Yet another Alien rumor

[syzhang28]

Is the argument that because Valiant Entertainment is now licensing out their comic book production to Alien Books that they're no longer owned by DMG?

Or that the people who run DMG are no longer involved with anything to do with Valiant Entertainment?

Neither of those sound true to me, correct me if I'm wrong.

No, the argument would be that VALIANT Entertainment is subservient to DMG, and not responsible for all the decisions that their parent company makes.

From what I've read people say on Facebook, the Kickstarter was DMG's idea, not VALIANT Entertainment's. So why would the latter be responsible for the former's failure?

It's sort of like blaming Acclaim Comics for Acclaim Entertainment's failure to deliver the Bloodshot and HARD Corps video games back in the day.

I'm genuinely confused. So has the last 5 years been DMG making decisions or Valiant Entertainment? When did it change?

Notice who created the campaign...
Untitled.png

Yeah he owns Valiant. So he's no longer involved?

I'm not saying that at all. I'm pointint out that just because DMG decided to launch a KS that doesn't make VALIANT responsible for it.

Mintz clearly still owns it, but that doesn't make him responsible for every single decision that takes place there, anymore that Acclaim was responsible for VH 2. That was entirely Nicieza's idea.

Both responsible. If Acclaim didn't like the idea they should have vetoed it. If they wanted to support their employee but the project failed then fire him and fix it. The head is responsible for what the hand does but the hand is not innocent.

[ManofTheAtom]

Likely those named as staff in the editorial page at the end of each issue.

They're employees. Are the employees making decisions that are separate from the employers now?

Daniel Mintz is also in the credits of the Valiant comics. Right at the top. Where Dinesh and Peter Cuneo used to be. That's an indicator that he makes decisions. All employees have a choice to follow orders from their boss or not. If they choose not to they are fired or they leave. People leave companies all the time because the company starts making morally bad decisions. Also, if you don't agree say that. Or at least provide some answer while you're on a fan message board posting about other things. When you start to ignore those questions but promote the new comic coming out next month you're a tool of the bad decisions like taking money and not delivering the kickstarter whether you want to admit it or not.

You think Mintz is deciding which comic books to publish and who to hire to make them?

You think he sits in at the editorial meetings to decide what the next X-O Manowar or Ninjak series will be?

Of course not. That's what everyone else listed on that page does.

[syzhang28]

Likely those named as staff in the editorial page at the end of each issue.

They're employees. Are the employees making decisions that are separate from the employers now?

Those employees make decisions for the comic book division, such as who to hire and what comics to publish.

That doesn't mean DMG can't come in and decide to launch an Eternal Warrior KS, with or without their support or approval since it owns VALIANT.

It may have been a graphic novel, but that doesn't make it different from Acclaim turning Turok into a video game.

Games are different. If DMG decides to do a theme park in China based on Valiant and one of the rides kills someone then its not Valiants fault its DMG and the theme park creators but this is comics. The same way the theme park creators are responsible Valiant is responsible for what they do even if they are made to do it. If you don't like it then leave. At the very, very, very least don't pretend its not happening.

[ManofTheAtom]

No, the argument would be that VALIANT Entertainment is subservient to DMG, and not responsible for all the decisions that their parent company makes.

From what I've read people say on Facebook, the Kickstarter was DMG's idea, not VALIANT Entertainment's. So why would the latter be responsible for the former's failure?

It's sort of like blaming Acclaim Comics for Acclaim Entertainment's failure to deliver the Bloodshot and HARD Corps video games back in the day.

I'm genuinely confused. So has the last 5 years been DMG making decisions or Valiant Entertainment? When did it change?

Notice who created the campaign...
Untitled.png

Yeah he owns Valiant. So he's no longer involved?

I'm not saying that at all. I'm pointint out that just because DMG decided to launch a KS that doesn't make VALIANT responsible for it.

Mintz clearly still owns it, but that doesn't make him responsible for every single decision that takes place there, anymore that Acclaim was responsible for VH 2. That was entirely Nicieza's idea.

Both responsible. If Acclaim didn't like the idea they should have vetoed it. If they wanted to support their employee but the project failed then fire him and fix it. The head is responsible for what the hand does but the hand is not innocent.

