X-O Manowar #5

[400yrs]

Yup, also done with variants. As I was the only one chasing them all down - and helping my LCS get his hands on them by paying for lots of extra copies -I'll be passing along my message to them not to bother in the future. Valiant is supposed to be leading the pack with innovations, not following it with gimmicks. How about getting books into the hands of the 200,000 + people who have left the industry in the last 20 years. How about getting them into places that are accessible to most people (7-11, free comic downloads of 1st issues on major news and entertainment websites). Seriously, lead by example guys.

Make sure you do let them know. Them having a bunch of extra issues plus a pricey variant they can't sell will only *SQUEE* the LCS off toward both you and VEI if they are expecting you to buy them.

[400yrs]

I am amazed that people are not totally excited for golds as this is continuing Valiant tradition of gold covers

Gold covers are fine and all, but why do it several months after the release of #1? Therefore, this is in essence a reprint that is just being sold as a chase book.

I don't really see the need for gold books in today's market. Most variants are new covers. The golds are a throw back to the old valiant, but there was alot that wasn't that great about the old valiant.

For yourselves, make a choice, but by being so vocally negative you are not helping anyone. Let's say someone else decides to not get the variants because of your rant. Their store now orders less books resulting in less Valiant comics on the shelves. That is the realworld impact your rant has on Valiant's future. Think about it.

If a buyer is influenced by something on a message board, then their commitment to buying the variants wasn't strong to begin with and would've faded quickly anyway.

If people would've told their shops back in the 90s that they are getting out of comics because the stories were no good, some of those shops might have been able to adjust their orders downward. Instead, they ordered tons of stuff they couldn't sell thinking their sub customers were going to buy them as they said they were. Many shops closed down because they didn't have the proper information.

Information, even if negative, often has validity to it.

[GGSAE]

XO #1 Gold is a line wide 1:100 incentive for that month. 1:20 and 1:50 are connecting covers.

I am amazed that people are not totally excited for golds as this is continuing Valiant tradition of gold covers

What, for the 8th cover of a comic? LOL. If you like them ed, keep the golds for your personal collection and don't sell them.

I don't like being told from a retailer, how I should feel regarding my purchases, since we are the end-users here. This company is nothing without the readers, and you talk about variants being an acceptable part of the game. Well I for one have purchased all of the variants (multiples of each actually), and If guys like me are really sitting on the fence about maintaining this buying pattern, because of the excess of variants that are being published (and 8 covers for X-O 1 is insane!), then the company should understand how these opinions affect the supply chain of the business.
You also talk about just buying the books because you like them. While I agree with that to some extent, all consumers want to feel their business is appreciated. Have many times have you gone to a business that you knew was more expensive because you liked the company's culture, or product history, better over a cheaper alternative?

From the previous post by 400 years, you can see how information from the grass roots level is very relative.

[etos45]

XO #1 Gold is a line wide 1:100 incentive for that month. 1:20 and 1:50 are connecting covers.

I am amazed that people are not totally excited for golds as this is continuing Valiant tradition of gold covers

And, once again, variants are 100% necessary at this time in the game for Valiant. For yourselves, make a choice, but by being so vocally negative you are not helping anyone. Let's say someone else decides to not get the variants because of your rant. Their store now orders less books resulting in less Valiant comics on the shelves. That is the realworld impact your rant has on Valiant's future. Think about it.

I don't believe there was a rant on this thread, just opinions and discussion. Besides, if we can't express frustrations (not rants, mind you) here then where? I'm pretty sure my wife doesn't wanna hear about it. Her eyes would glaze over.

Yeah, I try to talk to my wife about Valiant and I can see her mind drifting off elsewhere.

And just to let Paradise know, I for one AM excited about the gold logo variant. I'm not entirely sure I'm going to get it, though, because the 1:100 might be out of my price range (I'm not sure how they'll be pricing these).

I'm also in the same boat that I quit the variants after the Harbinger #1s. There's just too many and there is no way that I could afford to keep up.

[drmirage]

I am very excited about the Gold issues and the exclusive variants. However, I will not have the budget to get all of them. I believe that 1:100 variants will have a price of $100 per copy. The A&A #1 1:100 is going for around that price now. A&A is my fav book, so I will be getting a copy to keep. For the others, I probably will not be getting them.

