slabbing - why or why not? AND has it hurt the hobby?

[greg]

Well, I am not saying that I have a problem with them. I am glad because I would have never been able to get a nice raw copy as I do not go to a lot of shows.

Same here... I don't go to many shows...
Most dealers are (understandably) looking to cover their table/travel costs.

I'd much rather buy a slabbed book online... and usually do.

[puffdoggy]

For the record, I'm am much bigger fan of raw copies from sellers I trust. I have no true desire to own CGC copies but I also have no qualms buying them if another opportunity doesn't present itself.

And that's a fine way to approach things now. I know a local dealer that's a very strict grader and a fine gentleman as well and I have no problem buying raw comics from him. The problem is of course he rarely has the books I'm looking for. He just doesn't pay enough for books to attract high grade keys into his shop. Same problem I've had for years. Now back in the early 90's we had a shop that the guy was an insanely strict grader and I absolutely loved buying books from him but the same problem. High grade keys rarely made it into his shop.

The thing that I love about cgc now is that I can finally go into the open national market and find the books I'm looking for and rely on the grade. Personally it's working out fantastic for me. I think it's worked out great for a lot of people all over that didn't live in metropolis and hence some price increases.

[puffdoggy]

I think some of the problem have with CGC is that they exponentially raised the price of certain books. In 1998/1999 you could have a Hulk 181 NM for what under $500. When CGC hit the scene, now the book becomes $2000+ depending on page qaulity, centering, coloring, etc.

I have a personal theory regarding this price increase. For one thing when you bought a NM book like Hulk 181 back in the 90's I'm not so sure we would actually get a NM book. I recently purchased a Hulk 181 in cgc 9.0 and really feel like it's just as nice as the same book I would have paid top dollar for before cgc came along. I paid extra for it ($1350) because I really wanted it to replace the copy I sold in 1998. I'm not sure it's as nice as that one but it's close. On the other hand I got an incredible score on a book that was selling at heritage for $5000+ in 2004 and 2005 for $1675. So some books were selling at ridiculous prices 5 years ago have settled nicely in the market today. So alot of it depends on the book and Hulk 181 is a poor example of the market overall because Wolverine is still smokin hot. Because of the movies or whatever reason. And now have you seen that 9.9 copy at comiclink $150,000. lol I can't imagine ever seeing an asking price that high for that book but sure enough there it is.

[maraxusofkeld]

That does make sense, and well Wolverine is essentially the most popular Marvel character behind Spiderman so I think it's a book that will just *SQUEE* the bed as people will always want to buy it.

[puffdoggy]

That does make sense, and well Wolverine is essentially the most popular Marvel character behind Spiderman so I think it's a book that will just *SQUEE* the bed as people will always want to buy it.

So it's been on the market for a month now and they've received an offer for $92,000 for the Hulk 181 in 9.9. This is very difficult for me to handle considering I can still clearly see the book on the rack when I was 9 and childishly mocking a canadian super-hero. By 1976 I wanted a perfect copy and couldn't find one. The moment had passed me by. It's like staring at a winning lottery ticket and saying "only fools play that game" and the next person in line buys it and wins $100,000. well except this one took 36 years or so. lol oh well at least I get to laugh at myself.

[Draco]

That does make sense, and well Wolverine is essentially the most popular Marvel character behind Spiderman so I think it's a book that will just *SQUEE* the bed as people will always want to buy it.

So it's been on the market for a month now and they've received an offer for $92,000 for the Hulk 181 in 9.9. This is very difficult for me to handle considering I can still clearly see the book on the rack when I was 9 and childishly mocking a canadian super-hero. By 1976 I wanted a perfect copy and couldn't find one. The moment had passed me by. It's like staring at a winning lottery ticket and saying "only fools play that game" and the next person in line buys it and wins $100,000. well except this one took 36 years or so. lol oh well at least I get to laugh at myself.

I turned down countless copies of Hulk 181 in the mid 80's as i was way too anal and only a corner to corner copy would suffice unless it was £1.00 or less.
I got my 180 & 182 one day for 80p each in VFN, but turned down a VFN/NM for £18 thinking nah, I'll get a copy for less than ten real soon, then it just climned each time i saw it ill it hit £30 and i was no way paying that.
Eventually when it hit £75 i bought and sold some to skim £10 here and there, but never got that high grade copy for myself.
I guess i never will, but it was never as important in terms of actually owning one myself, so unless i win the lotto and spunk a fortune on a 9.4 to 9.8 CGC ill stick to Power man & Iron Fist.

