Valiant Variants - Enough!

[David_Cody]

I guess I just don't get the tense of this entire post. If someone doesn't want to buy-in to the "variant game" publishers release on a given issue....don't buy it. If you're not a completionist, don't sweat it. If you are, get a second job and build a new addition on the house.

Cause Variants have been around since the inception of the original VU. Nothing you can do about it.

[Dr. Solar]

The variants for september are listed as "order all" variants. Anyone know what this means? They aren't listed as order incentives, and Midtown has them for pre-order at regular price.

Any info on this?

[tchalla8]

The variants for september are listed as "order all" variants. Anyone know what this means? They aren't listed as order incentives, and Midtown has them for pre-order at regular price.

You referring to the Harbinger #4 Braithwaite Variant, or are you seeing something else?

[tchalla8]

The variants for september are listed as "order all" variants. Anyone know what this means? They aren't listed as order incentives, and Midtown has them for pre-order at regular price.

Any info on this?

Found this from a paragraph about the X-O #1 pullbox variant someone posted online in February. Maybe this will shed some light.

"This variant is an order all that will appear on the Diamond retailer order form and that retailers are allowed to order as many as they have orders for (or have subscriptions)"

Sounds like more pullbox type stuff to me maybe.

[jmatt]

Some will claim having too many books left on the shelf is a bad thing, but not everyone who buys comics shows up on Wednesday at 10 AM to do so.

And the other thing to consider is that available issues of #1 sitting on the shelf will help boost sales of #2 (and create more fans of the title).

If I walk in and there's something interesting about the second issue of a title, it also helps if I can also grab #1 at the same time. If not, and I now I have to hunt down a #1 at a different store or on Ebay, well maybe I'm not that interested...

[Dr. Solar]

Found this from a paragraph about the X-O #1 pullbox variant someone posted online in February. Maybe this will shed some light.

"This variant is an order all that will appear on the Diamond retailer order form and that retailers are allowed to order as many as they have orders for (or have subscriptions)"

Sounds like more pullbox type stuff to me maybe.

Excellent! It sounds like all the September variants are just alternate cover regular editions, not limited, except the Interlocking cover variants for X-O #5.

[tchalla8]

Found this from a paragraph about the X-O #1 pullbox variant someone posted online in February. Maybe this will shed some light.

"This variant is an order all that will appear on the Diamond retailer order form and that retailers are allowed to order as many as they have orders for (or have subscriptions)"

Sounds like more pullbox type stuff to me maybe.

Excellent! It sounds like all the September variants are just alternate cover regular editions, not limited, except the Interlocking cover variants for X-O #5.

Yeah! Cover prices! My wallet weeps with joy!

[Dr. Solar]

Should stop the wallet bleed a bit

[grendeljd]

Found this from a paragraph about the X-O #1 pullbox variant someone posted online in February. Maybe this will shed some light.

"This variant is an order all that will appear on the Diamond retailer order form and that retailers are allowed to order as many as they have orders for (or have subscriptions)"

Sounds like more pullbox type stuff to me maybe.

Excellent! It sounds like all the September variants are just alternate cover regular editions, not limited, except the Interlocking cover variants for X-O #5.

Yeah! Cover prices! My wallet weeps with joy!

cover price variants with exceptional art? I can dig it.

[Heath]

I thought it might be interesting to compare the known DNV variants that we know about so far (including those that haven't been released yet) to this list of VH1 Pre-Unity/Unity variants.

DNV Variants

• X-O Manowar
  • #1 Pullbox
    #1 Aja (1:20)
    #1 QR (1:50)
    #1 2nd Print
    #1 3rd Print
    #2 Lozzi (1:20)
    #3 Suayan (1:20)
    #4 Kramer (1:20)
    #5 Pullbox
    #5 Zircher X-O
    #5 Zircher Ninjak

• Harbinger
  • #1 Pullbox
    #1 Braithwaite (1:20)
    #1 QR (1:50)
    #2 Braithwaite (1:20)
    #3 Zircher (1:20)

• Bloodshot
  • #1 Pullbox
    #1 Aja (1:20)
    #1 Ribic (1:50)
    #2 Brase (1:20)

• Archer & Armstrong
  • #1 Pullbox
    #1 Aja (1:20)
    #1 Adams (line-wide 1:100)