If the hand had nothing to do with it, how they are not innocent? Guilt by association is not a thing.

[ManofTheAtom]

Likely those named as staff in the editorial page at the end of each issue.

They're employees. Are the employees making decisions that are separate from the employers now?

Those employees make decisions for the comic book division, such as who to hire and what comics to publish.

That doesn't mean DMG can't come in and decide to launch an Eternal Warrior KS, with or without their support or approval since it owns VALIANT.

It may have been a graphic novel, but that doesn't make it different from Acclaim turning Turok into a video game.

Games are different. If DMG decides to do a theme park in China based on Valiant and one of the rides kills someone then its not Valiants fault its DMG and the theme park creators but this is comics. The same way the theme park creators are responsible Valiant is responsible for what they do even if they are made to do it. If you don't like it then leave. At the very, very, very least don't pretend its not happening.

There is no difference, actually. It's product, nothing more and nothing less.

DMG can, by its lonesome, decide to KS an Eternal Warrior comic and not involve VALIANT at all.

I'll peruse that page when I can because now I'm curious who from VALIANT, if anyone, is actually listed on it.

Like, who oversaw the project? Who edited it? Who hired the team? etc.

Was it anyone from VALIANT proper, or did DMG bring outsiders?

[syzhang28]

Likely those named as staff in the editorial page at the end of each issue.

They're employees. Are the employees making decisions that are separate from the employers now?

Daniel Mintz is also in the credits of the Valiant comics. Right at the top. Where Dinesh and Peter Cuneo used to be. That's an indicator that he makes decisions. All employees have a choice to follow orders from their boss or not. If they choose not to they are fired or they leave. People leave companies all the time because the company starts making morally bad decisions. Also, if you don't agree say that. Or at least provide some answer while you're on a fan message board posting about other things. When you start to ignore those questions but promote the new comic coming out next month you're a tool of the bad decisions like taking money and not delivering the kickstarter whether you want to admit it or not.

You think Mintz is deciding which comic books to publish and who to hire to make them?

You think he sits in at the editorial meetings to decide what the next X-O Manowar or Ninjak series will be?

Of course not. That's what everyone else listed on that page does.

It doesn't matter. He either sits in the meetings and decides or he tantamount signs off by hand picking, hiring, trusting the people that do and then not coming in and making changes if its not working. But from what we've heard he does, at least some times, indeed decide. A boss is responsible for the actions of the company they run.

What you're saying could be extrapolated to "the publisher isn't responsible for what the editor does", "the editor isn't responsible for what the writer does", "the writer isn't responsible for what the artist does" etc etc etc. There is a boss and they are responsible for success or failure no matter how hands on. Some of the best leaders in the world know when to be very hands on and when to be very hands off, and they get credit for that when it works...and blame when it fails.

[syzhang28]

I'm genuinely confused. So has the last 5 years been DMG making decisions or Valiant Entertainment? When did it change?

Notice who created the campaign...
Untitled.png

Yeah he owns Valiant. So he's no longer involved?

I'm not saying that at all. I'm pointint out that just because DMG decided to launch a KS that doesn't make VALIANT responsible for it.

Mintz clearly still owns it, but that doesn't make him responsible for every single decision that takes place there, anymore that Acclaim was responsible for VH 2. That was entirely Nicieza's idea.

Both responsible. If Acclaim didn't like the idea they should have vetoed it. If they wanted to support their employee but the project failed then fire him and fix it. The head is responsible for what the hand does but the hand is not innocent.

If the hand had nothing to do with it, how they are not innocent? Guilt by association is not a thing.

Because the hand isn't associated to the head. It's the same person. The person is guilty. All the way from the head to the hand and further, to the little toe etc. DMG and Valiant are the same company. DMG owns Valiant. If pixar puts out an offensive movie, you bet Iger is out there apologizing and making sure it doesn't happen again.

[Ryan]

There is no difference, actually. It's product, nothing more and nothing less.

DMG can, by its lonesome, decide to KS an Eternal Warrior comic and not involve VALIANT at all.

I'll peruse that page when I can because now I'm curious who from VALIANT, if anyone, is actually listed on it.

Like, who oversaw the project? Who edited it? Who hired the team? etc.

Was it anyone from VALIANT proper, or did DMG bring outsiders?

