Book of Death: Legends of the Geomancer

[paradise]

I live in DC and have four LCS's within a 30 minute drive from my apartment (Not counting the Fantom Comics satellite store in Union Station) and ALL of them have told me that they've no intention of ordering enough BOD to qualify for one copy of LOG. They don't have the room for the extra stock that is EXTREMELY unlikely to sell. Between the four of them, there are MAYBE 30 VEI readers from what I've been told.

That is appalling. Discounted, returnable and a customer willing to buy the books. This is exactly why we are still a niche industry, while movies about superheroes break records.

[Elveen]

I live in DC and have four LCS's within a 30 minute drive from my apartment (Not counting the Fantom Comics satellite store in Union Station) and ALL of them have told me that they've no intention of ordering enough BOD to qualify for one copy of LOG. They don't have the room for the extra stock that is EXTREMELY unlikely to sell. Between the four of them, there are MAYBE 30 VEI readers from what I've been told.

That is appalling. Discounted, returnable and a customer willing to buy the books. This is exactly why we are still a niche industry, while movies about superheroes break records.

And exactly why YOU (Ed) are an amazing and successful business man. You DO for your customers.

I keep telling my wife, that some day I'm going to open a comic store that focuses on customer service.

[Paul Nolan]

Valiant is finishing their third year of publishing and starting their fourth year.

They will have to do some new things and take some risks.

It seems like the majority of Valiant fans would agree... yes, VEI should probably try some new things and take some risks.

The Legends of the Geomancer incentive is one of those risks.

So, as far as I can tell, the same people who would have said "yes, VEI should probably try some new things and take some risks" are now saying "...but not THAT!"

We are!

I acknowledge that VEI will have to make me mad to do what is right. My second favorite monthly title (Umbral) was canceled last month. I loved that book. Not many others did. If VEI only did stuff that I liked, then they would probably suffer the same fate.

There are probably exceptions, but I'd be willing to wager that most of the people defending this promotion:
1. already purchase variants, so are by definition the minority of those that purchase VEI books, and are used to paying more than cover for a comic book
2. have ample supply of disposable income
3. have convenient access (and the luxury of choice) to an LCS that has multiple employees who can deal with the hassle of buying/ordering/returning unsold books

I don't care for variants. I don't think they are the most horrible thing ever, but I don't like them. I already spend more on comics than I (or my wife) would like. I have two LCS in my area. The one I use has an owner and 2 part time employees. The other wouldn't even hold a copy of X-O Manowar #1 2nd print for an hour for me.

I live in DC and have four LCS's within a 30 minute drive from my apartment (Not counting the Fantom Comics satellite store in Union Station) and ALL of them have told me that they've no intention of ordering enough BOD to qualify for one copy of LOG. They don't have the room for the extra stock that is EXTREMELY unlikely to sell. Between the four of them, there are MAYBE 30 VEI readers from what I've been told.

So, they don't know they're returnable... ?

It sounds like their should have been a lot more communication with shops before putting an incentive like this in previews.

[magnusr]

It sounds like their should have been a lot more communication with shops before putting an incentive like this in previews.

Like others I wrote DCBS and I pointed out the discounts, but even so they did not understand. And they actively blamed VEI for soliciting this issue the same as any normal issue, which I can see myself in Previews is a lie. Guess VEI would need to personally educate pretty much everyone except Ed.

/Magnus

[Tim]

Hi Everyone.
I just posted this in the buy/sell form but it also seems pretty relevant here potentially...

Reaching out to those that may be upset with the recent book of death saga and want to sell their collections. I am new to the "new" valiant universe and am interested in buying a full run if anyone wants to part with it?

See, the promotion is working! New readers!

Hey Tim...

Not to change the subject... (Shhh... Really to change the subject)

On your print run thread, are the numbers for just the regular editions? Or do they include all the variants in those numbers?

Thanks!

Just the regular editions. All the date I have there is strictly lifted from Diamonds monthly numbers, and so far I haven't seen any real numbers listed for variants or subsequent printings. I'd love to be able to track that stuff too if I could get a definite number on them.

[DirtbagSailor]

Sorry if this was posted earlier:

[ilzuccone]

It sounds like their should have been a lot more communication with shops before putting an incentive like this in previews.

