Shadowman Death (spoilers)

Sect · Post by **Sect** » Mon Nov 22, 2004 2:37:19 am

So I picked up my copy of Shadowman 43 and I was excited to see how the last issue would pan out.

I was somewhat dissapointed in the way they left it. We all know he dies in 1999 but we also see him jumping off the building.

So whats the deal? Is it just left to our imaginations or what?

DJSpecter · Post by **DJSpecter** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 8:10:12 am

The start of VH2 Shadowman shows Jack actually dead. Which is just another spear in our prophecy.

My fanfic has it that he is saved by Solar from 4001, but those stories haven't been written, much less published or read.

-Dave

Wizard of Utopia · Post by **Wizard of Utopia** » Tue Nov 23, 2004 8:44:44 am

Sect wrote:So I picked up my copy of Shadowman 43 and I was excited to see how the last issue would pan out.

I was somewhat dissapointed in the way they left it. We all know he dies in 1999 but we also see him jumping off the building.

So whats the deal? Is it just left to our imaginations or what?

Bob Hall said he left the storyline open-ended on purpose. I think the exact quote was posted by someone else here on the board who spoke with Bob.

ManofTheAtom · Post by **ManofTheAtom** » Thu Nov 25, 2004 11:35:06 pm

It's been said that what ended up being Ennis' first four issues of VH 2 Shadowman were designed to be the first four issues of a new arc in VH 1 Shadowman (most likely 44-48).

It's been said that the dialogue in issue 1 was changed to reflect a different cause of death for Jack.

Apparently, Ennis hated Jack (most likely because he wasn't a sterotypical guy with a gun, like Ennis likes them).

depluto · Post by **depluto** » Fri Nov 26, 2004 12:47:48 am

I suspected Acclaim's influence with the VH2 Shadowman.

The video game that came out was based on that short Ennis run; I think his revamping of the character was done with that in mind (at least the back of his mind).

And that game sucked.

Sect · Post by **Sect** » Fri Nov 26, 2004 12:54:28 am

That's lame.

I guess I'm never gonna see for myself since I refuse to pick up any of the VH2 stuff.

Oh well, thanks for the input it was nice to know that at least.

As for VH2 Shadowman, from the looks of the covers, it looks like he became a MIB and what is up with the use of guns?

Did VH2 stick with the vodoo powers and if so why would they feel the need to resort to using guns. Dumb if you ask me.

ManofTheAtom · Post by **ManofTheAtom** » Fri Nov 26, 2004 9:15:50 am

Ennis can only write characters with guns.

ZephyrWasHOT!! · Post by **ZephyrWasHOT!!** » Fri Nov 26, 2004 1:16:27 pm

ManofTheAtom wrote:Ennis can only write characters with guns.

Preacher never carried a gun.

Neither did John Constantine.

ManofTheAtom · Post by **ManofTheAtom** » Fri Nov 26, 2004 3:55:56 pm

ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote:Preacher never carried a gun. Neither did John Constantine.

Preacher had characters with guns, right? (Tulip I believe her name was).

And Ennis didn't create Hellblazer and puttign a gun on his hand would have gone against his character, right?

Did he do characters with guns in that one?

ZephyrWasHOT!! · Post by **ZephyrWasHOT!!** » Fri Nov 26, 2004 8:31:35 pm

ManofTheAtom wrote:
ZephyrWasHOT!! wrote:Preacher never carried a gun. Neither did John Constantine.
Preacher had characters with guns, right? (Tulip I believe her name was).

And Ennis didn't create Hellblazer and puttign a gun on his hand would have gone against his character, right?

Did he do characters with guns in that one?

Ahhh...but all you said was 'He couldn't write characters without guns' not 'he couldn't write BOOKS without guns'.

Slight difference.

And Hellblazer didn't have guns, no.

ManofTheAtom · Post by **ManofTheAtom** » Fri Nov 26, 2004 8:33:08 pm

Heh, ok. I'll concede that.

jordan silo · Post by **jordan silo** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 1:06:06 am

So ummm what comic book issue did Jack Boniface die in?

ManofTheAtom · Post by **ManofTheAtom** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 1:11:04 am

jordan silo wrote:So ummm what comic book issue did Jack Boniface die in?

Shadowman Volume 3 #3 and #4, and Unity 2000 #1.

ALL Shadowmen and ALL Jack Boniface across the VALIANT (urgh) multiverse were killed by an envoy of (VH 3) Master Darque (the VALIANT Jack died in U2K #1 trying to stop Darque's plan).

jordan silo · Post by **jordan silo** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:42:04 am

ManofTheAtom wrote:
jordan silo wrote:So ummm what comic book issue did Jack Boniface die in?
Shadowman Volume 3 #3 and #4, and Unity 2000 #1.

ALL Shadowmen and ALL Jack Boniface across the VALIANT (urgh) multiverse were killed by an envoy of (VH 3) Master Darque (the VALIANT Jack died in U2K #1 trying to stop Darque's plan).

"The start of VH2 Shadowman shows Jack actually dead. Which is just another spear in our prophecy."

So ummm when did he die first? If Vol.2 Issue 1 shows he is dead already?

ManofTheAtom · Post by **ManofTheAtom** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 11:45:38 am

Different Jack

The VH 2 Jack Boniface was killed by (urgh...) Tommy Lee Bones, who stuck Jack's sax in his *SQUEE* and threw him off a building.

The Unity Jack Boniface, the one Shooter and Englehart wrote, died in Unity 2000 #1, while all other Jacks across the (urgh...) multiverse were killed in the U2K preview in Shadowman Volume 3, the one Shooter wrote using the Paul Creddick pseudonym.

jordan silo · Post by **jordan silo** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 12:01:02 pm

ManofTheAtom wrote:Different Jack

The VH 2 Jack Boniface was killed by (urgh...) Tommy Lee Bones, who stuck Jack's sax in his *SQUEE* and threw him off a building.

The Unity Jack Boniface, the one Shooter and Englehart wrote, died in Unity 2000 #1, while all other Jacks across the (urgh...) multiverse were killed in the U2K preview in Shadowman Volume 3, the one Shooter wrote using the Paul Creddick pseudonym.

Damn these multiverse Jacks! Tommy litterally stuck a sax in his *SQUEE*? So I'm guessing he didn't die on the last issue of Volume one then

Byrneout · Post by **Byrneout** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 2:32:47 pm

I'm very glad that they ended VH1 Shadowman the way they did. It felt very appropriate for the character to try and do what he did, and it felt appropriate for us to not know whatever "really" happened, considering we had no clue what was really happening to the title at the time.

Shadowman was one of the few titles that stayed as true as possible throughout the run, and I'd much rather have this ending than the one presented in the first three issues of VH2 Shadowman.

In fact, VH2 Shadowman was my least favorite of all the reboots (Bloodshot was possibly my favorite). ANd don't even get me started on the pile of crap that was Unity 2K/VH3's treatment of Shadowman (even though, ironically, I consider almost anything else done by Shooter to be Valiant gospel - it was his intent to end these characters and never let them be seen again, a mercy killing, and it showed).

ManofTheAtom · Post by **ManofTheAtom** » Wed Dec 15, 2004 4:25:15 pm

I believe that Ennis wrote his first four issues of VH 2 Shadowman for the original line but after Nicieza came along and decided to reboot they changed the dialogue to add the sax in the *SQUEE* idea.

This is the reason why Ennis was only on the book for four issues, that arc was meant to be for VALIANT/VH 1, not Acclaim/VH 2.

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