Bloodshot #13 discussion

[tchalla8]

This one was...oof....tough to call. I like a lot of the little pieces to the equation that we didn't have before, but they did not do a very good job of hiding the fact that they were wiping the slate clean for Bloodshot to move forward. As if Duane Swierczinski's ideas and supporting characters we're being removed permanently to make room for new management. The wrap up to Bloodshot's story in HW felt rushed, and I have no idea how Harada squeezed in time to pummel Bloodshot to little pieces when he seemed to be completely occupied in HW #4 and Harby #14 with dealing with PRS and gathering the Next Gen kids.

Overall...I hate to say this, and I want to read through it one more time just to be sure....but it felt like a sloppy wrap up to Bloodshot's involvement in HW to me after he had such a great start.

I think the timing couldn't be better for moving on from Harbinger Wars. It might have overstayed it's welcome just a tad. Looking forward to seeing what Dysart has up his sleeve next.

[swtor1091]

This issue is crap ... Eight pages were bloody great and the rest was slop... Glad to see Duane leave and gage.and josh take the reigns... So is Melissa gone because I think she will be part of hard corps or her brother anyway at some point..... Right? I would give this issue a 1.5 out of 5

[tchalla8]

Ok, someone tell me. Had Melissa's brother been mentioned before or was that completely out of left field to remove her from the story?

[bygranddesign]

This was my least favorite issue in the Harbinger Wars

Pretty disappointing. Seemed rushed and dare I say - a bit mailed in. Very little new insight into characters other then disappointingly uncharacteristic behavior from Kara.

Kara who had acted heroically and unselfishly in the face of tremendous danger up to this point ... ditches the little kids to save her own bacon? Seriously??

Then a lot of replaying of the same battle scenes ... but unlike with the Harada Protocol that had some nice insight into the inner working of Bloodshot ... these scenes really had nothing new to add. Kitson's art which is usually across the board solid was sort of hit and miss i thought ... and just pales in comparison to Henry's work on the same scenes.

Seeing Kara's brother was interesting ... its been hinted at and speculated that he would be worked into the storyline and perhaps have a role in HARD Corps so i'm looking forward to whether that comes to fruition.

Clayton Crain's pages were really cool (i'm surprised he is not listed on the book as one of the artists) ... and was a glimpse into what DS does best with the Bloodshot character by delving into his tragic identity crisis ... but really there wasn't enough of that in the issue.

Overall .... 5/10

[bygranddesign]

Ok, someone tell me. Had Melissa's brother been mentioned before or was that completely out of left field to remove her from the story?

Melissa was Pulse

Kara is the one who has the injured brother from the military ... and she had mentioned him early in the series (maybe issue 3 or 4?).

Its been speculated that perhaps she or him or both will be worked into HARD Corps.

I don't think it will be the last we see of Kara

[bygranddesign]

One thing i'll say that might redeem Kara is if she joins HARD Corp in order to try and make up for her leaving the kids behind. I still don't think the scene was handled well ... You'd like to see her get her hands a little dirty before she flees the scene ... but I can see them going in that direction with the character which will make it more palatable.

[tchalla8]

Ok, someone tell me. Had Melissa's brother been mentioned before or was that completely out of left field to remove her from the story?

Melissa was Pulse

Kara is the one who has the injured brother from the military ... and she had mentioned him early in the series (maybe issue 3 or 4?).

Its been speculated that perhaps she or him or both will be worked into HARD Corps.

I don't think it will be the last we see of Kara

my bad....Kara....didn't have the book in front of me and got 'em mixed up.

[bygranddesign]

my bad....Kara....didn't have the book in front of me and got 'em mixed up.

i've confused them quite a bit myself at times

One of my few pet peeves with Valiant is that mixing up characters seems to happen more than it should ... i'm still confused about whose ion and whose stronghold

[Keith]

My biggest gripe with this issue was the change in action between Bloodshot and the Renegades. Call me a continuity nut, but there were too many differences between the battle we saw in Harbinger and Harbinger Wars vs. what we saw in Bloodshot #13.

[BugsySig]

This issue was just not good...Well, the first few pages of flashback were good, and the confrontation with Harada was typical Bloodshot brutality, but overall this seemed rushed from story to art (with the exception of Crain's pages).