Everyone at Valiant was hired by DMG, right?

You're saying that Valiant and DMG should be treated as entirely separate entities. We can agree to disagree on that point.

Even if that's true, that Valiant Entertainment is now a separate entity from DMG, I think the new Valiant should still try to make amends for the recent past where DMG has cheated the fans. Even if they personally had nothing to do with it.

[ManofTheAtom]

Likely those named as staff in the editorial page at the end of each issue.

They're employees. Are the employees making decisions that are separate from the employers now?

Daniel Mintz is also in the credits of the Valiant comics. Right at the top. Where Dinesh and Peter Cuneo used to be. That's an indicator that he makes decisions. All employees have a choice to follow orders from their boss or not. If they choose not to they are fired or they leave. People leave companies all the time because the company starts making morally bad decisions. Also, if you don't agree say that. Or at least provide some answer while you're on a fan message board posting about other things. When you start to ignore those questions but promote the new comic coming out next month you're a tool of the bad decisions like taking money and not delivering the kickstarter whether you want to admit it or not.

You think Mintz is deciding which comic books to publish and who to hire to make them?

You think he sits in at the editorial meetings to decide what the next X-O Manowar or Ninjak series will be?

Of course not. That's what everyone else listed on that page does.

It doesn't matter. He either sits in the meetings and decides or he tantamount signs off by hand picking, hiring, trusting the people that do and then not coming in and making changes if its not working. But from what we've heard he does, at least some times, indeed decide. A boss is responsible for the actions of the company they run.

What you're saying could be extrapolated to "the publisher isn't responsible for what the editor does", "the editor isn't responsible for what the writer does", "the writer isn't responsible for what the artist does" etc etc etc. There is a boss and they are responsible for success or failure no matter how hands on. Some of the best leaders in the world know when to be very hands on and when to be very hands off, and they get credit for that when it works...and blame when it fails.

But that's not what I'm saying.

Once upon a time, General Electric owned NBC.

NBC was no more responsible for the quality of the microwaves GE made than GE was responsible for the quality of the shows NBC put on.

You're trying to make NBC responsible for GE making a shoddy microwave.

[ManofTheAtom]

There is no difference, actually. It's product, nothing more and nothing less.

DMG can, by its lonesome, decide to KS an Eternal Warrior comic and not involve VALIANT at all.

I'll peruse that page when I can because now I'm curious who from VALIANT, if anyone, is actually listed on it.

Like, who oversaw the project? Who edited it? Who hired the team? etc.

Was it anyone from VALIANT proper, or did DMG bring outsiders?

Everyone at Valiant was hired by DMG, right?

You're saying that Valiant and DMG should be treated as entirely separate entities. We can agree to disagree on that point.

Even if that's true, that Valiant Entertainment is now a separate entity from DMG, I think the new Valiant should still try to make amends for the recent past where DMG has cheated the fans. Even if they personally had nothing to do with it.

Of course they're separate. DMG does other things that don't involve VALIANT too.

In this instance, DMG chose to make a graphic novel with, it seems, no involvement from VALIANT.

[ManofTheAtom]

Notice who created the campaign...
Untitled.png

Yeah he owns Valiant. So he's no longer involved?

I'm not saying that at all. I'm pointint out that just because DMG decided to launch a KS that doesn't make VALIANT responsible for it.

Mintz clearly still owns it, but that doesn't make him responsible for every single decision that takes place there, anymore that Acclaim was responsible for VH 2. That was entirely Nicieza's idea.

Both responsible. If Acclaim didn't like the idea they should have vetoed it. If they wanted to support their employee but the project failed then fire him and fix it. The head is responsible for what the hand does but the hand is not innocent.

If the hand had nothing to do with it, how they are not innocent? Guilt by association is not a thing.

Because the hand isn't associated to the head. It's the same person. The person is guilty. All the way from the head to the hand and further, to the little toe etc. DMG and Valiant are the same company. DMG owns Valiant. If pixar puts out an offensive movie, you bet Iger is out there apologizing and making sure it doesn't happen again.

DMG and VALIANT are not the same company, though.

[ManofTheAtom]

Based on the logic at play here, if I like a Marvel TV series I have to credit Feige and Marvel Studios for it even though they had nothing to do with it.