• Misc.
  • X-O/Harbinger #1 convention sketch flipbook

VH1 Pre-Unity/Unity Variants

• Archer & Armstrong #0 Gold
  Eternal Warrior #1 Gold Embossed
  Eternal Warrior #1 Gold Flat
  Harbinger #0 Pink
  Solar #10 2nd Printing
  Unity #0 Red
  Unity #1 Gold
  Unity #1 Platinum

DNV Summary: 24 variants of 11 different books. 11 books total released. Variant rate: 218%

VH1 Summary (Pre-Unity/Unity): 8 variants of 6 different books. 67 total Pre-Unity/Unity books released. Variant rate: 11.9%

Is this a valid comparison? Yes, I think it is. I think ~12% variant rate is an acceptable number. A 218% variant rate is well into "crazy" territory.

[drmirage]

Awesome having this all listed. Easy to see what is out there now.

[BugsySig]

I thought it might be interesting to compare the known DNV variants that we know about so far (including those that haven't been released yet) to this list of VH1 Pre-Unity/Unity variants.

DNV Variants

• X-O Manowar
  • #1 Pullbox
    #1 Aja (1:20)
    #1 QR (1:50)
    #1 2nd Print
    #1 3rd Print
    #2 Lozzi (1:20)
    #3 Suayan (1:20)
    #4 Kramer (1:20)
    #5 Pullbox
    #5 Zircher X-O
    #5 Zircher Ninjak

• Harbinger
  • #1 Pullbox
    #1 Braithwaite (1:20)
    #1 QR (1:50)
    #2 Braithwaite (1:20)
    #3 Zircher (1:20)

• Bloodshot
  • #1 Pullbox
    #1 Aja (1:20)
    #1 Ribic (1:50)
    #2 Brase (1:20)

• Archer & Armstrong
  • #1 Pullbox
    #1 Aja (1:20)
    #1 Adams (line-wide 1:100)

• Misc.
  • X-O/Harbinger #1 convention sketch flipbook

VH1 Pre-Unity/Unity Variants

• Archer & Armstrong #0 Gold
  Eternal Warrior #1 Gold Embossed
  Eternal Warrior #1 Gold Flat
  Harbinger #0 Pink
  Solar #10 2nd Printing
  Unity #0 Red
  Unity #1 Gold
  Unity #1 Platinum

DNV Summary: 24 variants of 11 different books. 11 books total released. Variant rate: 218%

VH1 Summary (Pre-Unity/Unity): 8 variants of 6 different books. 67 total Pre-Unity/Unity books released. Variant rate: 11.9%

Is this a valid comparison? Yes, I think it is. I think ~12% variant rate is an acceptable number. A 218% variant rate is well into "crazy" territory.

Most pre Unity books were published before the variant craze. I would look at post unity and unity books up until 1994 or even 1996 to make a fair comparison.

Also, variants didn't serve the same purpose then or follow the same distribution methods. They were often send aways or given directly to fans or shops, not used as encentives to retailers to order more copies.

At the time it would have been detrimental to costs to print this number of variants, where as now it is more cost-effective and obviously profitable for VEI or they wouldn't be doing them.

[GGSAE]

I thought it might be interesting to compare the known DNV variants that we know about so far (including those that haven't been released yet) to this list of VH1 Pre-Unity/Unity variants.

DNV Variants

• X-O Manowar
  • #1 Pullbox
    #1 Aja (1:20)
    #1 QR (1:50)
    #1 2nd Print
    #1 3rd Print
    #2 Lozzi (1:20)
    #3 Suayan (1:20)
    #4 Kramer (1:20)
    #5 Pullbox
    #5 Zircher X-O
    #5 Zircher Ninjak

• Harbinger
  • #1 Pullbox
    #1 Braithwaite (1:20)
    #1 QR (1:50)
    #2 Braithwaite (1:20)
    #3 Zircher (1:20)

• Bloodshot
  • #1 Pullbox
    #1 Aja (1:20)
    #1 Ribic (1:50)
    #2 Brase (1:20)

• Archer & Armstrong
  • #1 Pullbox
    #1 Aja (1:20)
    #1 Adams (line-wide 1:100)

• Misc.
  • X-O/Harbinger #1 convention sketch flipbook

VH1 Pre-Unity/Unity Variants

• Archer & Armstrong #0 Gold
  Eternal Warrior #1 Gold Embossed
  Eternal Warrior #1 Gold Flat
  Harbinger #0 Pink
  Solar #10 2nd Printing
  Unity #0 Red
  Unity #1 Gold
  Unity #1 Platinum

DNV Summary: 24 variants of 11 different books. 11 books total released. Variant rate: 218%

VH1 Summary (Pre-Unity/Unity): 8 variants of 6 different books. 67 total Pre-Unity/Unity books released. Variant rate: 11.9%

Is this a valid comparison? Yes, I think it is. I think ~12% variant rate is an acceptable number. A 218% variant rate is well into "crazy" territory.