Kara bouncing on the kids made ZERO sense for her character as was mentioned already. Was this just a way to write her out of the book? First Kuretich, now this? In a lot of ways this reminded me of a few of the New 52 books I read just before new creative teams came on...where an issue or two just became a throwaway to wipe the slate clean.

This really went from a surprise favorite of the relaunch to the bottom of the pile from #8 on. Hopefully between the zero issue and the renaming/new creative team new readers will check the series out, because this issue might have driven me away from this series altogether if those weren't around the corner.

[CallMeBloodshot]

This issue is crap ... Eight pages were bloody great and the rest was slop... Glad to see Duane leave and gage.and josh take the reigns... So is Melissa gone because I think she will be part of hard corps or her brother anyway at some point..... Right? I would give this issue a 1.5 out of 5

Wow. Crap, really? Definitely not great but what bothered you so much about it? It's obvious this and Harby would act as a resolution to the whole event.

[CallMeBloodshot]

This issue was just not good...Well, the first few pages of flashback were good, and the confrontation with Harada was typical Bloodshot brutality, but overall this seemed rushed from story to art (with the exception of Crain's pages).

Kara bouncing on the kids made ZERO sense for her character as was mentioned already. Was this just a way to write her out of the book? First Kuretich, now this? In a lot of ways this reminded me of a few of the New 52 books I read just before new creative teams came on...where an issue or two just became a throwaway to wipe the slate clean.

This really went from a surprise favorite of the relaunch to the bottom of the pile from #8 on. Hopefully between the zero issue and the renaming/new creative team new readers will check the series out, because this issue might have driven me away from this series altogether if those weren't around the corner.

Yeah I'd agree that the HW arc for Bloodsht brought the title down. The first two arcs were splendid. Seems the crossover did wonders for Harby, but it really kind of screwed over Duane and what he had going with ole Bloodshot.

The good to take away from this is that zero issue comes out next, which should be great and the HARD Corps change will add an interesting dynamic going forward.

[swtor1091]

This issue is crap ... Eight pages were bloody great and the rest was slop... Glad to see Duane leave and gage.and josh take the reigns... So is Melissa gone because I think she will be part of hard corps or her brother anyway at some point..... Right? I would give this issue a 1.5 out of 5

Wow. Crap, really? Definitely not great but what bothered you so much about it? It's obvious this and Harby would act as a resolution to the whole event.

A resolution I would have been fine with... Harbinger was great and I love bloodshot but the last few issues have been junk like Duane doesn't care anymore... I know im not the only person saying this too depending on many of the other comments... The only thing that was.good was the dream.sequence in the beginning

[BugsySig]

This issue is crap ... Eight pages were bloody great and the rest was slop... Glad to see Duane leave and gage.and josh take the reigns... So is Melissa gone because I think she will be part of hard corps or her brother anyway at some point..... Right? I would give this issue a 1.5 out of 5

Wow. Crap, really? Definitely not great but what bothered you so much about it? It's obvious this and Harby would act as a resolution to the whole event.

A resolution I would have been fine with... Harbinger was great and I love bloodshot but the last few issues have been junk like Duane doesn't care anymore... I know im not the only person saying this too depending on many of the other comments... The only thing that was.good was the dream.sequence in the beginning

I agree. I'd say only 2 of the 4 issues from this arc were any good, and those were the first 2..and one of those just rehashed Harbinger Wars #2. It's like Duane couldn't figure out how to fit BS into the crossover...Maybe if he had been able to fully co-write the crossover it would have been better, but these issues were more like, "How can I write this without worrying about the main story?" then, "How can I wipe the slate clean for the new creative team?"

[bygranddesign]

This issue was just not good...Well, the first few pages of flashback were good, and the confrontation with Harada was typical Bloodshot brutality, but overall this seemed rushed from story to art (with the exception of Crain's pages).

Kara bouncing on the kids made ZERO sense for her character as was mentioned already. Was this just a way to write her out of the book? First Kuretich, now this? In a lot of ways this reminded me of a few of the New 52 books I read just before new creative teams came on...where an issue or two just became a throwaway to wipe the slate clean.

This really went from a surprise favorite of the relaunch to the bottom of the pile from #8 on. Hopefully between the zero issue and the renaming/new creative team new readers will check the series out, because this issue might have driven me away from this series altogether if those weren't around the corner.