Likewise, if I hate a Marvel movie, I have to blame Loeb and Marvel Television for it even though they had nothing to do with it either.

That logic does not track and makes no sense.

[syzhang28]

Based on the logic at play here, if I like a Marvel TV series I have to credit Feige and Marvel Studios for it even though they had nothing to do with it.

Likewise, if I hate a Marvel movie, I have to blame Loeb and Marvel Television for it even though they had nothing to do with it either.

That logic does not track and makes no sense.

The opposite. Disney gets credit or blame. The head. You're thinking bottom up. Think top down.

[syzhang28]

There is no difference, actually. It's product, nothing more and nothing less.

DMG can, by its lonesome, decide to KS an Eternal Warrior comic and not involve VALIANT at all.

I'll peruse that page when I can because now I'm curious who from VALIANT, if anyone, is actually listed on it.

Like, who oversaw the project? Who edited it? Who hired the team? etc.

Was it anyone from VALIANT proper, or did DMG bring outsiders?

Everyone at Valiant was hired by DMG, right?

You're saying that Valiant and DMG should be treated as entirely separate entities. We can agree to disagree on that point.

Even if that's true, that Valiant Entertainment is now a separate entity from DMG, I think the new Valiant should still try to make amends for the recent past where DMG has cheated the fans. Even if they personally had nothing to do with it.

Of course they're separate. DMG does other things that don't involve VALIANT too.

In this instance, DMG chose to make a graphic novel with, it seems, no involvement from VALIANT.

It's not a DMG product. It's Valiant. Its a comic. Its Valiant characters. Its Valiant staffers. Its Valiant brand out in front. Its Valiant promotion. Its Valiant employees being quoted in press releases. Its Iger saying make a Shang Chi movie. If it sucks or if they sell tickets and never put the movie out and then don't refund that's both Marvel Studios and Disney at fault

[ManofTheAtom]

Based on the logic at play here, if I like a Marvel TV series I have to credit Feige and Marvel Studios for it even though they had nothing to do with it.

Likewise, if I hate a Marvel movie, I have to blame Loeb and Marvel Television for it even though they had nothing to do with it either.

That logic does not track and makes no sense.

The opposite. Disney gets credit or blame. The head. You're thinking bottom up. Think top down.

But, they wouldn't, no.

Marvel Television and Marvel Studios operate as independently from Disney as they do from each other.

You think the top people at Disney micromanage Feige? Or Filoni with Star Wars?

[ManofTheAtom]

There is no difference, actually. It's product, nothing more and nothing less.

DMG can, by its lonesome, decide to KS an Eternal Warrior comic and not involve VALIANT at all.

I'll peruse that page when I can because now I'm curious who from VALIANT, if anyone, is actually listed on it.

Like, who oversaw the project? Who edited it? Who hired the team? etc.

Was it anyone from VALIANT proper, or did DMG bring outsiders?

Everyone at Valiant was hired by DMG, right?

You're saying that Valiant and DMG should be treated as entirely separate entities. We can agree to disagree on that point.

Even if that's true, that Valiant Entertainment is now a separate entity from DMG, I think the new Valiant should still try to make amends for the recent past where DMG has cheated the fans. Even if they personally had nothing to do with it.

Of course they're separate. DMG does other things that don't involve VALIANT too.

In this instance, DMG chose to make a graphic novel with, it seems, no involvement from VALIANT.

It's not a DMG product. It's Valiant. Its a comic. Its Valiant characters. Its Valiant staffers. Its Valiant brand out in front. Its Valiant promotion. Its Valiant employees being quoted in press releases. Its Iger saying make a Shang Chi movie. If it sucks or if they sell tickets and never put the movie out and then don't refund that's both Marvel Studios and Disney at fault

Can you prove it was VALIANT staffers? I didn't see any named in the KS page. Do any appear listed in the digital version?

Link to the press releases, please. I didn't see those.

The bottom of the KS page lists BacketKit as the one that promoted it.

Which staffers from VALIANT oversaw this project?

[syzhang28]

Based on the logic at play here, if I like a Marvel TV series I have to credit Feige and Marvel Studios for it even though they had nothing to do with it.

Likewise, if I hate a Marvel movie, I have to blame Loeb and Marvel Television for it even though they had nothing to do with it either.

