CGC ?'s

DawgPhan · Post by **DawgPhan** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 11:00:25 am

http://boards.collectors-society.com/sh ... &vc=1&nt=4

Anyone else this?

Lots of stuff flying around about this book. Why on earth would you mess around with a 9.0 FF3? It just doenst make sense..I guess greed, but still. It is a shame that greed might have ruined this book.

Schmakt · Post by **Schmakt** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 11:05:36 am

that is weird... dumb question, but is the 8.5 the newer grade on the book? Or the other way around? They took a true 8.5 and cleaned the staples, thus getting a qualified 9.0...

DawgPhan · Post by **DawgPhan** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 11:14:10 am

Schmakt wrote:that is weird... dumb question, but is the 8.5 the newer grade on the book? Or the other way around? They took a true 8.5 and cleaned the staples, thus getting a qualified 9.0...

The 8.5 is the current grade on the book. It seems to have started as 9.0 Blue label. It was resubbed hoping for a 9.2 and came back a 9.0 with cleaned staples. It has now reportedly been pressed and trimmed and come back an 8.5 blue label. It may have been submitted in a batch of books that contained several other trimmed comics.

Could be that all of the books in that submission were all resubs and all have had work done, by CGC's old resto expert. Must be nice to have work done to books by CGC's top guy. Knowing that his leaving leaves slightly worse at detecting resto and knowing exactly what they cant detect without having scans from the boko before the work was done.

What sucks is that the current owner of the book appears to be a great buy with some great books and is drug into this mess by folks who long had been thought to do this type of work...Why mess with a 9.0 FF3? That just doesnt make sense...and about the cleaned staples...how did cgc either miss it twice or incorrectly see it once?

Schmakt · Post by **Schmakt** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 11:38:24 am

definitely seems weird to screw around with a 9.0 that's that old. Would the bump to NM- really increase the value that much? It still wouldn't have been the highest graded copy and only tied for second highest...

really weird. :-/

DawgPhan · Post by **DawgPhan** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 11:42:37 am

Schmakt wrote:definitely seems weird to screw around with a 9.0 that's that old. Would the bump to NM- really increase the value that much? It still wouldn't have been the highest graded copy and only tied for second highest...

really weird. :-/

As I understand it FF3 is hard to find in HG so yes the bump from 9.0 to 9.2 would have probably meant several thousand dollars.

magnusr · Post by **magnusr** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 12:03:52 pm

DawgPhan wrote:http://boards.collectors-society.com/sh ... &vc=1&nt=4

Anyone else this?

Lots of stuff flying around about this book. Why on earth would you mess around with a 9.0 FF3? It just doenst make sense..I guess greed, but still. It is a shame that greed might have ruined this book.

That's a very scary thread. In many ways. CGC misses (well, we knew that and they admit it themself), deliberate trimming, messing around with nice books, a dealer going ballistic when he's helped, the risk that lots of books in that submission were altered, and so on.

Sad to see.

/Magnus

Peter Parker · Post by **Peter Parker** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 12:17:31 pm

Actually, I don't think it's the same book

VERY similar in various specifics, but I personally believe they are two different copies.

DawgPhan · Post by **DawgPhan** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 12:25:01 pm

Peter Parker wrote:Actually, I don't think it's the same book

VERY similar in various specifics, but I personally believe they are two different copies.

Just the man that I was hoping to hear from..I will have to go back and look at the scans again, but I think everyone is agreeing that they are the same books...and I think that someone has traced the book back several buyers..

DawgPhan · Post by **DawgPhan** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 12:28:57 pm

magnusr wrote:
DawgPhan wrote:http://boards.collectors-society.com/sh ... &vc=1&nt=4

Anyone else this?

Lots of stuff flying around about this book. Why on earth would you mess around with a 9.0 FF3? It just doenst make sense..I guess greed, but still. It is a shame that greed might have ruined this book.
That's a very scary thread. In many ways. CGC misses (well, we knew that and they admit it themself), deliberate trimming, messing around with nice books, a dealer going ballistic when he's helped, the risk that lots of books in that submission were altered, and so on.