Yep, I agree with what your saying ... Kara bouncing like that was a huge disappointment and way out of whack from the character. I understand that they want Bloodshot (harbinger wars) to work as its own TPB but they didn't need to show some of these Bloodshot fight scenes again ... instead I would rather have seen a scene with Kara trying to save the kids and maybe present a better, more realistic insight as to why her character would have bailed. Something that would have reflected better on her character then saying "bye kids, good luck!" and booking from the scene.(how exactly is she escaping from that scene anyway without the military apprehending her?) I think its understandable for someone to run in the fog of war .. but Kara has been in the heart of PRS fighting Chainsaw I don't think she would have bailed that quickly in the fight especially with kids lives at stake.

Anyway ... I think D.S has had a lot of great moments as the writer of Bloodshot. I think his ideas for the character were very smart and I think they are very important to what Matt Kindt is doing for issue #0 and with everything that will happen in BS&HC so his work will live on in the character ... but I'm very excited about what Kindt is bringing to the table for BS#0 (loved the preview) and I loved the preview for BS&HC with Gage and Dysart. So i'm very excited about the future of Bloodshot ... I think the best is yet to come.

[CallMeBloodshot]

This issue is crap ... Eight pages were bloody great and the rest was slop... Glad to see Duane leave and gage.and josh take the reigns... So is Melissa gone because I think she will be part of hard corps or her brother anyway at some point..... Right? I would give this issue a 1.5 out of 5

Wow. Crap, really? Definitely not great but what bothered you so much about it? It's obvious this and Harby would act as a resolution to the whole event.

A resolution I would have been fine with... Harbinger was great and I love bloodshot but the last few issues have been junk like Duane doesn't care anymore... I know im not the only person saying this too depending on many of the other comments... The only thing that was.good was the dream.sequence in the beginning

Hmm I don't feel like he doesn't care anymore. I understand that criticism but its easy to say when a writer leaves a title. but lets not forget how a crossover can tie a writer's hands a bit. I think the dream sequence bit and him not going down to Harada without a fight made a good swan song issue for Duane on Bloodshot. Classic psycho thriller style action that we're used to from him. The other bits are stuff he basically has to do to hand the title over.

I'll miss Swierczynski. His first two arcs were brilliant. Though I think the title will be in ood hands with Kindt next month.

[BugsySig]

This issue was just not good...Well, the first few pages of flashback were good, and the confrontation with Harada was typical Bloodshot brutality, but overall this seemed rushed from story to art (with the exception of Crain's pages).

Kara bouncing on the kids made ZERO sense for her character as was mentioned already. Was this just a way to write her out of the book? First Kuretich, now this? In a lot of ways this reminded me of a few of the New 52 books I read just before new creative teams came on...where an issue or two just became a throwaway to wipe the slate clean.

This really went from a surprise favorite of the relaunch to the bottom of the pile from #8 on. Hopefully between the zero issue and the renaming/new creative team new readers will check the series out, because this issue might have driven me away from this series altogether if those weren't around the corner.

Yep, I agree with what your saying ... Kara bouncing like that was a huge disappointment and way out of whack from the character. I understand that they want Bloodshot (harbinger wars) to work as its own TPB but they didn't need to show some of these Bloodshot fight scenes again ... instead I would rather have seen a scene with Kara trying to save the kids and maybe present a better, more realistic insight as to why her character would have bailed. Something that would have reflected better on her character then saying "bye kids, good luck!" and booking from the scene.(how exactly is she escaping from that scene anyway without the military apprehending her?) I think its understandable for someone to run in the fog of war .. but Kara has been in the heart of PRS fighting Chainsaw I don't think she would have bailed that quickly in the fight especially with kids lives at stake.

Anyway ... I think D.S has had a lot of great moments as the writer of Bloodshot. I think his ideas for the character were very smart and I think they are very important to what Matt Kindt is doing for issue #0 and with everything that will happen in BS&HC so his work will live on in the character ... but I'm very excited about what Kindt is bringing to the table for BS#0 (loved the preview) and I loved the preview for BS&HC with Gage and Dysart. So i'm very excited about the future of Bloodshot ... I think the best is yet to come.

