Stupidest character in Valiant Universe

[ManofTheAtom]

Doctor Eclipse

That is two votes for ole' Fred Bender. His early apps. were ok, later..... uggh!

At first, he was a cool, creepy villain.

Then (in my humble opinion) he began to take on the semblance of a poor man's Venom.

Agreed.

I doubt Shooter would have used the name Doctor Eclipse. He took the Doctor out of Doctor Solar for a reason.

It's more likely that he had another name in mind (maybe just Eclipse).... we know he had a different name in mind for Fred Bender.

[Byrneout]

From VALIANT, the gay bad guy who wanted to have sex with Solar.

We have a winner!

Solar issues 53 and 54. Seriously, what were they thinking?

Jurgens was probably thinking that VALIANT must have been really desperate if they were going to pay him to write crap like that for the privilege of using his name to increase sales.

I am in the apparent minority who enjoyed Jurgens Solar run. I felt it was an interesting expression or what a character with Solar's potential could do.

Yes, the hero characters in that run seemed simplistic - I felt that was intentional, and a sarcastic jab at a lot of the heroes being presented in other books at the time.

When you strip the story down to the core, it was about Solar trying to find some way to be at peace, and to keep in touch with his then rapidly fading humanity. After all, he built an entire WORLD just to give his human side *one place* where he was happy and untroubled by the powers and responsibilities he obtained as Solar. I find that to be a pretty powerful message.

**NOTE** I'm referring to the entuire Jurgens run as a whole, not just the specific issues mentioned... which in retrospect, I did rather dislike.**

[ManofTheAtom]

From VALIANT, the gay bad guy who wanted to have sex with Solar.

We have a winner!

Solar issues 53 and 54. Seriously, what were they thinking?

Jurgens was probably thinking that VALIANT must have been really desperate if they were going to pay him to write crap like that for the privilege of using his name to increase sales.

I am in the apparent minority who enjoyed Jurgens Solar run. I felt it was an interesting expression or what a character with Solar's potential could do.

Yes, the hero characters in that run seemed simplistic - I felt that was intentional, and a sarcastic jab at a lot of the heroes being presented in other books at the time.

When you strip the story down to the core, it was about Solar trying to find some way to be at peace, and to keep in touch with his then rapidly fading humanity. After all, he built an entire WORLD just to give his human side *one place* where he was happy and untroubled by the powers and responsibilities he obtained as Solar. I find that to be a pretty powerful message.

The initial arc wasn't that bad, but as it happens many times, Jurgens' lacked follow through.

[myron]

From VALIANT, the gay bad guy who wanted to have sex with Solar.

We have a winner!

Solar issues 53 and 54. Seriously, what were they thinking?

Jurgens was probably thinking that VALIANT must have been really desperate if they were going to pay him to write crap like that for the privilege of using his name to increase sales.

I am in the apparent minority who enjoyed Jurgens Solar run. I felt it was an interesting expression or what a character with Solar's potential could do.

Yes, the hero characters in that run seemed simplistic - I felt that was intentional, and a sarcastic jab at a lot of the heroes being presented in other books at the time.

When you strip the story down to the core, it was about Solar trying to find some way to be at peace, and to keep in touch with his then rapidly fading humanity. After all, he built an entire WORLD just to give his human side *one place* where he was happy and untroubled by the powers and responsibilities he obtained as Solar. I find that to be a pretty powerful message.

**NOTE** I'm referring to the entuire Jurgens run as a whole, not just the specific issues mentioned... which in retrospect, I did rather dislike.**

You're giving Jurgens an awful lot of respect there Ric...I like your interpretation, but I don't know if that was the original intent by Jurgens...

[Second_Death]

Doctor Eclipse

That is two votes for ole' Fred Bender. His early apps. were ok, later..... uggh!

At first, he was a cool, creepy villain.

Then (in my humble opinion) he began to take on the semblance of a poor man's Venom.

Agreed. Also feel the same way about Master Darque. So cool and evil early (SM 7-12 and EW 6-7) but so lame by Chaos Effect.

[Byrneout]

When you strip the story down to the core, it was about Solar trying to find some way to be at peace, and to keep in touch with his then rapidly fading humanity. After all, he built an entire WORLD just to give his human side *one place* where he was happy and untroubled by the powers and responsibilities he obtained as Solar. I find that to be a pretty powerful message.