[puffdoggy]

That does make sense, and well Wolverine is essentially the most popular Marvel character behind Spiderman so I think it's a book that will just *SQUEE* the bed as people will always want to buy it.

So it's been on the market for a month now and they've received an offer for $92,000 for the Hulk 181 in 9.9. This is very difficult for me to handle considering I can still clearly see the book on the rack when I was 9 and childishly mocking a canadian super-hero. By 1976 I wanted a perfect copy and couldn't find one. The moment had passed me by. It's like staring at a winning lottery ticket and saying "only fools play that game" and the next person in line buys it and wins $100,000. well except this one took 36 years or so. lol oh well at least I get to laugh at myself.

I turned down countless copies of Hulk 181 in the mid 80's as i was way too anal and only a corner to corner copy would suffice unless it was £1.00 or less.
I got my 180 & 182 one day for 80p each in VFN, but turned down a VFN/NM for £18 thinking nah, I'll get a copy for less than ten real soon, then it just climned each time i saw it ill it hit £30 and i was no way paying that.
Eventually when it hit £75 i bought and sold some to skim £10 here and there, but never got that high grade copy for myself.
I guess i never will, but it was never as important in terms of actually owning one myself, so unless i win the lotto and spunk a fortune on a 9.4 to 9.8 CGC ill stick to Power man & Iron Fist.

LOl yeah the 80's were a weird time in comics for me as well. Every time I had the money for a nice book I couldn't find what I wanted and spent the money on something else. I didn't make my official return to comics until I went to a show in portland and fell in love with them again in 1992. This strange guy walks up to me and gives me this "pssst" thingy. He says "hey I see you really like all the silver age stuff". I'm thinkin "Okay whatcha got for sale" he says "There's this new company called Valiant". I chuckle to myself (oh great another independent "loser" company). He says "this stuff is pure gold. It's like the silver age all over again. If you get in now you'll make a fortune and it's some of the best reading since the silver age". Again I chuckle to myself. I told him I'd look into it and then calmly explained to my girlfriend how independents can't sell comics and he was probably hired to go around whispering to people at shows. A few months roll by and I'm buying my spidermans in multiples at the shop one day and my buddy walks up to me all excited and says "my god look at this beautiful cover. It's jet black." Well I put two and two together after picking up a solar 10 off the rack and within a week I was scouring the city for any and all valiants. lol What a hoot that was.

I swear I've just barely missed the boat on everything I ever did!! On the other hand I did sell many rai 3's and 4's for huge profits. Oh well. I found a shop in california one time that had like 10 copies of rai 4's in mint condition at cover price while a guy in cbg was paying like $80 for them. lol so I sold and got a few silver age books for my efforts.

[ian_house]

That does make sense, and well Wolverine is essentially the most popular Marvel character behind Spiderman so I think it's a book that will just *SQUEE* the bed as people will always want to buy it.

So it's been on the market for a month now and they've received an offer for $92,000 for the Hulk 181 in 9.9. This is very difficult for me to handle considering I can still clearly see the book on the rack when I was 9 and childishly mocking a canadian super-hero. By 1976 I wanted a perfect copy and couldn't find one. The moment had passed me by. It's like staring at a winning lottery ticket and saying "only fools play that game" and the next person in line buys it and wins $100,000. well except this one took 36 years or so. lol oh well at least I get to laugh at myself.

I turned down countless copies of Hulk 181 in the mid 80's as i was way too anal and only a corner to corner copy would suffice unless it was £1.00 or less.
I got my 180 & 182 one day for 80p each in VFN, but turned down a VFN/NM for £18 thinking nah, I'll get a copy for less than ten real soon, then it just climned each time i saw it ill it hit £30 and i was no way paying that.
Eventually when it hit £75 i bought and sold some to skim £10 here and there, but never got that high grade copy for myself.
I guess i never will, but it was never as important in terms of actually owning one myself, so unless i win the lotto and spunk a fortune on a 9.4 to 9.8 CGC ill stick to Power man & Iron Fist.

