Eternity #4 Discussion

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Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by grendeljd »

If anyone would like to hear our OTV:VCR podcast discussing/reviewing this issue [& Quantum & Woody #2], please follow the link;

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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by nonplayer »

I liked it. Art was good but The only thing I woukd chamge is the page with camp returning with his hostage. I was hoping for a compleate story with an actuel ending.
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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by greg »

nonplayer wrote:I was hoping for a compleate story with an actuel ending.
If it ended, they couldn't have called it "Eternity" :kidaround:

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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by nonplayer »

greg wrote:
nonplayer wrote:I was hoping for a compleate story with an actuel ending.
If it ended, they couldn't have called it "Eternity" :kidaround:
:funnypost:
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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by agent_graves »

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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by markie7235 »

Great story, though I felt issue 4 had to rush to the conclusion after issue 3.

Also anyone else notice a lot of characters never appeared. Eloleven (or whatever the plant guy was called on cover of issue 3) or the Members of Stet (cover of issue 4) never show up in the comics, amongst others. Kinda disappointed we weren't introduced formally to some of these characters, especially after featuring them on the covers.

Oh, and was anyone really surprised that David Camp was the real villain? He called his cult Eternity in issue 1, the series was called Eternity ;) seriously though, cool how he returns at the end and now his body looks like one of the brothers of the bomb. Interesting to see if he remains a long term antagonist to Divinity. They certainly set him up back in issue 1 of divinity

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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by jmatt »

An enjoyable wrap up. It's a little bit cosmic soap opera sprinkled with the title's penchant for book-ish references wrapped in homespun feel-goodery. But executed well enough to pull it all off.

Although a sniper somehow firing through the cosmos and hitting the original Observer was glossed over a little weakly, as was Camp's ability to travel there. But okay. It's comics. I'm content.

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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by grendeljd »

jmatt wrote:An enjoyable wrap up. It's a little bit cosmic soap opera sprinkled with the title's penchant for book-ish references wrapped in homespun feel-goodery. But executed well enough to pull it all off.

Although a sniper somehow firing through the cosmos and hitting the original Observer was glossed over a little weakly, as was Camp's ability to travel there. But okay. It's comics. I'm content.
Yep. I'm in the same frame of mind and agree with all of your comments about this issue.

I am glad to see David Camp evolving into a returning villainous character.
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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by greg »

grendeljd wrote:I am glad to see David Camp evolving into a returning villainous character.
He's a weird commentary on... something. :hm:

Is he a parallel to the biblical story of the fall of Lucifer?

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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by nonplayer »

jmatt wrote:An enjoyable wrap up. It's a little bit cosmic soap opera sprinkled with the title's penchant for book-ish references wrapped in homespun feel-goodery. But executed well enough to pull it all off.

Although a sniper somehow firing through the cosmos and hitting the original Observer was glossed over a little weakly, as was Camp's ability to travel there. But okay. It's comics. I'm content.
Its like lea showing no powers before and some how supermaning back to the ship.
Sure makes that 1 mile sniper kill shot look pretty lame. And how did he even know there was an observer to kill.
Must be one hell of a scope.
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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by markie7235 »

Agreed, I wish they explained Camp more, but here's my take on it.

Camp is saved and believes he's met God, or an incarnation of God. When Divinity touched him, he changed him, giving him the ability to see events through time and space, like looking through a worm hole. When Divinity shows no interest in him, it's like a biblical equivalent to Lucifer or Judas even becoming disillusioned because he's not as special to his god as he thought. He represents mans need to see meaning beyond himself, and when that meaning proves to not be what he wanted, he rejects the meaning and dogmatically pursues his original understanding as having to be correct.

Because he can now see through space and time because of Divinity, he has a sniper fire a shot through a worm hole he can now see that goes back in time killing the observer and causing a paradox that now sets up the moment that caused his faith in Divinity to change. It also opens a doorway he can step through to reach the unknown.

Or I could be way off. What will be interesting to see is what new powers he has a result. Did he gain these powers from being in the unknown or because myshka inadvertently transferred some of her power to him?

He's not really good or bad, but a fanatic on his own path now at odds with divinity

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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by tell »

I'm not sure how i feel about this series, i don't think any of this holds up to the original Divinity mini. It feels like diminishing returns since Divinity I, i expected to love this but i just didn't. I love the man-made-a-god on earth story, loved Divinity in Imperium and loved the hints at the future of divinity in the Book of Death tie ins. To me it feels like they've strayed farther and farther from the most interesting aspects of this character with every following story.

It reminds me of Sentry in Marvel, a character so powerful you have to cripple him in some practical way instead of using him (mental disorder vs ...cosmic ennui? or in this mini just being somewhere where his power is nothing special). Solar had an ongoing for years and was just as godlike and great stories were told, Divinity just isn't doing that for me anymore. There are infinite possibilities but not much really happens, a god-baby introduced in issue 1 is gone, a cosmic character introduced in 1 is replaced, a world (practically) introduced in 1 was in grave danger, but its ok now. The only change is we have a real "Dr Eclipse" now with David Camp, but man, a divinity worshipping utopian cult was so much more interesting than a mad guy with cosmic powers to fight Divinity.

Also insert my now typical complaint about the waiting, in 8-12 months we will get another 4 issue story arc to find out about Camp. It's so hard to stay engaged with waits like this. If this was monthly issue 36 would be out this month.
markie7235 wrote:Or I could be way off. What will be interesting to see is what new powers he has a result. Did he gain these powers from being in the unknown or because myshka inadvertently transferred some of her power to him?
I was thinking that when Abram gave Camp power he shared knowledge of the Unknown or just enough power to reach the Unknown, maybe when pooling the power from the bird man and others also empowered. But when the three cosmonauts reached the Unknown they all were given vast power. So perhaps Camp was imbued with enough power to reach the source, once there he had access to all the power anyone can get from the Unknown.