**NOTE** I'm referring to the entuire Jurgens run as a whole, not just the specific issues mentioned... which in retrospect, I did rather dislike.**

You're giving Jurgens an awful lot of respect there Ric...I like your interpretation, but I don't know if that was the original intent by Jurgens...

Perhaps... but some of Solar's conversations with the "heroes" in #49 and with Seleski in issue #50 really seemed to support this line of thought.

But then again, it *is* open to interpretation, and short of finding some way to email Jurgens, interpretation is all we have. Therefore, your mileage may vary.

[Byrneout]

From VALIANT, the gay bad guy who wanted to have sex with Solar.

We have a winner!

Solar issues 53 and 54. Seriously, what were they thinking?

Jurgens was probably thinking that VALIANT must have been really desperate if they were going to pay him to write crap like that for the privilege of using his name to increase sales.

I am in the apparent minority who enjoyed Jurgens Solar run. I felt it was an interesting expression or what a character with Solar's potential could do.

Yes, the hero characters in that run seemed simplistic - I felt that was intentional, and a sarcastic jab at a lot of the heroes being presented in other books at the time.

When you strip the story down to the core, it was about Solar trying to find some way to be at peace, and to keep in touch with his then rapidly fading humanity. After all, he built an entire WORLD just to give his human side *one place* where he was happy and untroubled by the powers and responsibilities he obtained as Solar. I find that to be a pretty powerful message.

The initial arc wasn't that bad, but as it happens many times, Jurgens' lacked follow through.

Reminds me of some of the conversations I've had about Jurgens' Superman run...

[ManofTheAtom]

From VALIANT, the gay bad guy who wanted to have sex with Solar.

We have a winner!

Solar issues 53 and 54. Seriously, what were they thinking?

Jurgens was probably thinking that VALIANT must have been really desperate if they were going to pay him to write crap like that for the privilege of using his name to increase sales.

I am in the apparent minority who enjoyed Jurgens Solar run. I felt it was an interesting expression or what a character with Solar's potential could do.

Yes, the hero characters in that run seemed simplistic - I felt that was intentional, and a sarcastic jab at a lot of the heroes being presented in other books at the time.

When you strip the story down to the core, it was about Solar trying to find some way to be at peace, and to keep in touch with his then rapidly fading humanity. After all, he built an entire WORLD just to give his human side *one place* where he was happy and untroubled by the powers and responsibilities he obtained as Solar. I find that to be a pretty powerful message.

The initial arc wasn't that bad, but as it happens many times, Jurgens' lacked follow through.

Reminds me of some of the conversations I've had about Jurgens' Superman run...

I do think that towards the end they ran out of steam on Superman, but before that they did great things.

[Second_Death]

I am in the apparent minority who enjoyed Jurgens Solar run. I felt it was an interesting expression or what a character with Solar's potential could do.

Yes, the hero characters in that run seemed simplistic - I felt that was intentional, and a sarcastic jab at a lot of the heroes being presented in other books at the time.

When you strip the story down to the core, it was about Solar trying to find some way to be at peace, and to keep in touch with his then rapidly fading humanity. After all, he built an entire WORLD just to give his human side *one place* where he was happy and untroubled by the powers and responsibilities he obtained as Solar. I find that to be a pretty powerful message.

**NOTE** I'm referring to the entuire Jurgens run as a whole, not just the specific issues mentioned... which in retrospect, I did rather dislike.**

Agreed. I felt the same way also.

Solar #46-50 is IMO the most interesting story arc in the series after issue #18. If Jurgens had followed those issues with something more respectable (51 and 52 weren't horrible but 53 and 54 were awful), we probably would have a much different impression of his contribution to the title.

[The Harbinger]

I am in the apparent minority who enjoyed Jurgens Solar run. I felt it was an interesting expression or what a character with Solar's potential could do.

Yes, the hero characters in that run seemed simplistic - I felt that was intentional, and a sarcastic jab at a lot of the heroes being presented in other books at the time.

When you strip the story down to the core, it was about Solar trying to find some way to be at peace, and to keep in touch with his then rapidly fading humanity. After all, he built an entire WORLD just to give his human side *one place* where he was happy and untroubled by the powers and responsibilities he obtained as Solar. I find that to be a pretty powerful message.

**NOTE** I'm referring to the entuire Jurgens run as a whole, not just the specific issues mentioned... which in retrospect, I did rather dislike.**

Agreed. I felt the same way also.