If Valiant now has 4 titles by the end of the year with 3 covers including (Regular, Pull Box and 1:20)
Regular $3.99, Pullbox $3.99 and 1:20 $20.00 is $28.00 per issue. The price per month collecting all the covers will be $112.00 / per month
Now, if there are 8 titles by next year. Thats $224 / per month.
This does not include any 1:50, 1:100, 2nd, 3rd Printings, Flip sketch and Gold books.

What I will be doing for sure is choosing some of the variants, but not all of them. If I like the cover, story and it fits the budget. I'm getting them.

XO #1 Gold is a line wide 1:100 incentive for that month. 1:20 and 1:50 are connecting covers.

I am amazed that people are not totally excited for golds as this is continuing Valiant tradition of gold covers

And, once again, variants are 100% necessary at this time in the game for Valiant. For yourselves, make a choice, but by being so vocally negative you are not helping anyone. Let's say someone else decides to not get the variants because of your rant. Their store now orders less books resulting in less Valiant comics on the shelves. That is the realworld impact your rant has on Valiant's future. Think about it.

I don't believe there was a rant on this thread, just opinions and discussion. Besides, if we can't express frustrations (not rants, mind you) here then where? I'm pretty sure my wife doesn't wanna hear about it. Her eyes would glaze over.

Yeah, I try to talk to my wife about Valiant and I can see her mind drifting off elsewhere.

And just to let Paradise know, I for one AM excited about the gold logo variant. I'm not entirely sure I'm going to get it, though, because the 1:100 might be out of my price range (I'm not sure how they'll be pricing these).

I'm also in the same boat that I quit the variants after the Harbinger #1s. There's just too many and there is no way that I could afford to keep up.

[FormerReader]

It will be interesting to see how the 1:100 is priced. That will have a big impact on whether I will buy it or not. I think the idea of a gold book is cool, but after 8 covers for X-O #1 it has lost some of it's appeal.

[etos45]

It will be interesting to see how the 1:100 is priced. That will have a big impact on whether I will buy it or not. I think the idea of a gold book is cool, but after 8 covers for X-O #1 it has lost some of it's appeal.

If it were a regular 1:100 then I know my dealer would do $100, but since it's line-wide I'm really hoping it sells for less than that.

[VEI Reborn]

It will be interesting to see how the 1:100 is priced. That will have a big impact on whether I will buy it or not. I think the idea of a gold book is cool, but after 8 covers for X-O #1 it has lost some of it's appeal.

If it were a regular 1:100 then I know my dealer would do $100, but since it's line-wide I'm really hoping it sells for less than that.

Hmmmm. If its line-wide, it should be way less rare then say a A&A 1:100. Im going to look at it as a 1:25 book. Dont ask me how my math works on that one


PS. I am super stoked for a gold cover and Im totally loving all of these variants! Im all for making variants of nearly every book, its all that much more fun for me.

[Heath]

I am amazed that people are not totally excited for golds as this is continuing Valiant tradition of gold covers

If there weren't already over 20 other variants, there would probably be a LOT of excitement over it.

And , once again, variants are 100% necessary at this time in the game for Valiant. For yourselves, make a choice, but by being so vocally negative you are not helping anyone. Let's say someone else decides to not get the variants because of your rant. Their store now orders less books resulting in less Valiant comics on the shelves. That is the realworld impact your rant has on Valiant's future. Think about it.

You act like you've never read anything slightly negative on the Internet!

[StarBrand]

XO #1 Gold is a line wide 1:100 incentive for that month. 1:20 and 1:50 are connecting covers.

I am amazed that people are not totally excited for golds as this is continuing Valiant tradition of gold covers

And, once again, variants are 100% necessary at this time in the game for Valiant. For yourselves, make a choice, but by being so vocally negative you are not helping anyone.

Agreed, the variants are nescessary to give Valiant a better shot at surviving. You've won me over about the complaints about variants. It's getting old. You don't like the variants, don't buy 'em.

[cjv]

It will be interesting to see how the 1:100 is priced. That will have a big impact on whether I will buy it or not. I think the idea of a gold book is cool, but after 8 covers for X-O #1 it has lost some of it's appeal.

If it were a regular 1:100 then I know my dealer would do $100, but since it's line-wide I'm really hoping it sells for less than that.