I think it would have been better if BS just left her behind at the meat packing plant with the coordinates and instructions in order to protect her.

And I agree with your assessment. I loved the first arc and most of the second arc. I think DS did a great job reinventing the character, and that concept will continue through the new creative team.

[swtor1091]

This issue is crap ... Eight pages were bloody great and the rest was slop... Glad to see Duane leave and gage.and josh take the reigns... So is Melissa gone because I think she will be part of hard corps or her brother anyway at some point..... Right? I would give this issue a 1.5 out of 5

Wow. Crap, really? Definitely not great but what bothered you so much about it? It's obvious this and Harby would act as a resolution to the whole event.

A resolution I would have been fine with... Harbinger was great and I love bloodshot but the last few issues have been junk like Duane doesn't care anymore... I know im not the only person saying this too depending on many of the other comments... The only thing that was.good was the dream.sequence in the beginning

Hmm I don't feel like he doesn't care anymore. I understand that criticism but its easy to say when a writer leaves a title. but lets not forget how a crossover can tie a writer's hands a bit. I think the dream sequence bit and him not going down to Harada without a fight made a good swan song issue for Duane on Bloodshot. Classic psycho thriller style action that we're used to from him. The other bits are stuff he basically has to do to hand the title over.

I'll miss Swierczynski. His first two arcs were brilliant. Though I think the title will be in ood hands with Kindt next month.

I don't even understand where harada came from to be honestly... It seems like a odd thing that he would even look for bloodshot given what he was doing in harbinger wars #4 and harbinger #14..... It seemed like Duane put that in there to fill a couple of more pages.... Or to kill bloodshot one more time before he signed off...

[CallMeBloodshot]

This issue was just not good...Well, the first few pages of flashback were good, and the confrontation with Harada was typical Bloodshot brutality, but overall this seemed rushed from story to art (with the exception of Crain's pages).

Kara bouncing on the kids made ZERO sense for her character as was mentioned already. Was this just a way to write her out of the book? First Kuretich, now this? In a lot of ways this reminded me of a few of the New 52 books I read just before new creative teams came on...where an issue or two just became a throwaway to wipe the slate clean.

This really went from a surprise favorite of the relaunch to the bottom of the pile from #8 on. Hopefully between the zero issue and the renaming/new creative team new readers will check the series out, because this issue might have driven me away from this series altogether if those weren't around the corner.

Yep, I agree with what your saying ... Kara bouncing like that was a huge disappointment and way out of whack from the character. I understand that they want Bloodshot (harbinger wars) to work as its own TPB but they didn't need to show some of these Bloodshot fight scenes again ... instead I would rather have seen a scene with Kara trying to save the kids and maybe present a better, more realistic insight as to why her character would have bailed. Something that would have reflected better on her character then saying "bye kids, good luck!" and booking from the scene.(how exactly is she escaping from that scene anyway without the military apprehending her?) I think its understandable for someone to run in the fog of war .. but Kara has been in the heart of PRS fighting Chainsaw I don't think she would have bailed that quickly in the fight especially with kids lives at stake.

Anyway ... I think D.S has had a lot of great moments as the writer of Bloodshot. I think his ideas for the character were very smart and I think they are very important to what Matt Kindt is doing for issue #0 and with everything that will happen in BS&HC so his work will live on in the character ... but I'm very excited about what Kindt is bringing to the table for BS#0 (loved the preview) and I loved the preview for BS&HC with Gage and Dysart. So i'm very excited about the future of Bloodshot ... I think the best is yet to come.

They did the same thing in Harbinger, yet you don't criticize Harby for it. It's to make them good stand alone trades, as you've said. Totally fair if it didn't sit well with you, but I don't think these criticisms are consistent or fair when considering what Valiant was tryin to do as a whole.

[tchalla8]

This issue is crap ... Eight pages were bloody great and the rest was slop... Glad to see Duane leave and gage.and josh take the reigns... So is Melissa gone because I think she will be part of hard corps or her brother anyway at some point..... Right? I would give this issue a 1.5 out of 5

Wow. Crap, really? Definitely not great but what bothered you so much about it? It's obvious this and Harby would act as a resolution to the whole event.

