Switching to trades?

[BugsySig]

I'm thinking I'll take my chances.

While I understand all of Ed's points, I just don't know how well or if they will hold true for a small publisher like VALIANT. Most of what he mentions pertains to Marvel and DC, and then the massive outlier known as TWD.

I would guess its in VEIs best interest to continue publishing the trades as long as they are publishing the floppies. Might they need to relaunch/re number at some point like Marvel and DC to maintain trade sales? Possibly.

I just don't think we've seen a model like VALIANT in quite some time. CroosGen would have been the most similar, but I have no idea how their trades sold or if they even sold trades at the time.

[chriskay99]

Don't know what this could mean but this thread seems like an appropriate place to put it. Dinesh had this to say on Twitter the other day in response to a fan who said they were hitting the affordable limit with the number of VEI books.

Ziggy Blumenthal said:

@dinesh_s Happy for the success, but you've officially hit more titles than I can afford to get. Armor Hunters means somethings got to go

Dinesh responded:

@ZiggyFakeMcCoy We've got you covered! #staytuned

Curious to find out if VEI may have something up their sleeves...

[lorddunlow]

Don't know what this could mean but this thread seems like an appropriate place to put it. Dinesh had this to say on Twitter the other day in response to a fan who said they were hitting the affordable limit with the number of VEI books.

Ziggy Blumenthal said:

@dinesh_s Happy for the success, but you've officially hit more titles than I can afford to get. Armor Hunters means somethings got to go

Dinesh responded:

@ZiggyFakeMcCoy We've got you covered! #staytuned

Curious to find out if VEI may have something up their sleeves...

Price drop to $2.99 across the line?

[Bl00dsh0t]

Don't know what this could mean but this thread seems like an appropriate place to put it. Dinesh had this to say on Twitter the other day in response to a fan who said they were hitting the affordable limit with the number of VEI books.

Ziggy Blumenthal said:

@dinesh_s Happy for the success, but you've officially hit more titles than I can afford to get. Armor Hunters means somethings got to go

Dinesh responded:

@ZiggyFakeMcCoy We've got you covered! #staytuned

Curious to find out if VEI may have something up their sleeves...

Price drop to $2.99 across the line?

The drop from $3.99US to $2.99US means my single issue purchases in Australia will go down from $6.50AU to $5.00. This would be great and allow me to pick up an extra book without having to drop one from my pull list.

I'd imagine the $2.99US price would attract more readers too. One's that might've been giving one of these new-to-them-titles a missed based on it costing he same as one of the big DC or Marvel books.

[bobby97801]

Don't know what this could mean but this thread seems like an appropriate place to put it. Dinesh had this to say on Twitter the other day in response to a fan who said they were hitting the affordable limit with the number of VEI books.

Ziggy Blumenthal said:

@dinesh_s Happy for the success, but you've officially hit more titles than I can afford to get. Armor Hunters means somethings got to go

Dinesh responded:

@ZiggyFakeMcCoy We've got you covered! #staytuned

Curious to find out if VEI may have something up their sleeves...

Price drop to $2.99 across the line?

That would be awesome

[lorddunlow]

Don't know what this could mean but this thread seems like an appropriate place to put it. Dinesh had this to say on Twitter the other day in response to a fan who said they were hitting the affordable limit with the number of VEI books.

Ziggy Blumenthal said:

@dinesh_s Happy for the success, but you've officially hit more titles than I can afford to get. Armor Hunters means somethings got to go

Dinesh responded:

@ZiggyFakeMcCoy We've got you covered! #staytuned

Curious to find out if VEI may have something up their sleeves...

Price drop to $2.99 across the line?

I'd imagine the $2.99US price would attract more readers too. One's that might've been giving one of these new-to-them-titles a missed based on it costing he same as one of the big DC or Marvel books.

In my opinion, the $3.99 price point with the quality of the cover stock being used, is a big barrier to new readers. With other books, I really have to think the book is great to pay that much, considering that most of the comics I buy from Marvel and Image have much better cover stock and cost $2.99.

