When will Dynamit(e)'s Gold Key license expire?

The "Gold Key Three" from publications outside of the Valiant universe.

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Sunlight on Snow
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Re: When will Dynamit(e)'s Gold Key license expire?

Post by Sunlight on Snow »

Ryan wrote:
Sat Oct 10, 2020 8:58:45 pm
Oxmyx wrote:
Sat Oct 10, 2020 10:44:06 am

Dang man I really appreciate getting that link pointed out to me! I've been wanting to see something like that for a while!

That had some surprises. Like he considers the Terran Consortium era (post Make War) better than the Malev War. I had been under the impression that later Valiant got more and more unreadable. Wheels coming off, is the expression I recall used.

And that he considers the Magus flipbook issues to actually be Rai stories AND better Rai stories than his actual title.
I don't agree with some of his rankings, but he explains his opinions well. I do like the post-Malev war era better than the Malev war. Reading it as it was coming out, the Malev War was just dragging on forever. Fast forwarding 20 years at least made it interesting again and there were lots of characters to play with. That being said I wouldn't say those are 'good' comics in terms of quality, just more fun than what had been coming before. Like all of post-Unity there are some bright spots but overall plagued by really inconsistent quality (writing, art, production), hype over substance, and shock value over good storytelling.

I also agree on Rai. I like some of Michelinie's other work, but did not like his Rai series even though I like the original Rai concept the best. Tried re-reading it recently and couldn't get through it. The flip-book stuff is great, throwback to the old 10-12 page stories, and yet pulls off a hollywood style alien invasion epic.

Would be fun to do a re-read and try to rank all the Magnus eras :thumb:
You're probably right. If I had read the Malev War crossover back in the day, over the course of almost an entire year, I would have probably not liked it as much as I did when I read it in just 2-3 days. Obviously, it's a totally different experience.

What do you mean you couldn't get through Michelinie's Rai? It's just 8 issues incl. 2 chapters of UNITY.

I'm okay with the author's rating. He just loves a good Magnus story; preferably one that doesn't lose its focus on North Am.

Perhaps his rating of VH-2's Magnus and the Sovereigns is a little too positive.

Oxmyx
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Re: When will Dynamit(e)'s Gold Key license expire?

Post by Oxmyx »

Ryan wrote:
Sat Oct 10, 2020 8:58:45 pm
Oxmyx wrote:
Sat Oct 10, 2020 10:44:06 am
Dang man I really appreciate getting that link
I don't agree with some of his rankings, but he explains his opinions well.
I also agree on Rai.
Would be fun to do a re-read and try to rank all the Magnus eras :thumb:
I haven't had the opportunity to read the flipbook issues yet, myself. I'm looking forward to it in a big way. But for me, as a reader and appreciator, I just want the old TPBs.
I could almost certainly order them on eBay or the like. I just am very cheap and trying to find them at used places locally. I need the flipbook one (can't recall the name) and Steel Nation both. I have a few of the others
I've been looking everywhere for the ultra-rare Turok vs Blister issue. Anybody able to help me out?

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Ryan
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Re: When will Dynamit(e)'s Gold Key license expire?

Post by Ryan »

Oxmyx wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 9:46:57 am
I haven't had the opportunity to read the flipbook issues yet, myself. I'm looking forward to it in a big way. But for me, as a reader and appreciator, I just want the old TPBs.
I could almost certainly order them on eBay or the like. I just am very cheap and trying to find them at used places locally. I need the flipbook one (can't recall the name) and Steel Nation both. I have a few of the others
Those are both classics. The Tpbs are fine but I prefer the issues. The ones with the coupons cut out are a lot cheaper but I don't know what the prices are these days, I'm guessing not too much especially the flipbook issues. The cards in issues 1-8 aren't in the TPBs and are really high quality, top notch artists (Moebius, Andy Kubert, Michael Golden etc.) and fill in a lot of backstory for characters from the Manning issues.

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Re: When will Dynamit(e)'s Gold Key license expire?

