WHAT HAPPENED TO PETER STANCHEK?

[ManofTheAtom]

I don't remember how he died.

Nothing special, simply wore himself out.

/Magnus

I thought it be something unmemorable like that.

[xodacia81]

This is why I think time travel is unlikely.

[ManofTheAtom]

This is why I think time travel is unlikely.

What do you mean?

[xodacia81]

Ever see the show Sliders? I always agreed with what Quinn Mallory said about the unfeasibility of time travel, as opposed to the possible existence of alternate timelines. Yes, one could say it is splitting hairs, but it doesn't involve travelling back or forward, just that something different happened and so things did not turn out as they could have. Such as, what if the Bomb had been dropped on Japan and we had invaded the mainland? ect, ect. I love that kind of "what if" stuff.

[ManofTheAtom]

Ever see the show Sliders? I always agreed with what Quinn Mallory said about the unfeasibility of time travel, as opposed to the possible existence of alternate timelines. Yes, one could say it is splitting hairs, but it doesn't involve travelling back or forward, just that something different happened and so things did not turn out as they could have. Such as, what if the Bomb had been dropped on Japan and we had invaded the mainland? ect, ect. I love that kind of "what if" stuff.

Sure, I saw Sliders and loved it, but that doesn't apply to VALIANT.

Look at Ivar, the Timewalker.

His first appearance in A&A #11 and #12 led to an appearance in Magnus #33, which was smack-dab in the Malev War.

Also look at Magnus.

If there was such a thing as multiple universe at VALIANT, how could Solar have sent him to the right future not once but twice (first when he was a baby and then again after Chaos Effect)?

Or for that matter, how could the Destroyer have ben able to sent him to the right past in Chaos Effect?

No, VALIANT was most definitly a linear timeline suceptible to the Butterfly Effect, as seen in Timewalker during the Harbinger Wars trilogy, in which Ivar and Pete traveled to the past, changed things, and when they returned to the future they found that they had made things worse.

[myron]

Ever see the show Sliders? I always agreed with what Quinn Mallory said about the unfeasibility of time travel, as opposed to the possible existence of alternate timelines. Yes, one could say it is splitting hairs, but it doesn't involve travelling back or forward, just that something different happened and so things did not turn out as they could have. Such as, what if the Bomb had been dropped on Japan and we had invaded the mainland? ect, ect. I love that kind of "what if" stuff.

Sure, I saw Sliders and loved it, but that doesn't apply to VALIANT.

Look at Ivar, the Timewalker.

His first appearance in A&A #11 and #12 led to an appearance in Magnus #33, which was smack-dab in the Malev War.

Also look at Magnus.

If there was such a thing as multiple universe at VALIANT, how could Solar have sent him to the right future not once but twice (first when he was a baby and then again after Chaos Effect)?

Or for that matter, how could the Destroyer have ben able to sent him to the right past in Chaos Effect?

No, VALIANT was most definitly a linear timeline suceptible to the Butterfly Effect, as seen in Timewalker during the Harbinger Wars trilogy, in which Ivar and Pete traveled to the past, changed things, and when they returned to the future they found that they had made things worse.

ummmm, did you just say Ivar's first appearance was A&A 11???

better double check that MoTA...

or did I just missinterpret what you wrote there...

[ManofTheAtom]

Ever see the show Sliders? I always agreed with what Quinn Mallory said about the unfeasibility of time travel, as opposed to the possible existence of alternate timelines. Yes, one could say it is splitting hairs, but it doesn't involve travelling back or forward, just that something different happened and so things did not turn out as they could have. Such as, what if the Bomb had been dropped on Japan and we had invaded the mainland? ect, ect. I love that kind of "what if" stuff.

Sure, I saw Sliders and loved it, but that doesn't apply to VALIANT.

Look at Ivar, the Timewalker.

His first appearance in A&A #11 and #12 led to an appearance in Magnus #33, which was smack-dab in the Malev War.

Also look at Magnus.

If there was such a thing as multiple universe at VALIANT, how could Solar have sent him to the right future not once but twice (first when he was a baby and then again after Chaos Effect)?