[leonmallett]

Anyone able to comment on the typical price points across IDW, DE, Image, Dark Horse?

A price drop would be nice, but how likely is it unless something else changes (advertising for other than VEI; dropping content pages; using cheaper paper stock etc.)?

[BugsySig]

Anyone able to comment on the typical price points across IDW, DE, Image, Dark Horse?

A price drop would be nice, but how likely is it unless something else changes (advertising for other than VEI; dropping content pages; using cheaper paper stock etc.)?

Dynamite is almost exclusively $3.99. Image is typically $2.99, but that's because the "publisher" isn't looking to make $$$, just recoup cost and all remaining profit goes to the creators. Not sure on IDW and Dark Horse...I think they have a mix of price points, but I could be wrong.

I know it wasn't an easy decision for VEI to price at $3.99, but a necessary one. Even DC has reduced page counts in order to "hold the line at $2.99" so there seems little chance a small publisher could do so. Bit VEI has a business plan, and perhaps that allows for a price drop once they reach a certain number of printed issues/total sales.

[paradise]

I would be VERY surprised to see Valiant move books to $2.99. Math can not be cheated. VEI would have to increase their sales numbers 25% to just stay even, and would have to produce more units at a lower profit. That makes no sense unless you are doing what DC did, which is relaunch the whole universe to a lot of publicity. Making books $2.99 at that point was a great idea, because it made the books an easier entry point for new readers, at a lower price than most of the rest of the marketplace.

Image's model is different, Image does not make ANY MORE OR LESS money whether you give your book away at $1 or charge $5.99. Image makes a flat fee per book sold, no profit sharing.

[mateo107]

Dark Horse...I think they have a mix of price points, but I could be wrong.

Dark Horse prices range from $2.99 to $3.99 for a regular size comic (or $7.99 for DHP). their re-vamped superhero line, Project Black Sky, seems to be all $2.99, even though higher-selling books like The Star Wars are $3.99.

[Sir Sandrick]

Planning to make the jump to digital only, getting the deluxe HCs later. SUCH a hard jump to make though... my LCS doesn't want to let me go!

[Aram]

Maybe a price drop to $3.50?

[Aram]

Don't know what this could mean but this thread seems like an appropriate place to put it. Dinesh had this to say on Twitter the other day in response to a fan who said they were hitting the affordable limit with the number of VEI books.

Ziggy Blumenthal said:

@dinesh_s Happy for the success, but you've officially hit more titles than I can afford to get. Armor Hunters means somethings got to go

Dinesh responded:

@ZiggyFakeMcCoy We've got you covered! #staytuned

Curious to find out if VEI may have something up their sleeves...

The company has been sold to a video game company for 65 million dollars who is going to cancel half the line relaunch the characters and then go bankrupt due to its other investments tanking?

[Aram]

I have a hard time imagining that the trades are not a huge part of VEI's ongoing strategy as well as DC's. It appears to me that more and more there is a balancing between lower print runs in floppy and higher in trades across the industry board in the last 2-3 years especially.

As long as people buy the trades to make up for dwindling floppy sales, i think the new system will keep books coming out and tpbs being printed beyond the cancelation points of prior years.

Personally I buy both of titles I really like for the sole purpose of continuing my support for as long as the books are being published, which is all VEI and a handful of other titles.

I really think that tpbs and digital are part of a new industry model and publishers will increasingly rely on them to keep the titles going.

Honestly i would not be surprised to see a tpb only format become dominant in the next decade, though it would spell the end of the industry as we've known it for the last 30 years. Aka the fall of the lcs and diamond.

I'm hoping for a combination subscription system to evolve though.. With everything published as arcs and those who order get digital and/or floppy monthly and the tpb upon completion of the arc.

[lorddunlow]

Honestly i would not be surprised to see a tpb only format become dominant in the next decade, though it would spell the end of the industry as we've known it for the last 30 years. Aka the fall of the lcs and diamond.