Sad to see.

/Magnus

Yeah the cgc board is always very interesting... I was surprised by BurntBoys reaction considering that he got his name by getting ripped off by Comic-keys back in the day. He has a really nice collection of comics that he has owned since he bought them off the shelf. I am curious as to why PP doesnt think that they are the same book though.

X-O HoboJoe · Post by **X-O HoboJoe** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 2:02:55 pm

I'd like to see a bigger, higher res-scan of the Blue-Label. I see things that make me think "same-book" but I still have some doubt. Wonder what Nick Cage has been up to?

DawgPhan · Post by **DawgPhan** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 2:27:14 pm

X-O HoboJoe wrote:I'd like to see a bigger, higher res-scan of the Blue-Label. I see things that make me think "same-book" but I still have some doubt. Wonder what Nick Cage has been up to?

I doubt that you will be seeing anymore high res scans of the 8.5 book. But I think that they have traced the ownership of the book back several owners and they probably know exactly who did the work, or atleast can infere who did the work, by the cgc labels. I would be very cautious of buying any books from Jason Ewert...He was always thought to be pressing his books and now it would appear that he is trimming them. Which really sucks because he always has great books that normally demand a premium.

Peter Parker · Post by **Peter Parker** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 4:10:25 pm

Actually Dawg, after reading the entire thread

and talking to SB today, I believe it IS the same book.

It happens, Doug Schmell owned this book, that is good enough for me

but it happens, these are human beings doing comic book grading for goodness sakes

If someday for example, CGC ends up grading a million comic books, would anyone here have a real problem with say...1% of them having some king of "quality issue" regarding grading

I would not. For those of you that would i say... such standards are simply unrealistic

ps

dead on with Ewert...the guy smells, and always has books that look way too good to be true

X-O HoboJoe · Post by **X-O HoboJoe** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 5:50:51 pm

DawgPhan wrote:
X-O HoboJoe wrote:I'd like to see a bigger, higher res-scan of the Blue-Label. I see things that make me think "same-book" but I still have some doubt. Wonder what Nick Cage has been up to?
I doubt that you will be seeing anymore high res scans of the 8.5 book. But I think that they have traced the ownership of the book back several owners and they probably know exactly who did the work, or atleast can infere who did the work, by the cgc labels. I would be very cautious of buying any books from Jason Ewert...He was always thought to be pressing his books and now it would appear that he is trimming them. Which really sucks because he always has great books that normally demand a premium.

I've never gotten a book from Ewert, his stuff always goes waaaay more than I'm willing to pay. I've not done any research on him as a seller so the "head's-up" is appreciated.

ckb · Post by **ckb** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 7:09:08 pm

I don't think there's any question about the FF3. The FF10, though, I'm not convinced. Not that I need to be.

Someone has something seriously high-tech doing trimming. I don't know if it's Ewert or whomever, but that trim was not done with a papercutter.

Someone has serious BALLS as well playing around with gems like that. I mean, come on, give it a break. It's in the top 0.1% of all graded books printed that year, and you need to make it better? Someone has goofy $$ for eyeballs.

Peter Parker · Post by **Peter Parker** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 7:27:58 pm

ckb wrote:I don't think there's any question about the FF3. The FF10, though, I'm not convinced. Not that I need to be.

Someone has something seriously high-tech doing trimming. I don't know if it's Ewert or whomever, but that trim was not done with a papercutter.

Someone has serious BALLS as well playing around with gems like that. I mean, come on, give it a break. It's in the top 0.1% of all graded books printed that year, and you need to make it better? Someone has goofy $$ for eyeballs.

Yep

and we "CGC crowd" pretty much should know who the "perps" are by now

DawgPhan · Post by **DawgPhan** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 7:56:49 pm

Peter Parker wrote:Actually Dawg, after reading the entire thread and talking to SB today, I believe it IS the same book.