Or for that matter, how could the Destroyer have ben able to sent him to the right past in Chaos Effect?

No, VALIANT was most definitly a linear timeline suceptible to the Butterfly Effect, as seen in Timewalker during the Harbinger Wars trilogy, in which Ivar and Pete traveled to the past, changed things, and when they returned to the future they found that they had made things worse.

ummmm, did you just say Ivar's first appearance was A&A 11???

better double check that MoTA...

or did I just missinterpret what you wrote there...

You're right. It was #10 and #11

[myron]

Ever see the show Sliders? I always agreed with what Quinn Mallory said about the unfeasibility of time travel, as opposed to the possible existence of alternate timelines. Yes, one could say it is splitting hairs, but it doesn't involve travelling back or forward, just that something different happened and so things did not turn out as they could have. Such as, what if the Bomb had been dropped on Japan and we had invaded the mainland? ect, ect. I love that kind of "what if" stuff.

Sure, I saw Sliders and loved it, but that doesn't apply to VALIANT.

Look at Ivar, the Timewalker.

His first appearance in A&A #11 and #12 led to an appearance in Magnus #33, which was smack-dab in the Malev War.

Also look at Magnus.

If there was such a thing as multiple universe at VALIANT, how could Solar have sent him to the right future not once but twice (first when he was a baby and then again after Chaos Effect)?

Or for that matter, how could the Destroyer have ben able to sent him to the right past in Chaos Effect?

No, VALIANT was most definitly a linear timeline suceptible to the Butterfly Effect, as seen in Timewalker during the Harbinger Wars trilogy, in which Ivar and Pete traveled to the past, changed things, and when they returned to the future they found that they had made things worse.

ummmm, did you just say Ivar's first appearance was A&A 11???

better double check that MoTA...

or did I just missinterpret what you wrote there...

You're right. It was #10 and #11

earlier...

[ManofTheAtom]

Ever see the show Sliders? I always agreed with what Quinn Mallory said about the unfeasibility of time travel, as opposed to the possible existence of alternate timelines. Yes, one could say it is splitting hairs, but it doesn't involve travelling back or forward, just that something different happened and so things did not turn out as they could have. Such as, what if the Bomb had been dropped on Japan and we had invaded the mainland? ect, ect. I love that kind of "what if" stuff.

Sure, I saw Sliders and loved it, but that doesn't apply to VALIANT.

Look at Ivar, the Timewalker.

His first appearance in A&A #11 and #12 led to an appearance in Magnus #33, which was smack-dab in the Malev War.

Also look at Magnus.

If there was such a thing as multiple universe at VALIANT, how could Solar have sent him to the right future not once but twice (first when he was a baby and then again after Chaos Effect)?

Or for that matter, how could the Destroyer have ben able to sent him to the right past in Chaos Effect?

No, VALIANT was most definitly a linear timeline suceptible to the Butterfly Effect, as seen in Timewalker during the Harbinger Wars trilogy, in which Ivar and Pete traveled to the past, changed things, and when they returned to the future they found that they had made things worse.

ummmm, did you just say Ivar's first appearance was A&A 11???

better double check that MoTA...

or did I just missinterpret what you wrote there...

You're right. It was #10 and #11

earlier...

Oh, right

A&A/EW #8

[myron]

Ever see the show Sliders? I always agreed with what Quinn Mallory said about the unfeasibility of time travel, as opposed to the possible existence of alternate timelines. Yes, one could say it is splitting hairs, but it doesn't involve travelling back or forward, just that something different happened and so things did not turn out as they could have. Such as, what if the Bomb had been dropped on Japan and we had invaded the mainland? ect, ect. I love that kind of "what if" stuff.

Sure, I saw Sliders and loved it, but that doesn't apply to VALIANT.

Look at Ivar, the Timewalker.

His first appearance in A&A #11 and #12 led to an appearance in Magnus #33, which was smack-dab in the Malev War.

Also look at Magnus.