Solar #46-50 is IMO the most interesting story arc in the series after issue #18. If Jurgens had followed those issues with something more respectable (51 and 52 weren't horrible but 53 and 54 were awful), we probably would have a much different impression of his contribution to the title.

it had its moments, but the brave new world storyline did have some stupid dialogue. IMO, jurgens's solar was great, it was everyone around solar that sucked

[fury143]

uzi the clown definitely

[caxiotis]

Let get specific. I hate the Ken Clarkson from X-O Manowar #14 when he is sitting by the pool in a speedo sipping on cocktail with his black glove on, and running from the incoming, space travelling, x-o in a very homoerotic way.

[Fanboy375]

Let get specific. I hate the Ken Clarkson from X-O Manowar #14 when he is sitting by the pool in a speedo sipping on cocktail with his black glove on, and running from the incoming, space travelling, x-o in a very homoerotic way.

dude that was one of my favorite parts. I loved the quirky, queer ken pose. um....did I just say that out loud???

[Cyberstrike]

I think Valiant had some good ideas for their series but they were hurt by the writers not knowing what to do with them.

[Jaknife]

i really want to know what BWS would have done with the origin of the sect vs. aram conflict. i hated how they came up with it.

[caxiotis]

i really want to know what BWS would have done with the origin of the sect vs. aram conflict. i hated how they came up with it.

Good Call. I was always kinda upset with the whole Aram slept with the blonde girl (can't remember who exactly she was) and the whole catipult into the sacred mosque thing. I definitely liked how BWS made it so that Aram built stonehenge one night after a long bender.

[caxiotis]

I just thought of a new character that I never liked.............. The Human Monarch from Turok yearbook. Didn't we get enough Monach in the first three issues of Turok the series?

[Jaknife]

yeah, especially because that unnamed hard corps guy takes monark away at the end, and your like, who the skree is that guy?

[Tim]

I just thought of a new character that I never liked.............. The Human Monarch from Turok yearbook. Didn't we get enough Monach in the first three issues of Turok the series?

Amen.

[Hotwire]

I always thought XO was a lame-*SQUEE* punk.

Just a Fabio looking jackass. Dude was probably some kind of gay. And if he wasn't he was obviously asking his barber to make him look that way.

[fury143]

Whenever I picture Uzi the clown, I think of that horrible clown movie by Stephen King.

[caxiotis]

I always thought XO was a lame-*SQUEE* punk.

Just a Fabio looking jackass. Dude was probably some kind of gay. And if he wasn't he was obviously asking his barber to make him look that way.

HAHAHAHAHAHAH!

[xodacia81]

I vote for two characters, tied as they are to what is the death of the title that contained possibly my favorite character...My vote for worst ever go to Crescendo/the vizier from XO-Manowar.

[Todd Luck]

I am in the apparent minority who enjoyed Jurgens Solar run. I felt it was an interesting expression or what a character with Solar's potential could do.

Yes, the hero characters in that run seemed simplistic - I felt that was intentional, and a sarcastic jab at a lot of the heroes being presented in other books at the time.

When you strip the story down to the core, it was about Solar trying to find some way to be at peace, and to keep in touch with his then rapidly fading humanity. After all, he built an entire WORLD just to give his human side *one place* where he was happy and untroubled by the powers and responsibilities he obtained as Solar. I find that to be a pretty powerful message.

**NOTE** I'm referring to the entuire Jurgens run as a whole, not just the specific issues mentioned... which in retrospect, I did rather dislike.**

Agreed. I felt the same way also.

Solar #46-50 is IMO the most interesting story arc in the series after issue #18. If Jurgens had followed those issues with something more respectable (51 and 52 weren't horrible but 53 and 54 were awful), we probably would have a much different impression of his contribution to the title.

it had its moments, but the brave new world storyline did have some stupid dialogue. IMO, jurgens's solar was great, it was everyone around solar that sucked

HE CREATES AN ENTIRE WORLD BECAUSE HE HAD AN ARGUEMENT WITH HIS GIRLFRIEND! And then after his existance throws it into world wide chaos, he just leaves it without a care.

...sorry had to get that off my chest. I really hated that *SQUEE*. LOL

[*SQUEE*]

I vote for two characters, tied as they are to what is the death of the title that contained possibly my favorite character...My vote for worst ever go to Crescendo/the vizier from XO-Manowar.

Word.