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PostPosted: Mon Apr 30, 2012 10:14 pm 
Mmm, I was drooling over Cooshie tonight.
Mmm, I was drooling over Cooshie tonight.
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Having just re-read it last night, I was wondering: What was to be gained by Rai #0?

We see the creation of Bloodshot and learn of his death at the hands of Ax.
We learn Archer and Flamingo married, and we learn of Archer's death.
We know when Shadowman dies and toward what cause.
We learn that Aram is never heard from again after Archer's death.
We know Pete Stanchek goes missing.
We watch Aric die, we know Aric posseses the armor into old age.
We learn how Harada can live indefinitely.
We see how Gayle dies.
We learn when Harada's forces are defeated.
We know how long the Hard Corps endured.
We see where the Blood of Heroes ends up.

Now, it's cool to tease fans with a future revealed. But doesn't it take a lot of the cliffhanger out of the characters and storylines? I think it really hamstrings future writers and editors.

Whaddya think? Was Rai #0 a clever reveal or did it in some way spoil the mystery?

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PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 6:12 am 
You gotta have Faith!
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This is a really good point. As a Valiant history enthusiast the issue is great for bridging the gap between the two time periods. But I can imagine how frustrating it must have been for the writers that the audience already knows what happens to the characters.

It would have been interesting to see if the writers and editors would have sticked with Rai #0 if the Valiant Universe had lasted.

Side note: Bob Hall did a great job writing a character who knew when he was going to die.

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PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 6:28 am 
I felt 'used car salesman' kind of dirty.
I felt 'used car salesman' kind of dirty.
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iwantvaliantcomics wrote:

Side note: Bob Hall did a great job writing a character who knew when he was going to die.


Truly one of the most important notes. Even with closure coming, the mystery becomes more of a "howdunnit" than a whodunnit.

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PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 8:13 am 
I do embrace my inner geekdom
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kevinbastos wrote:
iwantvaliantcomics wrote:

Side note: Bob Hall did a great job writing a character who knew when he was going to die.


Truly one of the most important notes. Even with closure coming, the mystery becomes more of a "howdunnit" than a whodunnit.

exactly...

and all the twists and turns that can take you along the way...

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PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 9:16 am 
You gotta have Faith!
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Yea, I don't think it would have hamstrung them too much if they didn't want it to. I heard somewhere that time was not absolute, so they could have written themselves out of it. It's a great epilogue to the pre-Unity era, and most of the events were so far in the future (other than Shadowman's death), that there was no pressure to get there anyway.

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PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 10:41 am 
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Sometimes, showing the ending of the story first, then going back and showing HOW everything got to that point is a very effective storytelling technique. Rai #0 certainly isn't the first example of that. And it doesn't hamstring good writers. Bob Hall was a great example.

No, I don't think Rai #0 spoiled anything. I think it added significant suspense and mystery to the Valiant universe and, to this day, is still a masterpiece.

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PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 11:07 am 
I felt 'used car salesman' kind of dirty.
I felt 'used car salesman' kind of dirty.
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dbngaa wrote:
Yea, I don't think it would have hamstrung them too much if they didn't want it to. I heard somewhere that time was not absolute, so they could have written themselves out of it. It's a great epilogue to the pre-Unity era, and most of the events were so far in the future (other than Shadowman's death), that there was no pressure to get there anyway.


Absolutely.

I also remember multiple occasions throughout the Shadowman run that Nettie referred to the future NOT being set in stone. Only a possibility.

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PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 11:09 am 
Clinkin' bottles with Aram
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PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 7:15 pm 
Clinkin' bottles with Aram
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jmatt wrote:
Having just re-read it last night, I was wondering: What was to be gained by Rai #0?

We see the creation of Bloodshot and learn of his death at the hands of Ax.
We learn Archer and Flamingo married, and we learn of Archer's death.
We know when Shadowman dies and toward what cause.
We learn that Aram is never heard from again after Archer's death.
We know Pete Stanchek goes missing.
We watch Aric die, we know Aric posseses the armor into old age.
We learn how Harada can live indefinitely.
We see how Gayle dies.
We learn when Harada's forces are defeated.
We know how long the Hard Corps endured.
We see where the Blood of Heroes ends up.

Now, it's cool to tease fans with a future revealed. But doesn't it take a lot of the cliffhanger out of the characters and storylines? I think it really hamstrings future writers and editors.

Whaddya think? Was Rai #0 a clever reveal or did it in some way spoil the mystery?


I think it was very brave. It made for a great story and made the characters more interesting.


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PostPosted: Tue May 01, 2012 10:49 pm 
Mmm, I was drooling over Cooshie tonight.
Mmm, I was drooling over Cooshie tonight.
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I don't necessarily disagree with you guys from a reader's perspective. My question is posed from an editorial perspective.

Valiant hires Peter David in 1996 to write, I dunno, any of these titles. You don't think his hands are tied with readers knowing exactly how Bloodshot dies?

Yeah, it's comics and they can retcon anything they want; "oh, that was a doppleganger of Gayle that died...", but even so, from a writer's perspective that's gotta take away a lot of storyline possibilities.

As a big X-O fan at the time, I can remember being *SQUEE* :!: that I now know how his story ends.

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