In terms of total released books, it's not a fair comparison because the 'pre-unity' stage of comics of VEI is still being developed. And as it takes hold, we're already seeing the number of variants drop, so the variant rate will be much lower on a declining scale.

I think you also have to look at the total number of printed comics, because that takes revenue into the equation. And look at the print runs post-unity, do you want a publisher making a few different covers or sky-high print runs flooding everything!

[Heath]

How about as many copies as they can sell of ONE cover? What's so wrong with that?

[Tim]

Not aimed at anyone....

How is wanting something but not wanting to have to pay for it, and because you don't want to pay for it thinking
that it shouldn't be available to those who are ok with paying for it any different that people who want money but don't want to work for it, and because they don't want to work for it thinking it shouldn't be available to those who are ok working for it?

[greg]

Why do some chocolate candies cost $50/lb when you can get 1 lb of Hershey for about $2?
Aren't they all just going to get flushed down the toilet?

How much griping and complaining will it take to get them to stop making those expensive toilet-fillers?





(But seriously... what's the difference?)

[BugsySig]

Not aimed at anyone....

How is wanting something but not wanting to have to pay for it, and because you don't want to pay for it thinking
that it shouldn't be available to those who are ok with paying for it any different that people who want money but don't want to work for it, and because they don't want to work for it thinking it shouldn't be available to those who are ok working for it?

This is too confusing. I don't want to read it because it will take too much effort to do so. I insist you remove this post so no one else will have to expend the energy reading it even if they want to. Or at least simplify it so I can understand what you are saying without expending said energy.

[Zaphod]

Not aimed at anyone....

How is wanting something but not wanting to have to pay for it, and because you don't want to pay for it thinking
that it shouldn't be available to those who are ok with paying for it any different that people who want money but don't want to work for it, and because they don't want to work for it thinking it shouldn't be available to those who are ok working for it?

This is too confusing. I don't want to read it because it will take too much effort to do so. I insist you remove this post so no one else will have to expend the energy reading it even if they want to. Or at least simplify it so I can understand what you are saying without expending said energy.

99%er

[Tim]

That was a bit of a run-on sentence.

Ok..try it Plato's way.

Person One: "I don't want pay for variant covers. And because I don't want to pay for variant covers I don't even want people who are ok with paying for them to have them either. It's not fair."

Person Two: "I don't want work for nice things. And because I don't want to work for nice things I don't even want people who are ok with working for them to have them either. It's not fair."

What is the difference?

I don't generally buy variants and most of the time they're annoying, but I don't understand how they can offend people so personally. I buy them when they're cool. They're usually not, so I rarely buy them. If there's a 1000 variants I'll buy the ones I like enough to buy.

I think some people's frustration comes from being completists but being upset when there's more to complete than you're prepared to buy. Like saying.."I want to collect all comic books but I really wish they jerks would stop printing them so I wouldn't MAKE to spend all my money". At that point you need to ask yourself whether you're cut out to be a completist and if being one is best for you.

[FormerReader]

That was a bit of a run-on sentence.

Ok..try it Plato's way.

Person One: "I don't want pay for variant covers. And because I don't want to pay for variant covers I don't even want people who are ok with paying for them to have them either. It's not fair."

Person Two: "I don't want work for nice things. And because I don't want to work for nice things I don't even want people who are ok with working for them to have them either. It's not fair."

What is the difference?

I don't generally buy variants and most of the time they're annoying, but I don't understand how they can offend people so personally. I buy them when they're cool. They're usually not, so I rarely buy them. If there's a 1000 variants I'll buy the ones I like enough to buy.