This is, unfortunately, what I predict will happen as well. If it does, I'll just go all digital. I do 99.999% of my reading digitally (prose and comics) now. I really do prefer the physical connection to a paper book, but there are two elements that override my preference for the physical media:

1. Space - I only have so much room for books. (This is actually a bigger issue with books than comics, as I already have an entire, very large, room full of books and bookshelves - and boy were they a *SQUEE* to move 500 miles across the country!). I have almost 1000 comics on my Nook (and duplicated on my phone); I just read 12 issue of TWD in bed while my son and wife slept comfortably next to me - that would be impossible with floppies.

2. Convenience - If I'm reading, say, Harbinger #19, and I want to go back to Harbinger #8 to check out the first time we visited Torquehalla, then I just go in my eComic reader app and pull up the book. (I did this at night when I read #19 - I even posted in the discussion thread from the same device and took screenshots of pertinent pages). Try the same exercise with physical media. Ain't gonna work.

I purchase 75% of my comics in both digital and physical (there are 2 books that I only get digitally - TWD and Revival, and there are a handful of books for which I download scans to read while keeping my physical copies for my collection - mostly VEI, as there is no way to actually purchase them digitally as I don't count the DRM-laden Comixology licensed files as a purchase - you rent the book indefinitely).

I really hope the industry does not go this way, as I love collecting comics as a hobby in addition to reading the great stories in the pages. No floppies - no hobby

[comicsyte95]

Don't know what this could mean but this thread seems like an appropriate place to put it. Dinesh had this to say on Twitter the other day in response to a fan who said they were hitting the affordable limit with the number of VEI books.

Ziggy Blumenthal said:

@dinesh_s Happy for the success, but you've officially hit more titles than I can afford to get. Armor Hunters means somethings got to go

Dinesh responded:

@ZiggyFakeMcCoy We've got you covered! #staytuned

Curious to find out if VEI may have something up their sleeves...

Price drop to $2.99 across the line?

That would be awesome

[400yrs]

I have made this argument before, but inevitably another thread starts, so hear it is again:

do you really think that the trades will be published indefinitely for the entire run of each series? that is NOT a sustainable policy on ongoing series.

Each comic sells less and less, but eventually the drop offs are minimal as a readership stabilizes. Not the same with trades, Each vol 1 sells SIGNIFICANTLY more than vol 2, and then the drop offs become MORE and MORE dramatic. By vol 4-5 of any series, the decision to continue putting trades out becomes more and more difficult as they sell tiny amounts, 1k-2k per book or less. The only series that managed to avoid this are ever-greens like Preacher, Sandman, Y The Last Man, Walking Dead, which became such great sellers that they still find new readers every day. i can't name a single Superhero series that would qualify for long term trading. NOT ONE.

Invincible.

Edit..... Just saw the comments above. I doubt he's losing money on these. He wouldn't be doing all the different formats if that were the case.

[ncameron]

I switched to trade only years ago.

Valiant made it very easy to do with the 9.99 price point for volume 1 of each series, and after looking over the deluxe edition of X-O, Im probably going to switch to those exclusively given the value. I love reading 12-13 issues in one sitting.

But as to the worries about collecting there has really only been one issue that Marvel did that really annoyed me.
Agents of Atlas the mini and the 2 volumes for the Agents of Atlas the ongoing were all collected in HC as was the Atlas vs. Avengers and X-Men minis. When they relaunched the series again they released it softcover only. Same thing with the Iron Fist series, all the volumes were released in HC except the Immortal Weapons mini which was again softcover only.

Aside from that, and the oddball collection of Dan Slotts Amazing run, in that some books were OHC the size of the X-O deluxe and the rest were just the normal HC, I have had very good luck maintaing my trade runs from the big two. But I do tend to agree with ed that the longer a series of trades go, the lower sales tend to be. Marvel seems to have caught on and renumbers everytime a new team comes on board. Hence the Hickman run of FF is its own thing and then when fraction came on they restarted. My guess is the same thing will happen with Kesel coming on board.

DC has been pretty good, though the speed at which the new 52 is being collected isnt helping anybody.

-Neil