A resolution I would have been fine with... Harbinger was great and I love bloodshot but the last few issues have been junk like Duane doesn't care anymore... I know im not the only person saying this too depending on many of the other comments... The only thing that was.good was the dream.sequence in the beginning

Hmm I don't feel like he doesn't care anymore. I understand that criticism but its easy to say when a writer leaves a title. but lets not forget how a crossover can tie a writer's hands a bit. I think the dream sequence bit and him not going down to Harada without a fight made a good swan song issue for Duane on Bloodshot. Classic psycho thriller style action that we're used to from him. The other bits are stuff he basically has to do to hand the title over.

I'll miss Swierczynski. His first two arcs were brilliant. Though I think the title will be in ood hands with Kindt next month.

I don't even understand where harada came from to be honestly... It seems like a odd thing that he would even look for bloodshot given what he was doing in harbinger wars #4 and harbinger #14..... It seemed like Duane put that in there to fill a couple of more pages.... Or to kill bloodshot one more time before he signed off...

That was my original point...what was Harada even doing there?...it was jarring to have Harada suddenly show up...

[CallMeBloodshot]

This issue is crap ... Eight pages were bloody great and the rest was slop... Glad to see Duane leave and gage.and josh take the reigns... So is Melissa gone because I think she will be part of hard corps or her brother anyway at some point..... Right? I would give this issue a 1.5 out of 5

Wow. Crap, really? Definitely not great but what bothered you so much about it? It's obvious this and Harby would act as a resolution to the whole event.

A resolution I would have been fine with... Harbinger was great and I love bloodshot but the last few issues have been junk like Duane doesn't care anymore... I know im not the only person saying this too depending on many of the other comments... The only thing that was.good was the dream.sequence in the beginning

Hmm I don't feel like he doesn't care anymore. I understand that criticism but its easy to say when a writer leaves a title. but lets not forget how a crossover can tie a writer's hands a bit. I think the dream sequence bit and him not going down to Harada without a fight made a good swan song issue for Duane on Bloodshot. Classic psycho thriller style action that we're used to from him. The other bits are stuff he basically has to do to hand the title over.

I'll miss Swierczynski. His first two arcs were brilliant. Though I think the title will be in ood hands with Kindt next month.

I don't even understand where harada came from to be honestly... It seems like a odd thing that he would even look for bloodshot given what he was doing in harbinger wars #4 and harbinger #14..... It seemed like Duane put that in there to fill a couple of more pages.... Or to kill bloodshot one more time before he signed off...

No it was because Harada captures him. I thought you said you read the previews..

[tchalla8]

This issue was just not good...Well, the first few pages of flashback were good, and the confrontation with Harada was typical Bloodshot brutality, but overall this seemed rushed from story to art (with the exception of Crain's pages).

Kara bouncing on the kids made ZERO sense for her character as was mentioned already. Was this just a way to write her out of the book? First Kuretich, now this? In a lot of ways this reminded me of a few of the New 52 books I read just before new creative teams came on...where an issue or two just became a throwaway to wipe the slate clean.

This really went from a surprise favorite of the relaunch to the bottom of the pile from #8 on. Hopefully between the zero issue and the renaming/new creative team new readers will check the series out, because this issue might have driven me away from this series altogether if those weren't around the corner.

Yep, I agree with what your saying ... Kara bouncing like that was a huge disappointment and way out of whack from the character. I understand that they want Bloodshot (harbinger wars) to work as its own TPB but they didn't need to show some of these Bloodshot fight scenes again ... instead I would rather have seen a scene with Kara trying to save the kids and maybe present a better, more realistic insight as to why her character would have bailed. Something that would have reflected better on her character then saying "bye kids, good luck!" and booking from the scene.(how exactly is she escaping from that scene anyway without the military apprehending her?) I think its understandable for someone to run in the fog of war .. but Kara has been in the heart of PRS fighting Chainsaw I don't think she would have bailed that quickly in the fight especially with kids lives at stake.

Anyway ... I think D.S has had a lot of great moments as the writer of Bloodshot. I think his ideas for the character were very smart and I think they are very important to what Matt Kindt is doing for issue #0 and with everything that will happen in BS&HC so his work will live on in the character ... but I'm very excited about what Kindt is bringing to the table for BS#0 (loved the preview) and I loved the preview for BS&HC with Gage and Dysart. So i'm very excited about the future of Bloodshot ... I think the best is yet to come.