That logic does not track and makes no sense.

The opposite. Disney gets credit or blame. The head. You're thinking bottom up. Think top down.

But, they wouldn't, no.

Marvel Television and Marvel Studios operate as independently from Disney as they do from each other.

You think the top people at Disney micromanage Feige? Or Filoni with Star Wars?

Some do micromanage, some oversee, all are responsible for their output. All managers, all bosses have, as part of their job, the responsibility to oversee and be responsible for work under them. Especially people at the very top. If that's not something you understand than more power to you, I'd like to like in that simpler world. And, we'll agree to disagree.

[syzhang28]

There is no difference, actually. It's product, nothing more and nothing less.

DMG can, by its lonesome, decide to KS an Eternal Warrior comic and not involve VALIANT at all.

I'll peruse that page when I can because now I'm curious who from VALIANT, if anyone, is actually listed on it.

Like, who oversaw the project? Who edited it? Who hired the team? etc.

Was it anyone from VALIANT proper, or did DMG bring outsiders?

Everyone at Valiant was hired by DMG, right?

You're saying that Valiant and DMG should be treated as entirely separate entities. We can agree to disagree on that point.

Even if that's true, that Valiant Entertainment is now a separate entity from DMG, I think the new Valiant should still try to make amends for the recent past where DMG has cheated the fans. Even if they personally had nothing to do with it.

Of course they're separate. DMG does other things that don't involve VALIANT too.

In this instance, DMG chose to make a graphic novel with, it seems, no involvement from VALIANT.

It's not a DMG product. It's Valiant. Its a comic. Its Valiant characters. Its Valiant staffers. Its Valiant brand out in front. Its Valiant promotion. Its Valiant employees being quoted in press releases. Its Iger saying make a Shang Chi movie. If it sucks or if they sell tickets and never put the movie out and then don't refund that's both Marvel Studios and Disney at fault

Can you prove it was VALIANT staffers? I didn't see any named in the KS page. Do any appear listed in the digital version?

Link to the press releases, please. I didn't see those.

The bottom of the KS page lists BacketKit as the one that promoted it.

Which staffers from VALIANT oversaw this project?

Come on man, it's a simple google search. You can do it. I believe in you.

[ManofTheAtom]

Based on the logic at play here, if I like a Marvel TV series I have to credit Feige and Marvel Studios for it even though they had nothing to do with it.

Likewise, if I hate a Marvel movie, I have to blame Loeb and Marvel Television for it even though they had nothing to do with it either.

That logic does not track and makes no sense.

The opposite. Disney gets credit or blame. The head. You're thinking bottom up. Think top down.

But, they wouldn't, no.

Marvel Television and Marvel Studios operate as independently from Disney as they do from each other.

You think the top people at Disney micromanage Feige? Or Filoni with Star Wars?

Some do micromanage, some oversee, all are responsible for their output. All managers, all bosses have, as part of their job, the responsibility to oversee and be responsible for work under them. Especially people at the very top. If that's not something you understand than more power to you, I'd like to like in that simpler world. And, we'll agree to disagree.

Yeah, it's not that I don't understand it, it's just that the scenario you're proposing in which, for instance, Eiger sits in with all the people that oversee each and every studio and tells them what to do is just out there.

Same goes for this idea you have of DMG telling VALIANT who to hire and what comics to publish, as if Mintz had the kind of knowledge necessary to handle such a thing.

[ManofTheAtom]

There is no difference, actually. It's product, nothing more and nothing less.

DMG can, by its lonesome, decide to KS an Eternal Warrior comic and not involve VALIANT at all.

I'll peruse that page when I can because now I'm curious who from VALIANT, if anyone, is actually listed on it.

Like, who oversaw the project? Who edited it? Who hired the team? etc.

Was it anyone from VALIANT proper, or did DMG bring outsiders?

Everyone at Valiant was hired by DMG, right?

You're saying that Valiant and DMG should be treated as entirely separate entities. We can agree to disagree on that point.

Even if that's true, that Valiant Entertainment is now a separate entity from DMG, I think the new Valiant should still try to make amends for the recent past where DMG has cheated the fans. Even if they personally had nothing to do with it.

Of course they're separate. DMG does other things that don't involve VALIANT too.