Like others I wrote DCBS and I pointed out the discounts, but even so they did not understand. And they actively blamed VEI for soliciting this issue the same as any normal issue, which I can see myself in Previews is a lie. Guess VEI would need to personally educate pretty much everyone except Ed.

/Magnus

Actually I believe ed was educated by vei on this book. Think he said that somewhere here

[lorddunlow]

It sounds like their should have been a lot more communication with shops before putting an incentive like this in previews.

Like others I wrote DCBS and I pointed out the discounts, but even so they did not understand. And they actively blamed VEI for soliciting this issue the same as any normal issue, which I can see myself in Previews is a lie. Guess VEI would need to personally educate pretty much everyone except Ed.

/Magnus

Actually I believe ed was educated by vei on this book. Think he said that somewhere here

His exact words were he was "apprehensive" when they told him about it but Atom, Dino, et al. convinced him it was necessary for their growth.

As I've said before, if Ed needed some convincing by the main man himself, virtually no other LCSs can be expected to go "all in" on this promotion

[ilzuccone]

really interested in seeing how this plays out.

[lorddunlow]

really interested in seeing how this plays out.

Me too. I really do hope that VEI can reach a wider audience with this promotion. I'm just not very optimistic it will do so.

[Newton]

Valiant's reasoning aside I can only see this backfiring long term. This strategy is a big turn off both to my LCS and me personally. I want to see Valiant grow, but not at the risk of losing existing fans like myself.

[DantePD]

Valiant's reasoning aside I can only see this backfiring long term. This strategy is a big turn off both to my LCS and me personally. I want to see Valiant grow, but not at the risk of losing existing fans like myself.

I know, right? I just don't understand how actively alienating and angering the people who have supported you is good for business.

[Chris Campbell]

Valiant's reasoning aside I can only see this backfiring long term. This strategy is a big turn off both to my LCS and me personally. I want to see Valiant grow, but not at the risk of losing existing fans like myself.

I know, right? I just don't understand how actively alienating and angering the people who have supported you is good for business.

I assumed you talked to Big Planet Comics? I live in Vienna and go there from time to time, but the clerks always say the only have a few VEI customers, and they never order enough of anything to get variants.

[paradise]

It sounds like their should have been a lot more communication with shops before putting an incentive like this in previews.

Like others I wrote DCBS and I pointed out the discounts, but even so they did not understand. And they actively blamed VEI for soliciting this issue the same as any normal issue, which I can see myself in Previews is a lie. Guess VEI would need to personally educate pretty much everyone except Ed.

/Magnus

That just means they did not pay attention. I saw the solicit and right away understood what they were doing.

BTW, they did not have to teach me about why it was good. I was a bit apprehensive for how fans would see it and that's what I talked about with Dinesh. Trust me when I say, VEI fully understands the situation and they did it because they need to break through. Dinesh can see the posts here about the stores that don't want to put in an effort on product that is discounted and returnable to them, with customers coming in begging for it. He's very frustrated about it.

There is a saying: "You give a man a $10 bill, and he'll complain that it's not two $5 bills". That's what is happening here.

[paradise]

Actually I believe ed was educated by vei on this book. Think he said that somewhere here

Any single person who sees that ad, their initial response is to worry about it. it's unusual and has not been done much in the past, so it feels weird. But, one can change their mind based on facts and additional information provided. it does not make it any worse or better a promotion just because people who read it can waver on it, until they fully understand it.

And honestly, like I said earlier, I have some reservations about it, always have, but I do believe that it will help tremendously.

[FormerReader]

Trust me when I say, VEI fully understands the situation and they did it because they need to break through. Dinesh can see the posts here about the stores that don't want to put in an effort on product that is discounted and returnable to them, with customers coming in begging for it. He's *SQUEE* off and angry about it (not at you the fans, at the lazy *SQUEE* stores).

When they finally do break through to more stores it will be very interesting to see what step finally gets their foot in the door. I can only imagine the amount of persistence required and the satisfaction of seeing this through.

FYI, I couldn't get a copy of BOD: LofG from my LCS and he is very good about ordering Valiant for me. I went the online route.

