HARBINGER #1 DISCUSSION THREAD! FULL SPOILERS!

[Zaphod]

Hey Zaphod,

Are you talking about the episode that already aired or are you on Only the Valiant's podcast team and are referring to upcoming spoilers. I figure even if Kris and Torque get together it doesn't mean she and Pete don't eventually get together. It easily could have happened in V1.

excellent point and yes I was. I would be fine if a few years down the road, Pete and Kris end up happily ever after, maybe #100 will be a special, gatefold chromium 'Wedding Special'. It just didn't sound like that is going to be the story anytime soon.

[etos45]

Would there be such a problem if Peter was gay?

I don't see it as a problem, just unnecessary. Everything about the story works without him being gay, so what's the point?

I would flip that statement. What would it help the story to make him straight? In reality, it doesn't matter either way... at least to me.

While personally it would not matter to me, the relationship between Pete and Kris was so central to the original that it would be A) strange if Pete had turned out to have been gay, and B) if he were to be written as such now.

The original run had a lot of heterosexual references regarding Pete: the relationship with Kris, the formation of his "harem" as he recruits all females at first and hesitates to recruit Torque, and Pete's attraction to Flamingo. I suppose one could twist any of that to meet the gay characterization but that would seem to take a lot more effort than taking it at face value.

It doesn't take as much effort as you think... The relationship with Kris was Pete trying to "make" himself straight. Many gays do it. The wanting all females at first would fit because many gays surround themselves with women. They're more comfortable with them. Torque, one of two explanations: being afraid that Torque would find out and beat him senseless or being MADLY in love with him. And Pete wasn't attracted to Flamingo, he just thought her outfit was FABULOUS!

Plus, with this being a reboot, it really doesn't matter what happened in previous Valiant stories, especially post-Shooter influence. As I've said, I don't much care either way. As a straight person, I would relate more with a straight Pete, but -IF- it was actually Shooter's intention to have Pete be gay, then I think that is the story I'd rather read.

[etos45]

Very curious who Tull works for, it would be cool if it had to with this universe's version of H.A.R.Dcorps but Harada's earliest concerns in V1 was his knowledge of the Spider Aliens existence and his attempts to erradicate their base on the moon. I am leaning towards Tull working for the Vine.

I re-read the book before bed last night, have come to the conclusion that the 2nd to last panel is a human foot breaking Joe's discarded pill and my only real gripe with it (don't mind the art, it doesn't stand out but it didn't distract me either) was the term 'Psiots'

I could see a want to not use the term 'Harbinger' to describe what Pete and Toyo and others assuredly can do, but I don't much care for that term either.

First, I hate the term psiot. It doesn't work for me and I think calling them a Harbinger would be better. Luckily, this is only Harada's term for it, so Valiant could drop it if they wanted to.

What if Tull is one of the "secret invasion" Vine's as seen in X-O 1? I'm leaning towards him definitely being of Vine influence.

[greg]

What if Tull is one of the "secret invasion" Vine's as seen in X-O 1? I'm leaning towards him definitely being of Vine influence.

Nice one. Tull could be a descendant of the baby-swaps.

[Blood of Heroes]

but -IF- it was actually Shooter's intention to have Pete be gay, then I think that is the story I'd rather read.

I think at this point Shooter's intentions don't mean *SQUEE*. The past is the past and they seem to be doing fine without him.

[Blood of Heroes]

but -IF- it was actually Shooter's intention to have Pete be gay, then I think that is the story I'd rather read.

I think at this point Shooter's intentions don't mean *SQUEE*. The past is the past and they seem to be doing fine without him.

Not just the straight/gay thing either. Anything.

[etos45]

but -IF- it was actually Shooter's intention to have Pete be gay, then I think that is the story I'd rather read.

I think at this point Shooter's intentions don't mean *SQUEE*. The past is the past and they seem to be doing fine without him.

They don't, but I like it when they do the callbacks to the original Valiant's intentions. Having the ability to present original Shooter ideas is appealing to me. If they want, they could make Pete a leprechaun.

[Blood of Heroes]

but -IF- it was actually Shooter's intention to have Pete be gay, then I think that is the story I'd rather read.

I think at this point Shooter's intentions don't mean *SQUEE*. The past is the past and they seem to be doing fine without him.

They don't, but I like it when they do the callbacks to the original Valiant's intentions. Having the ability to present original Shooter ideas is appealing to me. If they want, they could make Pete a leprechaun.

I'm pretty sure the Irish chase out all the gay leprechauns.

[etos45]

but -IF- it was actually Shooter's intention to have Pete be gay, then I think that is the story I'd rather read.

I think at this point Shooter's intentions don't mean *SQUEE*. The past is the past and they seem to be doing fine without him.

They don't, but I like it when they do the callbacks to the original Valiant's intentions. Having the ability to present original Shooter ideas is appealing to me. If they want, they could make Pete a leprechaun.

I'm pretty sure the Irish chase out all the gay leprechauns.

Why do you think he's on the run?

[greg]

I'm pretty sure the Irish chase out all the gay leprechauns.

There are straight leprechauns!?!

[Blood of Heroes]

I'm pretty sure the Irish chase out all the gay leprechauns.

There are straight leprechauns!?!

I'm not gay but my leprechaun is.

[greg]

What if Tull is one of the "secret invasion" Vine's as seen in X-O 1? I'm leaning towards him definitely being of Vine influence.

Nice one. Tull could be a descendant of the baby-swaps.

Yet another of Greg's patented "Reading-WAY-too-much-into-it" moments:
When Mr. Tull walks in, Joe has just commented on the ceiling... which has a green liquid stain. Vine blood?