They did the same thing in Harbinger, yet you don't criticize Harby for it. It's to make them good stand alone trades, as you've said. Totally fair if it didn't sit well with you, but I don't think these criticisms are consistent or fair when considering what Valiant was tryin to do as a whole.

Yes, they did the same thing in Harby. But it was just handled so much better over there.

[swtor1091]

This issue is crap ... Eight pages were bloody great and the rest was slop... Glad to see Duane leave and gage.and josh take the reigns... So is Melissa gone because I think she will be part of hard corps or her brother anyway at some point..... Right? I would give this issue a 1.5 out of 5

Wow. Crap, really? Definitely not great but what bothered you so much about it? It's obvious this and Harby would act as a resolution to the whole event.

A resolution I would have been fine with... Harbinger was great and I love bloodshot but the last few issues have been junk like Duane doesn't care anymore... I know im not the only person saying this too depending on many of the other comments... The only thing that was.good was the dream.sequence in the beginning

Hmm I don't feel like he doesn't care anymore. I understand that criticism but its easy to say when a writer leaves a title. but lets not forget how a crossover can tie a writer's hands a bit. I think the dream sequence bit and him not going down to Harada without a fight made a good swan song issue for Duane on Bloodshot. Classic psycho thriller style action that we're used to from him. The other bits are stuff he basically has to do to hand the title over.

I'll miss Swierczynski. His first two arcs were brilliant. Though I think the title will be in ood hands with Kindt next month.

I don't even understand where harada came from to be honestly... It seems like a odd thing that he would even look for bloodshot given what he was doing in harbinger wars #4 and harbinger #14..... It seemed like Duane put that in there to fill a couple of more pages.... Or to kill bloodshot one more time before he signed off...

That was my original point...what was Harada even doing there?...it was jarring to have Harada suddenly show up...

I'm not alone haha

[swtor1091]

This issue is crap ... Eight pages were bloody great and the rest was slop... Glad to see Duane leave and gage.and josh take the reigns... So is Melissa gone because I think she will be part of hard corps or her brother anyway at some point..... Right? I would give this issue a 1.5 out of 5

Wow. Crap, really? Definitely not great but what bothered you so much about it? It's obvious this and Harby would act as a resolution to the whole event.

A resolution I would have been fine with... Harbinger was great and I love bloodshot but the last few issues have been junk like Duane doesn't care anymore... I know im not the only person saying this too depending on many of the other comments... The only thing that was.good was the dream.sequence in the beginning

Hmm I don't feel like he doesn't care anymore. I understand that criticism but its easy to say when a writer leaves a title. but lets not forget how a crossover can tie a writer's hands a bit. I think the dream sequence bit and him not going down to Harada without a fight made a good swan song issue for Duane on Bloodshot. Classic psycho thriller style action that we're used to from him. The other bits are stuff he basically has to do to hand the title over.

I'll miss Swierczynski. His first two arcs were brilliant. Though I think the title will be in ood hands with Kindt next month.

I don't even understand where harada came from to be honestly... It seems like a odd thing that he would even look for bloodshot given what he was doing in harbinger wars #4 and harbinger #14..... It seemed like Duane put that in there to fill a couple of more pages.... Or to kill bloodshot one more time before he signed off...

No it was because Harada captures him. I thought you said you read the previews..

Captures him... When did this happen.... Because I flipped through the issue again and didn't.see.crap

[bygranddesign]

I agree. I'd say only 2 of the 4 issues from this arc were any good, and those were the first 2..and one of those just rehashed Harbinger Wars #2. It's like Duane couldn't figure out how to fit BS into the crossover...Maybe if he had been able to fully co-write the crossover it would have been better, but these issues were more like, "How can I write this without worrying about the main story?" then, "How can I wipe the slate clean for the new creative team?"

I agree he had difficulty finding interesting plot points to tie into Harbinger Wars. too many wasted pages of uninteresting action that we saw already.

Dysart weaved in 1969 Harbinger Wars giving a real smart back story that shed some light on the current conflict.

I'm surprised DS couldn't weave in an interesting side story as well ...

I don't agree that he was "wiping the slate clean..". I think everything he was building up to is integral to the character moving forward. I just think the way he put the pieces in place for the next team was done in-artfully.