Post by SwiftMann »

Ryan wrote:
Thu Oct 08, 2020 7:11:26 pm
A while back I found an interesting breakdown of the different Magnus 'eras' with reviews and discussion here: https://classiccomics.boards.net/thread ... ws-shaxper
The Magnus Robot Fighter Eras reviewed include:

- Gold Key/Russ Manning Era (Grade: A++)
- Gold Key/Post Russ Manning Era (Grade: B-)
- Whitman: The Era that Almost Was (Grade: A)
- Valiant/Jim Shooter Era (Grade: B+)
- Valiant/Post Jim Shooter Era (Grade: B+)
- Valiant/Malev War Era (Grade: B+)
- Valiant/Terran Consortium Era (Grade: A-)
- Valiant/Keith Giffen Era (Grade: C+)
- Acclaim/Tom Peyer Reboot (Grade: B-)
- Acclaim/Unity 2000 Era (Grade: C)
- ibooks/Louise Simonson Reboot (Grade C+)
- Dark Horse/Jim Shooter Reboot (Grade A-)
- Dynamite/Fred Van Lente Reboot (Grade D+)
- Dynamite/Gold Key Alliance Reboot (Grade C+)
- Dynamite/The Sovereigns (Grade B)
- Dynamite/Kyle Higgins Reboot (Grade C+)
This is really interesting. Thanks for digging it up.

Having read/re-read and rating the Valiant and Acclaim runs over the last couple years I decided to compare.

- Valiant/Jim Shooter Era (Grade: B+) // 15 issues - my average rating: 4.33/5
- Valiant/Post Jim Shooter Era (Grade: B+) // 8 issues - my average rating: 3.13/5
- Valiant/Malev War Era (Grade: B+) // 35 issues - my average rating: 3.74/5
- Valiant/Terran Consortium Era (Grade: A-) // 32 issues - my average rating: 3.09/5
- Valiant/Keith Giffen Era (Grade: C+) // 10 issues - my average rating: 2.30/5
- Acclaim/Tom Peyer Reboot (Grade: B-) // 20 issues - my average rating 2.90/5

So, for me, there's a BIG difference in those first three clusters the original guy gave all B+. It's not a perfect translation to the letter grades, especially with the huge difference in number of issues in each era, but I'd put the 4.33 in the A- range. Which, I think means post-Shooter is a C+ at best and Malev War a B.

His A- for Consortium is hugely generous. So is his C+ for Giffen. I wouldn't even consider there to be a Unity 2000 era Magnus.

I haven't read much of Gold Key, so can't say with any authority. The iBooks attempt was absolutely awful. I found Shooter's Dark Horse reboot forgettable. Same with FVL's. I actually found The Gold Key Alliance and Sovereigns books fine. Probably in line with the poster's ratings. But I actually really liked Higgins run quite a bit.
Last edited by SwiftMann on Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:25:32 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: When will Dynamit(e)'s Gold Key license expire?

Post by SwiftMann »

Double post.
"If you think any of these [older comics/shows/movies] do not carry a political content and is not using the medium of science fiction to explore real-world ideas, than you have not been paying attention." - Dan Abnett, VCR #246

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Ryan
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Re: When will Dynamit(e)'s Gold Key license expire?

Post by Ryan »

Sunlight on Snow wrote:
Sun Oct 11, 2020 6:04:06 am
You're probably right. If I had read the Malev War crossover back in the day, over the course of almost an entire year, I would have probably not liked it as much as I did when I read it in just 2-3 days. Obviously, it's a totally different experience.

What do you mean you couldn't get through Michelinie's Rai? It's just 8 issues incl. 2 chapters of UNITY.

I'm okay with the author's rating. He just loves a good Magnus story; preferably one that doesn't lose its focus on North Am.

