulk, so my experiences might be different. My total per book is usually about $22, plus the book cost. Sometimes it's more or less. This will make it $24.
I think the price increase is negligible considering how much more CGC slabs sell for vs the competition.
I think seeing a higher increase in price might sway some people from submitting all those commons with little value. I guess some of the other big submitters will have to tell us if it's worthwhile to continue subbing 'non-valuable' commons in bulk.

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$22 vs $16 membership prices is a big difference even doing bulk order CGC. You can also get CBCS for $14 if you're a dealer but I didn't want to go to bulk orders or dealer prices because I wouldn't imagine that's realistic for most of us. Yellow label added costs seems a laughable price between the two.

Sells for "much more" is a big stretch nowadays. Typically 0%-2.5% and dropping if historical trends continue. Even Golden Era comics are being CBCS slabbed which says a lot about CBCS slab sales confidence increasing. That old argument "CGC sells for more than CBCS" is becoming just that, an old one and only argument.

But, if not, then I will continue to buy or get slabbed my equal 9.8s, 9.6s for less than the other guy. Win-Win for me whatever happens.

I win, if I continue to get equal slabs a little cheaper, buy or slab. Or, I win if slabs selling price becomes completely equal to CGC, which makes my return on investment a little higher if I ever sell any. I haven't sold a slab yet.

nycjadie · Post by **nycjadie** » Sun Apr 30, 2017 5:05 pm

My costs with shipping and fees both ways are up to $22. The increase is going up $2 for moderns, but more for the other tiers.

GGSAE · Post by **GGSAE** » Sun Apr 30, 2017 8:48 pm

0-2.5%? C'mon!
There is a definite premium, I just did a search on BA12 in 9.4 of all sold listings that came up. CGCS averaged $725, CGC averaged 792. All values in CAD.
And I'm not even applying a discount for lack of liquidity which I'm sure exists on CBCS.
We all know you have some sort of vendetta or mission against CGC, but the facts are the facts.

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nycjadie · Post by **nycjadie** » Sun Apr 30, 2017 11:04 pm

I bet the premium for CGC is a lot less on super keys than average copies, like an X-O #2.

greg · Post by **greg** » Mon May 01, 2017 4:01 pm

GGSAE wrote:0-2.5%? C'mon!
There is a definite premium, I just did a search on BA12 in 9.4 of all sold listings that came up. CGCS averaged $725, CGC averaged 792. All values in CAD.
And I'm not even applying a discount for lack of liquidity which I'm sure exists on CBCS.
We all know you have some sort of vendetta or mission against CGC, but the facts are the facts.

I'm not convinced either way.

I just ran all Ebay results for 2016 for CGC 9.6 and CBCS 9.6 for Batman Adventures #12.
(There are more results for 9.6 than there are for 9.4 or 9.8)

CGC 9.6 = 60 sales, $824.38 average
CBCS 9.6 = 14 sales, $861.70 average

Throw out the highest and lowest sales and you get:
CGC 9.6 = 58 sales, $822.63 average
CBCS 9.6 = 12 sales, $825.65 average

nycjadie · Post by **nycjadie** » Mon May 01, 2017 4:21 pm

I think for a super key, people just want the book, and the grading company is less important. I think with minor keys and commons, the results may be different.

michael · Post by **michael** » Tue May 02, 2017 3:11 am

nycjadie wrote:I think for a super key, people just want the book, and the grading company is less important. I think with minor keys and commons, the results may be different.

I'm a collector who hasn't sold anything, Being only 20 I don't plan on selling any time soon. Like 25+ years. I like to save a little $ for the same thing especially if I'm slabbing it myself and shipping from Canada.

If I was a seller in todays market, I could see the $200 to $1000 being the sweet spot for CGC selling but the gap is closing in this range too. I think this price range is most profitable for sellers.

Over the $1k keys I agree with nycjadie, there doesn't seem to be a $ gap anymore. At least with what I'm interested in.