In this instance, DMG chose to make a graphic novel with, it seems, no involvement from VALIANT.

It's not a DMG product. It's Valiant. Its a comic. Its Valiant characters. Its Valiant staffers. Its Valiant brand out in front. Its Valiant promotion. Its Valiant employees being quoted in press releases. Its Iger saying make a Shang Chi movie. If it sucks or if they sell tickets and never put the movie out and then don't refund that's both Marvel Studios and Disney at fault

Can you prove it was VALIANT staffers? I didn't see any named in the KS page. Do any appear listed in the digital version?

Link to the press releases, please. I didn't see those.

The bottom of the KS page lists BacketKit as the one that promoted it.

Which staffers from VALIANT oversaw this project?

Come on man, it's a simple google search. You can do it. I believe in you.

You should have that information at your fingertips.

[ManofTheAtom]

Your Shang-Chi example is ironic since it seems that DMG was integral in the Mandarin not showing up in Iron Man 3.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shang-Chi ... evelopment

[corey]

I have read these threads , and for the life of me I cannot figure out why anyone cares this much about rumors/info.

I mean honestly who cares? Why do you care so much to make it a big argument?

Why not just hope for the best(which i have been doing since dmg took over. )

Life will go on no matter who is right or wrong,

[ManofTheAtom]

I have read these threads , and for the life of me I cannot figure out why anyone cares this much about rumors/info.

I mean honestly who cares? Why do you care so much to make it a big argument?

Why not just hope for the best(which i have been doing since dmg took over. )

Life will go on no matter who is right or wrong,

Indeed.

[syzhang28]

Based on the logic at play here, if I like a Marvel TV series I have to credit Feige and Marvel Studios for it even though they had nothing to do with it.

Likewise, if I hate a Marvel movie, I have to blame Loeb and Marvel Television for it even though they had nothing to do with it either.

That logic does not track and makes no sense.

The opposite. Disney gets credit or blame. The head. You're thinking bottom up. Think top down.

But, they wouldn't, no.

Marvel Television and Marvel Studios operate as independently from Disney as they do from each other.

You think the top people at Disney micromanage Feige? Or Filoni with Star Wars?

Some do micromanage, some oversee, all are responsible for their output. All managers, all bosses have, as part of their job, the responsibility to oversee and be responsible for work under them. Especially people at the very top. If that's not something you understand than more power to you, I'd like to like in that simpler world. And, we'll agree to disagree.

Yeah, it's not that I don't understand it, it's just that the scenario you're proposing in which, for instance, Eiger sits in with all the people that oversee each and every studio and tells them what to do is just out there.

Same goes for this idea you have of DMG telling VALIANT who to hire and what comics to publish, as if Mintz had the kind of knowledge necessary to handle such a thing.

100% not what I'm proposing but I'm too tired to repeat what I am actually proposing for the 4th time.

[syzhang28]

Everyone at Valiant was hired by DMG, right?

You're saying that Valiant and DMG should be treated as entirely separate entities. We can agree to disagree on that point.

Even if that's true, that Valiant Entertainment is now a separate entity from DMG, I think the new Valiant should still try to make amends for the recent past where DMG has cheated the fans. Even if they personally had nothing to do with it.

Of course they're separate. DMG does other things that don't involve VALIANT too.

In this instance, DMG chose to make a graphic novel with, it seems, no involvement from VALIANT.

It's not a DMG product. It's Valiant. Its a comic. Its Valiant characters. Its Valiant staffers. Its Valiant brand out in front. Its Valiant promotion. Its Valiant employees being quoted in press releases. Its Iger saying make a Shang Chi movie. If it sucks or if they sell tickets and never put the movie out and then don't refund that's both Marvel Studios and Disney at fault

Can you prove it was VALIANT staffers? I didn't see any named in the KS page. Do any appear listed in the digital version?

Link to the press releases, please. I didn't see those.

The bottom of the KS page lists BacketKit as the one that promoted it.

Which staffers from VALIANT oversaw this project?

Come on man, it's a simple google search. You can do it. I believe in you.

You should have that information at your fingertips.

Why? It's not my failing. It's yours and yours alone. Like DMG you asked for it. And like Valiant I'm just following orders, not my fault that I didn't do a thing you wanted even though I should have. Right?