I think some people's frustration comes from being completists but being upset when there's more to complete than you're prepared to buy. Like saying.."I want to collect all comic books but I really wish they jerks would stop printing them so I wouldn't MAKE to spend all my money". At that point you need to ask yourself whether you're cut out to be a completist and if being one is best for you.

[BugsySig]

That was a bit of a run-on sentence.

Ok..try it Plato's way.

Person One: "I don't want pay for variant covers. And because I don't want to pay for variant covers I don't even want people who are ok with paying for them to have them either. It's not fair."

Person Two: "I don't want work for nice things. And because I don't want to work for nice things I don't even want people who are ok with working for them to have them either. It's not fair."

What is the difference?

I don't generally buy variants and most of the time they're annoying, but I don't understand how they can offend people so personally. I buy them when they're cool. They're usually not, so I rarely buy them. If there's a 1000 variants I'll buy the ones I like enough to buy.

I think some people's frustration comes from being completists but being upset when there's more to complete than you're prepared to buy. Like saying.."I want to collect all comic books but I really wish they jerks would stop printing them so I wouldn't MAKE to spend all my money". At that point you need to ask yourself whether you're cut out to be a completist and if being one is best for you.

Instead of deleting or simplifying, you made your explanation longer! But I will read it any way because I read every post on this board, even though I don't like it.

[greg]

Instead of deleting or simplifying, you made your explanation longer! But I will read it any way because I read every post on this board, even though I don't like it.

Translation:

"I want collecting to be easy!"
"I want collecting to be cheap!"

It's neither, get over it.

[Aram]

That was a bit of a run-on sentence.

Ok..try it Plato's way.

Person One: "I don't want pay for variant covers. And because I don't want to pay for variant covers I don't even want people who are ok with paying for them to have them either. It's not fair."

Person Two: "I don't want work for nice things. And because I don't want to work for nice things I don't even want people who are ok with working for them to have them either. It's not fair."

What is the difference?

I don't generally buy variants and most of the time they're annoying, but I don't understand how they can offend people so personally. I buy them when they're cool. They're usually not, so I rarely buy them. If there's a 1000 variants I'll buy the ones I like enough to buy.

I think some people's frustration comes from being completists but being upset when there's more to complete than you're prepared to buy. Like saying.."I want to collect all comic books but I really wish they jerks would stop printing them so I wouldn't MAKE to spend all my money". At that point you need to ask yourself whether you're cut out to be a completist and if being one is best for you.

Dude your right! Someone should go tell all the smokers that maybe they're not cut out to be smokers and maybe it's not the best for them! Maybe then they will stop complaining about all the regulations and taxes imposed on them!

[Heath]

I think that's what's called a "straw man" argument. But, anyway, for me it's none of that. It's not about not wanting to pay for the variants. It's not about wanting the variants and not being able to get them. It's not about wanting to keep other people from getting the variants. It's not about wanting things to be cheap and easy. It's not about ME at all.

It's about having experienced first hand the market exploding and imploding due to speculation and gimmicks. It's about wanting Valiant to have LONG term growth and success instead of short-lived success and leaving speculators unsatisfied and retailers with boxes of books they can't sell. It's about wanting to honor the original Valiant that innovated with great stories, not gimmicks like variant covers. It's about not wanting to learn from history and repeat the success and avoid the epic failure that was caused by gimmicks. It's about my LOVE for Valiant.

The reasons you listed and argued against are all selfish reasons. But, they're not my reasons for disliking and speaking out against the unending flow of variants.

[tevans333]

I think that's what's called a "straw man" argument. But, anyway, for me it's none of that. It's not about not wanting to pay for the variants. It's not about wanting the variants and not being able to get them. It's not about wanting to keep other people from getting the variants. It's not about wanting things to be cheap and easy. It's not about ME at all.

It's about having experienced first hand the market exploding and imploding due to speculation and gimmicks. It's about wanting Valiant to have LONG term growth and success instead of short-lived success and leaving speculators unsatisfied and retailers with boxes of books they can't sell. It's about wanting to honor the original Valiant that innovated with great stories, not gimmicks like variant covers. It's about not wanting to learn from history and repeat the success and avoid the epic failure that was caused by gimmicks. It's about my LOVE for Valiant.

The reasons you listed and argued against are all selfish reasons. But, they're not my reasons for disliking and speaking out against the unending flow of variants.

+1

I couldn't care less about the variants except for the potential to hurt VEI in the long run.