I think under $100 it may even be in favor for CBCS nowadays. Slabbing commons/most moderns and being able to save $5+ a slab on low $ comics is significant for a "collector". Being that most Valiant comics are under $100 when slabbed I think CBCS is the way to go. Not just because CGC burned me last year on many of my WWII Canadian Whites.

Going past 6 months for CGC/CBCS $ comparison is probably too far due to gap shrinking. Makes it difficult to have solid figures one way or the other. Therefore, I tend to go with my experience on what I'm interested in. I've found there is still generally a gap but it's smaller than most people think.

Back to Thread topic: I wouldn't think selling could make up that $5+ gap on common slab selling, but I'm no expert on selling.

I still don't know why anyone would get a Yellow label with CGC now due to all the added costs compared to CBCS Yellow label. Maybe someone could chime in on this. I may be missing something here with Yellow labels. I've never done one only bought.

As a millennial I use the web as a tool differently than gen x/y so I apologize to those who think I'm being bias. Everything I've said is true to my experience. If others disagree that is fine. That's what this forum is for. I try to see it from others prospective to. I'm sure flippers/dealers see it completely opposite to me. I want to get same thing as cheap as possible "CBCS"and sellers want to sell at max "CGC". Now, I hope CBCS doesn't immediately raise prices.

Intrepidxc · Post by **Intrepidxc** » Tue May 02, 2017 8:40 am

I think within the next year we'll see more parity between CGC and CBCS. For me they are both the same, except for the registry. The registry is keeping me loyal to CGC because I'm trying to close some holes in my registry collection. Once those registry holes are complete I'll probably be a CBCS submitter.

nycjadie · Post by **nycjadie** » Tue May 02, 2017 8:43 am

There are lots of different types of buyers. Some just want the book, others the grade, and still others want the grader. Some also like a uniform collection of graded comics. I looked at a handful of closed sales of some of the most commonly graded moderns, and I don't see any CBCS sales. Still others, I see only 2. I'm not sure what that means other than many of those books in CBCS slabs are just not as readily available. Maybe some day CBCS slabs will become more coveted. I don't see that yet. I have numerous CBCS slabs in my collection, but I don't pay much for them. I'm still not yet convinced they will retain the value as CGC slabs have. I steer clear of them, much the way I do other types of slabs. However, if the book and price are right (for me), I'll grab them.

A recent seller was selling CBCS Valiant slabs in batches, along with CGC slabs. The CGC slabs sold for a much higher margin. I'm just not convinced they are there yet. And while CBCS is marginally lower in price, they take longer than CGC to grade.

greg · Post by **greg** » Tue May 02, 2017 9:26 am

It's definitely reasonable to "wait and see" on CBCS, but I think it's also reasonable to recognize that Steve Borock started CGC and Steve Borock started CBCS.

He's the "Henry Ford" of comic grading...
CGC is the Ford Model T
CBCS is the Ford Model A

When the Model A was still new, I'm sure it faced resistance from decades of Model T owners.

(PGX is a horse with a cardboard cutout of a car on each side.)

jeremycoe · Post by **jeremycoe** » Tue May 02, 2017 9:35 am

greg wrote:It's definitely reasonable to "wait and see" on CBCS, but I think it's also reasonable to recognize that Steve Borock started CGC and Steve Borock started CBCS.

He's the "Henry Ford" of comic grading...
CGC is the Ford Model T
CBCS is the Ford Model A

When the Model A was still new, I'm sure it faced resistance from decades of Model T owners.

(PGX is a horse with a cardboard cutout of a car on each side.)

Or maybe Steve is the "Steve Jobs" of comic grading...
CGC is Apple
CBCS is NeXT

greg · Post by **greg** » Tue May 02, 2017 9:40 am

jeremycoe wrote:Or maybe Steve is the "Steve Jobs" of comic grading...
CGC is Apple
CBCS is NeXT

So, when CGC purchases CBCS...

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