If there was such a thing as multiple universe at VALIANT, how could Solar have sent him to the right future not once but twice (first when he was a baby and then again after Chaos Effect)?

Or for that matter, how could the Destroyer have ben able to sent him to the right past in Chaos Effect?

No, VALIANT was most definitly a linear timeline suceptible to the Butterfly Effect, as seen in Timewalker during the Harbinger Wars trilogy, in which Ivar and Pete traveled to the past, changed things, and when they returned to the future they found that they had made things worse.

ummmm, did you just say Ivar's first appearance was A&A 11???

better double check that MoTA...

or did I just missinterpret what you wrote there...

You're right. It was #10 and #11

earlier...

Oh, right

A&A/EW #8

[ManofTheAtom]

Sure, I saw Sliders and loved it, but that doesn't apply to VALIANT.

Look at Ivar, the Timewalker.

His first appearance in A&A #11 and #12 led to an appearance in Magnus #33, which was smack-dab in the Malev War.

Also look at Magnus.

If there was such a thing as multiple universe at VALIANT, how could Solar have sent him to the right future not once but twice (first when he was a baby and then again after Chaos Effect)?

Or for that matter, how could the Destroyer have ben able to sent him to the right past in Chaos Effect?

No, VALIANT was most definitly a linear timeline suceptible to the Butterfly Effect, as seen in Timewalker during the Harbinger Wars trilogy, in which Ivar and Pete traveled to the past, changed things, and when they returned to the future they found that they had made things worse.

ummmm, did you just say Ivar's first appearance was A&A 11???

better double check that MoTA...

or did I just missinterpret what you wrote there...

You're right. It was #10 and #11

earlier...

Oh, right

A&A/EW #8

Brain fart.

I confused first appearance when first time Archer met him.

[xodacia81]

I wasn't saying this applied to Ivar. I was simply commenting that with the talk of time travel, I personally do not believe it is possible.

[ManofTheAtom]

I wasn't saying this applied to Ivar. I was simply commenting that with the talk of time travel, I personally do not believe it is possible.

But it was possible. Pete traveled back in time from a futue where he was a POW during the Harbinger Wars in an attempt to change history the same way that he and Ivar had before during the trilogy.

Though that may have been his intention, he can't possibly succeed, because if he does he stops himself from traveling to the past in the first place.

[myron]

I wasn't saying this applied to Ivar. I was simply commenting that with the talk of time travel, I personally do not believe it is possible.

But it was possible. Pete traveled back in time from a futue where he was a POW during the Harbinger Wars in an attempt to change history the same way that he and Ivar had before during the trilogy.

Though that may have been his intention, he can't possibly succeed, because if he does he stops himself from traveling to the past in the first place.

only if time is continuous...why couldn't it be represented piecewise, with more than one branch coming out of any instance...

[ManofTheAtom]

I wasn't saying this applied to Ivar. I was simply commenting that with the talk of time travel, I personally do not believe it is possible.

But it was possible. Pete traveled back in time from a futue where he was a POW during the Harbinger Wars in an attempt to change history the same way that he and Ivar had before during the trilogy.

Though that may have been his intention, he can't possibly succeed, because if he does he stops himself from traveling to the past in the first place.

only if time is continuous...why couldn't it be represented piecewise, with more than one branch coming out of any instance...

Because in VALIANT the 41st Century was the present not the future, meaning that time was immutable.

[xodacia81]

MOTA, read a guy named McTaggart. Try figuring out his paradox of time and when you have the riddle solved, please get back to us

[ManofTheAtom]

MOTA, read a guy named McTaggart. Try figuring out his paradox of time and when you have the riddle solved, please get back to us

At VALIANT the books published in the 90's were not the present, they were the past of their universe.

Something like Rai #0 was a history book, not a prophecy of what might happen.

In short, there was nothing that Pete could have done to change history. He and Ivar tried doing that in the trilogy and ended up putting things back the way they were because what they had done made things worse.

[xodacia81]

I understand all this, but I am saying time travel is not something I believe in for the reasons stated above and elswhere.