Perhaps his rating of VH-2's Magnus and the Sovereigns is a little too positive.
Dang how did I miss this post facepalm

Yeah I imagine the Malev War would read much better like that. Part of my problem with it is that I'd already fallen in love with the Shooter Magnus and all the 4001 trappings and characters they brought over and expanded upon from Manning. I thought the series could have gone on much longer just exploring North Am and the world of 4001 as it was and continue expanding on the Manning/Valiant universe. Instead the Malev War felt like an intentional move to wipe away the retro-future setting and cash in on shock value by killing off established characters. I get why they did it, they were trying to be more like Image and appeal to all the kids who were buying anything that looked 'cool' in droves. I don't think Layton thought a retro-futuristic guy in a red skirt karate chopping retro 50's style robots was very cool. I disagree though, it is cool :lol: and I think part of the reason pre-Unity Valiant became so popular was that it was doing the exact opposite of what Image and the rest of the industry in 1992 were trying to do- which was chasing the Liefeld/McFarlane/Lee 'cool' wave money.

So yeah, the Malev War might work as a good sci-fi story (I haven't re-read it in years) but I was always disappointed in it as a Magnus story and a continuation of issues 1-20. I agree with the reviewer guy on classiccomics, the setting of North Am is integral to Magnus. If you're not going to do the retro-future Utopia setting, why even call it Magnus? Shooter's version worked because he took that setting and gave it more depth. Utopia has a hidden cost - Goph lands, psychoprobe, 'killing' sentient robots, etc. without having to alter what worked in Manning's series.

I was just finding Michelenie's Rai to be really boring when I was doing a pre-Unity re-read a year or so ago. On and on with all the Anti-Granny stuff, just seemed like there could be more exciting things going on in 4001 Japan :? I also didn't really like all the Grandmother - 1-A - Grand One and turning 1-A into a villain stuff in later pre-unity Magnus.

I think there's a lot more variance between the best Magnus stuff and the worst, so I also wouldn't be as kind of a grader as this reviewer is :lol: But he's a thoughtful reader and a Magnus fan so really fun to read his take.
Last edited by Ryan on Tue Oct 13, 2020 11:09:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: When will Dynamit(e)'s Gold Key license expire?

Post by Ryan »

SwiftMann wrote:
Tue Oct 13, 2020 8:17:16 pm
This is really interesting. Thanks for digging it up.

Having read/re-read and rating the Valiant and Acclaim runs over the last couple years I decided to compare.

- Valiant/Jim Shooter Era (Grade: B+) // 15 issues - my average rating: 4.33/5
- Valiant/Post Jim Shooter Era (Grade: B+) // 8 issues - my average rating: 3.13/5
- Valiant/Malev War Era (Grade: B+) // 35 issues - my average rating: 3.74/5
- Valiant/Terran Consortium Era (Grade: A-) // 32 issues - my average rating: 3.09/5
- Valiant/Keith Giffen Era (Grade: C+) // 10 issues - my average rating: 2.30/5
- Acclaim/Tom Peyer Reboot (Grade: B-) // 20 issues - my average rating 2.90/5

So, for me, there's a BIG difference in those first three clusters the original guy gave all B+. It's not a perfect translation to the letter grades, especially with the huge difference in number of issues in each era, but I'd put the 4.33 in the A- range. Which, I think means post-Shooter is a C+ at best and Malev War a B.

His A- for Consortium is hugely generous. So is his C+ for Giffen. I wouldn't even consider there to be a Unity 2000 era Magnus.

I haven't read much of Gold Key, so can't say with any authority. The iBooks attempt was absolutely awful. I found Shooter's Dark Horse reboot forgettable. Same with FVL's. I actually found The Gold Key Alliance and Sovereigns books fine. Probably in line with the poster's ratings. But I actually really liked Higgins run quite a bit.
Good stuff. Those are fair grades. I think I like the Post-Shooter era (17-20) a little better just because of issue 20, which is one of my all time favorites. I wish Roger Stern would have done a run on Magnus. Haven't read the Ditko/Reese issues in a long time, need to take another look at them.

Dark Horse Shooter I would give an incomplete grade. I like the fact that they were bringing it back to the basics but it seemed like the first 4 issues were a warm up for the bigger story :? disappointing for sure

I didn't give the later Dynamites a serious crack, that's interesting to know.


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