It happens, Doug Schmell owned this book, that is good enough for me but it happens, these are human beings doing comic book grading for goodness sakes

If CGC someday ends up graded a million comic books, would anyone have a reral problem with say...1% of them having some king of "quality issue" regarding grading I would not, and such standards are simply unrealistic

ps

dead on with Ewert...the guy smells, and always has books that look way too good to be true

Yeah I dont think that the problem is with cgc. They are going to make mistakes and I also think that their are people working to defeat their resto checks. I think that the problem is with the folks that are doing this to books..Just like the Batman 11 that was trimmed and aged...How dare you destroy such a book..Really sad to see books that made it all the way to 2005 in damn near mint condition get razored for some quick green. Hell that FF3 had been around 40 years as a 9.0 and someone ruins it by trimming it...sucks..Hell people might start buying cgc books to preserve them, but not from the elements and conditions, but from guys like Jason.

DawgPhan · Post by **DawgPhan** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 8:01:13 pm

And this is something else that makes me wonder about the folks on this board sometimes. Here we have something major coming to light, atleast it would appear that way, and basically we get the BSDs with cgc, on this board atleast, commenting while the several 1 word threads dont go a few hours without a couple of new posts. Hell I dont have a single CGC book in my collection, but I like to atleast keep up with it...there is some crazy stuff going on with those books right now.

Peter Parker · Post by **Peter Parker** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 8:11:03 pm

DawgPhan wrote:And this is something else that makes me wonder about the folks on this board sometimes. Here we have something major coming to light, atleast it would appear that way, and basically we get the BSDs with cgc, on this board atleast, commenting while the several 1 word threads dont go a few hours without a couple of new posts. Hell I dont have a single CGC book in my collection, but I like to atleast keep up with it...there is some crazy stuff going on with those books right now.

I'd be happy to talk CGC graded material with you all night long Dawgie

Just PM me my man

Schmakt · Post by **Schmakt** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 8:34:54 pm

I'm just going to stick to buying most or all of my CGC's from ckb, so I feel pretty safe.

DawgPhan · Post by **DawgPhan** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 8:55:40 pm

Schmakt wrote:I'm just going to stick to buying most or all of my CGC's from ckb, so I feel pretty safe.

good plan...

400yrs · Post by **400yrs** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 9:05:05 pm

I'd spend alot more time on the CGC boards if the pages didn't load so damn slow. And yeah, I do have a fast computer.

DawgPhan · Post by **DawgPhan** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 10:01:44 pm

400yrs wrote:I'd spend alot more time on the CGC boards if the pages didn't load so damn slow. And yeah, I do have a fast computer.

Hell I cant even get it to come up right now...but yes their pages are slow all the time...

400yrs · Post by **400yrs** » Mon Aug 22, 2005 10:56:41 pm

DawgPhan wrote:
400yrs wrote:I'd spend alot more time on the CGC boards if the pages didn't load so damn slow. And yeah, I do have a fast computer.
Hell I cant even get it to come up right now...but yes their pages are slow all the time...

I guess it's all the scans. Whatever it is, it sucks. The site can be good for info, but there is nothing more frustrating than sitting there waiting for a page to load.

myron · Post by **myron** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 8:09:22 am

400yrs wrote:I'd spend alot more time on the CGC boards if the pages didn't load so damn slow. And yeah, I do have a fast computer.

that and the pages upon pages of drivel that comes up every other topic...I spend time there from September through May but don't visit during the summer...

DawgPhan · Post by **DawgPhan** » Tue Aug 23, 2005 8:46:51 am

myron wrote:
400yrs wrote:I'd spend alot more time on the CGC boards if the pages didn't load so damn slow. And yeah, I do have a fast computer.
that and the pages upon pages of drivel that comes up every other topic...I spend time there from September through May but don't visit during the summer...

Yeah are a lot of personal wars on that board...and lots of people making grand announcements about their leaving only to come back in a few weeks/months...still lots of good information and pictures of books that I will probably never get to see otherwise..

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