[greg]

One more possibility of Greg's patented "Reading-WAY-too-much-into-it" moments:

Harada describes three types of people... the middle one ("Latents") could be Bloodshot, maybe not, but is likely a Valiant "powered" character who's making a one-panel first appearance.



(The first one, "Norms", is obviously me.)

[etos45]

What if Tull is one of the "secret invasion" Vine's as seen in X-O 1? I'm leaning towards him definitely being of Vine influence.

Nice one. Tull could be a descendant of the baby-swaps.

Yet another of Greg's patented "Reading-WAY-too-much-into-it" moments:
When Mr. Tull walks in, Joe has just commented on the ceiling... which has a green liquid stain. Vine blood?

Looks more brown to me. I'm pretty sure it's to show how bat- crazy Joe is.

The facial expression of Mr. Tull is creepy, though. It almost makes his face look like a mask.

[etos45]

One more possibility of Greg's patented "Reading-WAY-too-much-into-it" moments:

Harada describes three types of people... the middle one ("Latents") could be Bloodshot, maybe not, but is likely a Valiant "powered" character who's making a one-panel first appearance.

I was wondering if he was supposed to be an important character. Leave it to me to overlook the obvious candidate. That could definitely be Bloodshot and I'll even go as far as to say it'll be a scene from the first issue.

[Chiclo]

Mr. Tull is intriguing...Could he represent HARD Corps?

I got a very "alien" feeling from him... but I might be way off-base on that.

Joe did say Pete thinks his powers don't work on Tull...but then said he was changed bay all the mind wipes...hmmm

So is Tull the one who's lost his mind, or is it Joe?

I'm not sure that Joe is with it enough to really be interpreting everything clearly. He might still be right, but do you trust Crazy Joe?

So, since Joe is Pete's best friend, do you think Pete might be the one responsible for his psychosis?

Oh, I like this.

[Blood of Heroes]

One more possibility of Greg's patented "Reading-WAY-too-much-into-it" moments:

Harada describes three types of people... the middle one ("Latents") could be Bloodshot, maybe not, but is likely a Valiant "powered" character who's making a one-panel first appearance.

I was wondering if he was supposed to be an important character. Leave it to me to overlook the obvious candidate. That could definitely be Bloodshot and I'll even go as far as to say it'll be a scene from the first issue.

It's actually me, holding pocket aces at the Valiant poker game.

[jmatt]

I thought the street scenes were good, but close-ups of faces seemed kind of, uh, "sketchy."

Pete has a harelip in one.

[jmatt]

Just finished reading the book.

OK

I hate to start out with a gripe, and I wouldn't have started this way if it was only once... or twice..

...BUT...

...there are THREE panels where they spell "foreclosure" as "FORCLOSURE".

THAT'S NOT A WORD! COME ON, VALIANT! YOU'RE BETTER THAN THIS!

(I"m going to ASSUME that the misspelling was deliberate, and you are trying to find out which Valiant fan will help you catch those kinds of problems in the future as a proof-reader. Ok, you got me. Here I am. I'll be your proof-reader. You're welcome.)

I caught that too. I was thinking that maybe an editor that could spell would have seen it as well...

EDIT: I take that back with apologies to the editor. It's obviously intentional since it is spelled correctly in the first panel we see it.

[jmatt]

And lastly:

I'm old, 48. Joe and Kris have face-metal. I'm praying we're not in for a Harbinger gang that's all tatted up with big ear gauges and wearing their skinny jeans down around their knees.

Get off my lawn!

[etos45]

And lastly:

I'm old, 48. Joe and Kris have face-metal. I'm praying we're not in for a Harbinger gang that's all tatted up with big ear gauges and wearing their skinny jeans down around their knees.

Get off my lawn!

"Face-metal"

I actually like the lip ring on Kris.

[Brother Darque]

wow, Pete using his powers to make Kris fall in love with him feels even wronger the second time around................

Funny - as a kid reading - I didn't see a 'problem' with it. Maybe it's the way I read them. Starting in Unity, then getting the revelation that he 'released' Kris, then seeing the hypnotism.

Perhaps I was a much sicker kid, and I would have done that.

Either way, reading it now sent a shiver up my spine.

And they went to bed afterwords............

[Elveen]

Very curious who Tull works for, it would be cool if it had to with this universe's version of H.A.R.Dcorps but Harada's earliest concerns in V1 was his knowledge of the Spider Aliens existence and his attempts to erradicate their base on the moon. I am leaning towards Tull working for the Vine.

I re-read the book before bed last night, have come to the conclusion that the 2nd to last panel is a human foot breaking Joe's discarded pill and my only real gripe with it (don't mind the art, it doesn't stand out but it didn't distract me either) was the term 'Psiots'

I could see a want to not use the term 'Harbinger' to describe what Pete and Toyo and others assuredly can do, but I don't much care for that term either.

First, I hate the term psiot. It doesn't work for me and I think calling them a Harbinger would be better. Luckily, this is only Harada's term for it, so Valiant could drop it if they wanted to.




What if Tull is one of the "secret invasion" Vine's as seen in X-O 1? I'm leaning towards him

definitely being of Vine influence.

When talking to Josh, he used the term Psiot a few times.

[Blood of Heroes]

Did anyone else notice that Harada's skyscraper had the Harbinger bird on it? The penthouse looked pretty cool too.

[BugsySig]

Did anyone else notice that Harada's skyscraper had the Harbinger bird on it? The penthouse looked pretty cool too.

Yes. Like a Japanese temple almost on top of the modrn sky-scraper.