LOl yeah the 80's were a weird time in comics for me as well. Every time I had the money for a nice book I couldn't find what I wanted and spent the money on something else. I didn't make my official return to comics until I went to a show in portland and fell in love with them again in 1992. This strange guy walks up to me and gives me this "pssst" thingy. He says "hey I see you really like all the silver age stuff". I'm thinkin "Okay whatcha got for sale" he says "There's this new company called Valiant". I chuckle to myself (oh great another independent "loser" company). He says "this stuff is pure gold. It's like the silver age all over again. If you get in now you'll make a fortune and it's some of the best reading since the silver age". Again I chuckle to myself. I told him I'd look into it and then calmly explained to my girlfriend how independents can't sell comics and he was probably hired to go around whispering to people at shows. A few months roll by and I'm buying my spidermans in multiples at the shop one day and my buddy walks up to me all excited and says "my god look at this beautiful cover. It's jet black." Well I put two and two together after picking up a solar 10 off the rack and within a week I was scouring the city for any and all valiants. lol What a hoot that was.

I swear I've just barely missed the boat on everything I ever did!! On the other hand I did sell many rai 3's and 4's for huge profits. Oh well. I found a shop in california one time that had like 10 copies of rai 4's in mint condition at cover price while a guy in cbg was paying like $80 for them. lol so I sold and got a few silver age books for my efforts.

Evil Greg what have you been told about accosting people at cons!

[maraxusofkeld]

That does make sense, and well Wolverine is essentially the most popular Marvel character behind Spiderman so I think it's a book that will just *SQUEE* the bed as people will always want to buy it.

So it's been on the market for a month now and they've received an offer for $92,000 for the Hulk 181 in 9.9. This is very difficult for me to handle considering I can still clearly see the book on the rack when I was 9 and childishly mocking a canadian super-hero. By 1976 I wanted a perfect copy and couldn't find one. The moment had passed me by. It's like staring at a winning lottery ticket and saying "only fools play that game" and the next person in line buys it and wins $100,000. well except this one took 36 years or so. lol oh well at least I get to laugh at myself.

Well part of the fact that someone will pay that amount for that book ( I do agree it's silly) is just for bragging rights to say they have the highest on the census and in some ways to me thats what CGC is. The census is handy in a lot of ways, but it drives the prices up on certain books because people believe that those are the "only" copies that are ever going to exist in that grade. To me a good example is a Green Lantern #76. Sure its a key book, but not uber key, not a 1st appearance or anything really significant. Unitl the last year or two Overstreet had the value under 1K when the book in NM was selling for multiples of that for years. Once your average collector realize how much they sell for in a 9.4 or better you will see the price steadily come down as more and more people submit.

[puffdoggy]

That does make sense, and well Wolverine is essentially the most popular Marvel character behind Spiderman so I think it's a book that will just *SQUEE* the bed as people will always want to buy it.

So it's been on the market for a month now and they've received an offer for $92,000 for the Hulk 181 in 9.9. This is very difficult for me to handle considering I can still clearly see the book on the rack when I was 9 and childishly mocking a canadian super-hero. By 1976 I wanted a perfect copy and couldn't find one. The moment had passed me by. It's like staring at a winning lottery ticket and saying "only fools play that game" and the next person in line buys it and wins $100,000. well except this one took 36 years or so. lol oh well at least I get to laugh at myself.

Well part of the fact that someone will pay that amount for that book ( I do agree it's silly) is just for bragging rights to say they have the highest on the census and in some ways to me thats what CGC is. The census is handy in a lot of ways, but it drives the prices up on certain books because people believe that those are the "only" copies that are ever going to exist in that grade. To me a good example is a Green Lantern #76. Sure its a key book, but not uber key, not a 1st appearance or anything really significant. Unitl the last year or two Overstreet had the value under 1K when the book in NM was selling for multiples of that for years. Once your average collector realize how much they sell for in a 9.4 or better you will see the price steadily come down as more and more people submit.

Absolutely true about most and maybe all books. The only thing about those super keys though is that the demand may handle the extra supply when more books come to market. I really don't want to mention the book however one book I bought recently (and I'll reitterate from an earlier post) was selling at heritage for as much as $6600 in 2004 and even in 2008 sold for $4800 i picked up today for $1675. In 2003 -2004 only one graded @9.8 in 2008 it was up to 8 copies and in the last two years it's now up to 32 copies on the census and I'm sure there's more. It was foolish to beleive in the early days of cgc that only one existed or even in 2008 that we were nearing the total @ 8 copies. Now we're at 32 and the price is reflecting that total. I may have even spent too much on that book but I'm way ahead of the guy that spent $6600. LOL It sure makes for some interesting collecting on the high end. All I can say is watch yourself in those auctions with post 1968 books, it's easy to get burned!!

[Dev Em]

I personally don't get it. I understand the quality issue, but I buy my books to read.