[ManofTheAtom]

I understand all this, but I am saying time travel is not something I believe in for the reasons stated above and elswhere.

You don't have to believe in it, we are talking about fiction here, not the real world.

You don't have to believe in aliens to enjoy ET, or believe in tiny small creatures to watch the Smurfs.

In the fictonal story of The Visitor... blah, blah, see previous posts

[xodacia81]

I understand all this, but I am saying time travel is not something I believe in for the reasons stated above and elswhere.

You don't have to believe in it, we are talking about fiction here, not the real world.

You don't have to believe in aliens to enjoy ET, or believe in tiny small creatures to watch the Smurfs.

In the fictonal story of The Visitor... blah, blah, see previous posts

That is the POINT. I was NOT commenting on VALIANT, I was NOT saying I dismissed the story/stories. I simply said I do not personally believe it to be viable. Did I have fun with the stories? Oh yes. They were some of the better time travel stuff. Oh, and you said that this is NOT the real world? wow, you must be chilling out...finally taking things less...er...prob not.

[ManofTheAtom]

I understand all this, but I am saying time travel is not something I believe in for the reasons stated above and elswhere.

You don't have to believe in it, we are talking about fiction here, not the real world.

You don't have to believe in aliens to enjoy ET, or believe in tiny small creatures to watch the Smurfs.

In the fictonal story of The Visitor... blah, blah, see previous posts

That is the POINT. I was NOT commenting on VALIANT, I was NOT saying I dismissed the story/stories. I simply said I do not personally believe it to be viable. Did I have fun with the stories? Oh yes. They were some of the better time travel stuff.

Ah.

I personally don't think that time travel is impossible, I just don't think it can work on a social and cultural level.

For instance, one of the first thing time travelers may try to do is visit the birth and/or death of Jesus, Moses, or some other religious figure, either to debunk it or confirm it.

On paper, the idea that schools in the future could use time travel to visit such sites and events as the red sea when Moses parted the ocean or Jesus' birth might sound good, but on a cutural level it would never be approved by Congress or whatever rullng body exists at the time, either because the religious zealots won't want their religions trampled with, or because the scholars won't want to do it for one reason or another.

[ManofTheAtom]

I understand all this, but I am saying time travel is not something I believe in for the reasons stated above and elswhere.

You don't have to believe in it, we are talking about fiction here, not the real world.

You don't have to believe in aliens to enjoy ET, or believe in tiny small creatures to watch the Smurfs.

In the fictonal story of The Visitor... blah, blah, see previous posts

That is the POINT. I was NOT commenting on VALIANT, I was NOT saying I dismissed the story/stories. I simply said I do not personally believe it to be viable. Did I have fun with the stories? Oh yes. They were some of the better time travel stuff. Oh, and you said that this is NOT the real world? wow, you must be chilling out...finally taking things less...er...prob not.

Just be aware that I'm not giving you the thumbs up

[xodacia81]

Don't worry, I'm standing, not sitting.

[dave]

Well, what is the last impression/fate of Peter in his last *VALIANT (1991-1996)* appearance?

I don't know because the last *VALIANT (1991-1996)* comic I have is Visitor #9, but I think it might be important with (hopefully) new Harbinger related material being released in the future.

In Visitor #13, He, Flamingo, Chang (and I believe one or two other people, I don't remember) decided to restart the resistance.

It be interesting to see what would happen if Pete's revived resistance crossed paths with Faith's resistance, specially after Pete killed Simon when he was the Harbinger.

Aaaaaah, if told in the old VALIANT style, such an encounter would be epic.

How would Faith deal with her feelings for Pete (as a friend of course) after learning that he killed her friend?

The other kids in Faith's team would most likely want to take their pound of flesh.

did this occur in issues of the visitor?

i finished harbinger, and don't remember simon getting killed-but sam did.
is this something else?

[magnusr]

don't remember simon getting killed-but sam did.
is this something else?

Don't remember Simon getting killed either. Maybe Mike referred to Harbinger 41 and did a typo.

/Magnus