DCBS is asking for $125 for it in advance, I believe.

$50 for the 1:20 issues till, and $100 for the 1:50.

Chris

[cjv]

While I can understand, and agree with the argument that variants are needed, and a necessary "evil" in todays comic book market, I don't know if I agree with reading the conclusion that EVERY issue coming out needs to have at least one variant, and in many cases multiple variants. One line wide variant per month, or two 1:10 or 1:20 variants per month - sure. More variant issues coming out than regular issues...not so sure.

Chris

[StarBrand]

I think the variant strategy is going to help Valiant survive, though some long-time fans won't, and obviously don't like it. The DC relaunch turned off many long-time DC fans, but it worked big time, because it gave the general public a great jumping on point for an entire legendary comic book universe. The variants will turn off some long-time Valiant fans, but will work because it will work for the general comic book fan and overall sales.

[etos45]

It will be interesting to see how the 1:100 is priced. That will have a big impact on whether I will buy it or not. I think the idea of a gold book is cool, but after 8 covers for X-O #1 it has lost some of it's appeal.

If it were a regular 1:100 then I know my dealer would do $100, but since it's line-wide I'm really hoping it sells for less than that.

DCBS is asking for $125 for it in advance, I believe.

$50 for the 1:20 issues till, and $100 for the 1:50.

Chris

I may be proven very wrong, but I don't think that these issues will get that much after the release. Especially $50 for the 1:20 and $100 for the 1:50. The 1:100 is a crap shoot because it is a little more unique than the others. Especially if it's gold embossed. But I won't pay $125 or even $100 for it.

[StarBrand]

I am amazed that people are not totally excited for golds as this is continuing Valiant tradition of gold covers

If there weren't already over 20 other variants, there would probably be a LOT of excitement over it.

And , once again, variants are 100% necessary at this time in the game for Valiant. For yourselves, make a choice, but by being so vocally negative you are not helping anyone. Let's say someone else decides to not get the variants because of your rant. Their store now orders less books resulting in less Valiant comics on the shelves. That is the realworld impact your rant has on Valiant's future. Think about it.

You act like you've never read anything slightly negative on the Internet!

At first it seemed understandable if you don't like the variants, but it's getting to be a bit over the top.

[R Daneel]

I made the calm decision not to buy them in the beginning ... I obviously missed something and I should be mad about it. It's the internet and it's my right. #entitlementissues

[Donovan]

Despite the proud tradition of it, I actually find gold variants sort of boring. I much prefer new artwork or straight pencils.

I'm on the fence with this one. I'm hunting down nearly every other variant, but I can't see myself springing for this at this time.

Ask me again in 3 months. lol!

[KXXX]

[Tim]

I am amazed that people are not totally excited for golds as this is continuing Valiant tradition of gold covers

Ditto. Gold books are as Valiant as it comes.

[etos45]

Despite the proud tradition of it, I actually find gold variants sort of boring. I much prefer new artwork or straight pencils.

I'm on the fence with this one. I'm hunting down nearly every other variant, but I can't see myself springing for this at this time.

Ask me again in 3 months. lol!

I don't want them to over use gold books, but the occasional one on really special books is awesome to me. Different cover art doesn't really appeal to me unless there is something special about it. Like Aja is cool because it's a unique art style and the QRs are cool because nothing like that has been done before. Same with the homage cover for Hary #1. The rest, I couldn't care less about.

[paradise]

Gold covers are fine and all, but why do it several months after the release of #1? Therefore, this is in essence a reprint that is just being sold as a chase book.

XO #5 is a SPECIAL issue, with Ninjak first appearance. VEI felt that their hardcore fans would appreciate them reviving the old custom of gold covers for that issue. When I was told by Dino about this promotion a month ago, I thought it was a fantastic "homage" idea, even though I don't have a single gold cover.

If people would've told their shops back in the 90s that they are getting out of comics because the stories were no good, some of those shops might have been able to adjust their orders downward. Instead, they ordered tons of stuff they couldn't sell thinking their sub customers were going to buy them as they said they were. Many shops closed down because they didn't have the proper information.

That I will agree with, THOUGH I think the times are different. At that time, retailers got stuck with a LOT of stuff by various publishers, not just valiants. I still get boxes with tons of Vertigo packs of 10 of the same issue, same with many other things, not as much Valiants (except those damn Rai & The Future Force #9s).