Not a thing against those that get their graded and sealed...It's just not for me. Hell, I just had a short box of comics turned into Hardcover books and I am happier than anything with them. I am also sure that there are those theat will not understand why I did that to my books...but that's cool too.

The only book I would love to have sealed up is my Superboy #98 with Curt Swan signature on the cover. One of my prized possessions. But the grade it would get would make most laugh. It's not in great shape, but it's good enough for me. I'll never spend the money to do it though...It's in a clam-shell, and protected from major damaging fro everyday things, so that's good enough for me.

[dbngaa]

I'm with Dev Em, CGC-ing (can I use that as a verb?) doesn't hold much interest for me as a reader, with the possible exception of having a very special book (like that Superboy) that I wanted to protect and display. So, CGC-ing (yep, I'm just gonna use it as a verb) is sort of akin to framing to me. Do the CGC cases protect against UV rays and keep all dust and air out? I haven't priced high-end framing with UV protection glass, acid free paper and all of that, so it may actually be chaeper to submit a book rather than frame it. All of that being said, I certainly understand why collectors would want such a service...at least for important/higher priced books. I would feel much more secure in laying down money for a Hulk 181 CGC'd at 9.8 over a raw one in "9.8" - unless I REALLY trusted the person grading it. So when I see really common issues, like Turok 1 for instance, CGC'd and listed on eBay for $100 or more, I'm confused a bit.

[greg]

I personally don't get it. I understand the quality issue, but I buy my books to read.

Hilarious! Who says you can only have ONE copy of a comic?

One copy to read, 10 copies slabbed is actually pretty common for me.

[iggy101us]

I personally don't get it. I understand the quality issue, but I buy my books to read.

Hilarious! Who says you can only have ONE copy of a comic?

One copy to read, 10 copies slabbed is actually pretty common for me.

How many slabs do you need to make a CGC plastic brick? How many bricks do you need to build a house? . . . . You need more slabs!

[greg]

I personally don't get it. I understand the quality issue, but I buy my books to read.

Hilarious! Who says you can only have ONE copy of a comic?

One copy to read, 10 copies slabbed is actually pretty common for me.

How many slabs do you need to make a CGC plastic brick? How many bricks do you need to build a house? . . . . You need more slabs!

So far, I only have one wall.

[dbngaa]

Hilarious! Who says you can only have ONE copy of a comic?

I agree, but I don't currently have the need for stacks of duplicates in plastic cases taking up space. If all I can do is look at the cover, I might as well pick up a set of the Valiant Era cards. If I do not yet have an issue, a CGC'd copy will not be my first pick-up since it doesn't help me finish reading a series. But that's just for me. I completely understand why collectors, or someone concerned with making a profit off of a comic, would want this service. And one day, when my want list is complete (currently posted in the Buy/Sell/Trade forum), I might pick up some CGC Valiants as well.

[Dev Em]

I personally don't get it. I understand the quality issue, but I buy my books to read.

Hilarious! Who says you can only have ONE copy of a comic?

One copy to read, 10 copies slabbed is actually pretty common for me.

That's cool. I never said you couldn't have more than one.

I think I have two copies of very few books, and I have about 40 long boxes. Owning multiple copies is not a draw for me, and having ten in plastic does nothing for me personally. Not enough money or space to begin with...the boxes take up more than enough room.

I get the investment end of slabbing them...just not my thing. I love that my kids want to read the books I have, and I love being able to hand over stacks for them to go through.

[kevinbastos]

I think I have two copies of very few books, and I have about 40 long boxes. Owning multiple copies is not a draw for me, and having ten in plastic does nothing for me personally. Not enough money or space to begin with...the boxes take up more than enough room.

I get the investment end of slabbing them...just not my thing. I love that my kids want to read the books I have, and I love being able to hand over stacks for them to go through.

I seem to be in your boat - only with about one-third the size of your collection!

I like reading - but understand the perspective of a pristine book, graded by an impartial source.

As a collector, I seem to echo the sentiment of slabbing a SUPER-rare or key issue - but most of those I have - even in shiniest of condition - could only be on the VF-ish range. If, one day, I'm looking to sell, I might send my X-Men first appearance collection in - but only for the kids to sell (and AFTER my death!)

To each to own, I guess.

[Ricomortis]

I personally don't get it. I understand the quality issue, but I buy my books to read.

Hilarious! Who says you can only have ONE copy of a comic?

One copy to read, 10 copies slabbed is actually pretty common for me.

Greg...you better get busy!