[ilzuccone]

BTW, they did not have to teach me about why it was good. I was a bit apprehensive for how fans would see it and that's what I talked about with Dinesh.

ah got it.

[iggy101us]

Do you guys think BoD #1 will sell more than Unity #1 (~68k copies)? Unity #1 also were returnable, but it had numerous variant covers up to 1:200 instead of variant story tied to BoD #1. The other difference is that BoD is a mini and mini's usually don't sell as well as ongoing. If every regular Valiant reader (guessing 5000-7000 readers) ask their LCS to amp up their orders, that would result in 125k-175k issues of BoD #1.

[kjjohanson]

Do you guys think BoD #1 will sell more than Unity #1 (~68k copies)? Unity #1 also were returnable, but it had numerous variant covers up to 1:200 instead of variant story tied to BoD #1. The other difference is that BoD is a mini and mini's usually don't sell as well as ongoing. If every regular Valiant reader (guessing 5000-7000 readers) ask their LCS to amp up their orders, that would result in 125k-175k issues of BoD #1.

If I were a retailer I'd discount these, maybe to half cover price, since that would still allow for a healthy profit. It would probably encourage people to pick up a full set of covers as well.

[paradise]

If I were a retailer I'd discount these, maybe to half cover price, since that would still allow for a healthy profit. It would probably encourage people to pick up a full set of covers as well.

Agree with the first, not necessarily the second. It's already hard to get people to try new stuff, so at half-price, retailer is making a really good mark up. I would not encourage customers to pick up multiple covers on something they are trying out, though. A store is better off getting that customer to try 2-3 different things. We never push multiple covers, we try to push multiple products. A store makes money when a customer buys a title for several months, let's say a year. One $4 sale leads to $48 in potential sales. We give away a lot of first issues to build audiences for titles. We also give away hundreds of the $1 issues that publishers release to build GN sales. Giving away a Walking Dead #1 ($1 version) generally leads to sales of 23 volumes of WD. At least one in four customers do that, leading to ridiculous upselling with just a free $1 book that cost me 50 cents. I actually encourage my employees to give away a certain amount of stuff every week. It is the best advertising money I have ever spent, and it builds good will at the same time.

[DantePD]

Valiant's reasoning aside I can only see this backfiring long term. This strategy is a big turn off both to my LCS and me personally. I want to see Valiant grow, but not at the risk of losing existing fans like myself.

I know, right? I just don't understand how actively alienating and angering the people who have supported you is good for business.

I assumed you talked to Big Planet Comics? I live in Vienna and go there from time to time, but the clerks always say the only have a few VEI customers, and they never order enough of anything to get variants.

Yeah, I talked to the guys at their U street store, Fantom Comics on P St., Painted Visions in Woodbridge, and After Hours in Alexandria.

[jaden_sai]

Additional info from Bleeding Cool, with additional art from the book

Juan Jose Ryp Absolutely Destroys Book of Death: Legends Of The Geomancer At Valiant

http://www.bleedingcool.com/2015/05/07/ ... t-valiant/

[Donovan]

I feel like I'm the only person who is not gaga for Juan Jose Ryp. It's just too consistently dense and busy for me, and needs a panel or two WITHOUT gore and detail to let it breathe.

Don't get me wrong - he's extremely talented, and I see the appeal. It's just not for me.

[greg]

OK, so the art is definitely worth checking out, but it's the STORY that catches my attention here.

For those of you who AREN'T planning to get Legends of the Geomancer (or for those of you who are and don't mind spoilers):

The four issue Legends of the Geomancer series tells the story of the first Geomancer... so this story happens before any other Valiant universe stories. Rather than having a story from the "middle" of the Valiant universe timeline that is missing (if you don't read Legends of the Geomancer), you'll only be missing a story from "before the start" of the Valiant universe timeline. So, there won't be a hole in your reading, there will be a "prequel" that you just don't tack onto the front.

[agent_graves]

I feel like I'm the only person who is not gaga for Juan Jose Ryp. It's just too consistently dense and busy for me, and needs a panel or two WITHOUT gore and detail to let it breathe.

Don't get me wrong - he's extremely talented, and I see the appeal. It's just not for me.

Yea, I'd have to agree, he's talented, but everything we've seen thus far, looks so Barbaric..