My point about the way the variants keep stores from going sub-only by covering part of the cost of additional copies, and thus leading to potential new customers, is 100% valid. By saying "I am tired of these *SQUEE* variants, no more" you are influencing someone else to do the same where they would still continue getting those variants and giving a store a reason to order more.

I am not against negative feedback. It's healthy to have discourse. But this one has been beat to death and I promise you, affecting things in a negative fashion, with orders by retailers affected. If people on this site are true fans, as I am (it's tough to separate a retailer and a fan, but it's true, my big goal here is to have Valiant doing better and better) they should realize that they are hurting their favorite brand by consistently being negative about one very small aspect of their publishing plan.

I see the same 3-4 people consistently pouring on, and that I DO consider a rant.

[paradise]

What, for the 8th cover of a comic? LOL. If you like them ed, keep the golds for your personal collection and don't sell them.

Actually besides selling them in my own store and here, I don't have a horse in the game, as far as collecting them. I am not a collector of comics. I stopped when I opened my store, because I did not believe that it would be fair to my customers to compete with them for the harder-to-find books. I took myself out of the game completely. I collect some hardcovers, and original art.

I don't like being told from a retailer, how I should feel regarding my purchases, since we are the end-users here.

I am not telling you how to feel, I am just pointing out that the reason you are here is because you LOVE Valiant, and constant leading of conversation towards the variant covers and how they are ruining your experience has negative results for your brand. Valiant is in business of producing reading material, and they use many different means, including variants, because they are aware of the current marketplace (how many companies have a GREAT retailer as their head of sales?) to introduce more READERS to their brand. It's your choice which of the 8 covers to pick up, and it's your choice to look in your wallet and decide whether to get all 8, or just the one you like the most, or the one that is affordable. Valiant does not decide prices of the books, free marketplace does. They should stop even though it's helping them sell more books, because someone at DCBS, Collector's Paradise or EBAY decides that $50 is the right price? That does not make sense.

[paradise]

It will be interesting to see how the 1:100 is priced. That will have a big impact on whether I will buy it or not. I think the idea of a gold book is cool, but after 8 covers for X-O #1 it has lost some of it's appeal.

If it were a regular 1:100 then I know my dealer would do $100, but since it's line-wide I'm really hoping it sells for less than that.

We'll see what happens. I ordered 2k copies of all 3 previous books to get 40 copies of the 1:50 variants. So did a lot of people which is why there are still shops with a lot of first prints of XO 1, Harbinger 1 and so on. On A&A #1, I am getting only 6 of the 1:100 line wide. I don't see them going cheap.

You have to understand, for issues 2,3,4 and so on, most retailers will order what they know they can sell, with a shelf margin. Then they will go up 10-20% to get the variants, not much more. This means that they may round up some copies if they have 185 ordered. They will go to 200, 'cause those 15 extras will be more than covered by the additional 1:100 variant. But they will NOT order another 100 copies extra to get another variant. Retailer cost of 100 copies is roughly $200, and they can't get that for the 1:100 so they won't do it.

[paradise]

While I can understand, and agree with the argument that variants are needed, and a necessary "evil" in todays comic book market, I don't know if I agree with reading the conclusion that EVERY issue coming out needs to have at least one variant, and in many cases multiple variants. One line wide variant per month, or two 1:10 or 1:20 variants per month - sure. More variant issues coming out than regular issues...not so sure.

Chris

Chris, I think (i have no specific knowledge) that Valiant will keep the 1:20s for a few more issues of ea. book. One it gets to issue 6,7,8 and so on, the novelty and the benefit of these variants will subside. The more difficult variants are and should be reserved for "special" issues like XO #5. That's a valid strategy. If those incentives make retailers order more books of that issue, those retailers will have another push at promoting valiant books, because they are "free" to them if they sell the variants. Any retailer who is smart will promote books that cost them nothing. It's pure mark up, why wouldn't they.

[paradise]

I am amazed that people are not totally excited for golds as this is continuing Valiant tradition of gold covers

Ditto. Gold books are as Valiant as it comes.

EXACTLY. I know others have done it since, and I know cooler things have happened since, but as an "homage" idea, this is Brilliant. I know I was excited about it when i heard about it.