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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by TheeBaldMoose »

Wait, maybe I'm wrong here, but wasn't the sniper just shooting through the worm hole to open it up? When it fired through the worm hole, it caught/popped those vision bubbles and directed the bullet towards the Observer. Of course, the observer saw this, and did what he needed to ensure all of his information was passed on.

Funny, but I am also surprised that no one else realized that the field Myska wandered into back in Divinity #3 was basically man-juice. My first reaction was a little kid like and a little disgusted. I still laughed like a 12 year old, because to me that ish was hilarious!
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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by markie7235 »

tell wrote:
markie7235 wrote:Or I could be way off. What will be interesting to see is what new powers he has a result. Did he gain these powers from being in the unknown or because myshka inadvertently transferred some of her power to him?
I was thinking that when Abram gave Camp power he shared knowledge of the Unknown or just enough power to reach the Unknown, maybe when pooling the power from the bird man and others also empowered. But when the three cosmonauts reached the Unknown they all were given vast power. So perhaps Camp was imbued with enough power to reach the source, once there he had access to all the power anyone can get from the Unknown.
Possibly, they didn't explain it well. Not sure if that was intentional. As to if he now has new power, the extent of it, and what he plans to do with it, I think that will come in what I would expect is an Eternity II series. Camp I don't think will be your typical villain though. He's more focused on his dogmatic belief of what he sees as Destiny, not really on pursuit of power. Certainly hoping for an Eternity II that will explain more and show us more of the many new characters from Eternity. Hoping they were not a one and done type thing. You go to all this effort to create "new gods", hopefully they use them

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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by tell »

TheeBaldMoose wrote:Wait, maybe I'm wrong here, but wasn't the sniper just shooting through the worm hole to open it up? When it fired through the worm hole, it caught/popped those vision bubbles and directed the bullet towards the Observer. Of course, the observer saw this, and did what he needed to ensure all of his information was passed on.
I interpreted this as the bullet ripping through the pages of the book the Unknown appears to be. If the observer can look forward and backward through time and through universes then I took it the bullet was ripping from the page of the Valiant's universe on earth through other realities and/or time backwards to reach the Observer. Then I assumed he followed that path a destruction back to the Unknown.

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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by otomo »

I read the Divinity hardcover and waited on the issues for this. Was so difficult but did so. So I'm fresh off the whole series and read this all in one sitting.

1. It was good to call this Eternity and not Divinity. It did not flow with the prior 3 storylines.
2. Very ambitious concept. Maybe a little too much so.
3. The flow of this was kind of weird. I liked it but didn't love it. Just didn't have the oomph. I think the divinity "non-violence" and storytelling that slows down the pacing actually is a hindrance here to making it epic. They could have pushed to a more epic climax very easily, and i would have recommended that were I editing.
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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by jmatt »

otomo wrote:I think the divinity "non-violence" and storytelling that slows down the pacing actually is a hindrance here to making it epic. They could have pushed to a more epic climax very easily, and i would have recommended that were I editing.
I'm in agreement. I enjoy it but Divinity is like the marriage counselor of superheroes.

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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by geocarr »

jmatt wrote:
otomo wrote:I think the divinity "non-violence" and storytelling that slows down the pacing actually is a hindrance here to making it epic. They could have pushed to a more epic climax very easily, and i would have recommended that were I editing.
I'm in agreement. I enjoy it but Divinity is like the marriage counselor of superheroes.
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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by grendeljd »

jmatt wrote:
otomo wrote:I think the divinity "non-violence" and storytelling that slows down the pacing actually is a hindrance here to making it epic. They could have pushed to a more epic climax very easily, and i would have recommended that were I editing.
I'm in agreement. I enjoy it but Divinity is like the marriage counselor of superheroes.
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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by markie7235 »

tell wrote: The only change is we have a real "Dr Eclipse" now with David Camp, but man, a divinity worshipping utopian cult was so much more interesting than a mad guy with cosmic powers to fight Divinity
At first I thought of David Camp as a new Fred Bender, but in retrospect upon reading the original Unity series again, I thin he is more similar to Erica Pierce. Both have godlike powers because of the titular character messing with powers beyond their comprehension. Both have a dogmatic and idealistic vision of the world that requires them to change it via violent means. Both have a following that views them as a god/spiritual leader.

I'm wondering if Camp is being setup as a new Mothergod with an arc that spans to all valiant characters. Not that I would remake Unity, I mean seriously it was already a perfect story in every way, but I feel like that's almost what the next step for Divinity is. I think outside of setup for Camp, that's where Eternity lacked....the outcome or stakes are somewhat meaningless as we have no real attachment or concern with the unknown at this point. As a semi-cosmic entity, they need to have Divinity start being involved in more cosmic scope in terms of impact to the Valiant universe. I mean if the unknown had come apart, would anyone in the Valiant universe know? Would they care? Who knows

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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by DirtbagSailor »

“Eternity #4 bends space, time, and reality continuing the Divinity storyline to a satisfying outcome. With endless potential the promise of more to come, Eternity is absolutely worth your time.”
http://all-comic.com/2018/eternity-4/

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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by geocarr »

markie7235 wrote:
tell wrote:...they need to have Divinity start being involved in more cosmic scope in terms of impact to the Valiant universe.
But maybe Abram doesn't want to which I think would make the character more interesting to me. I've read countless anti-hero stories. How about an anti-God story? Person with god-like powers who doesn't want to be involved on a macro scale.
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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by TheeBaldMoose »

geocarr wrote:
markie7235 wrote:
tell wrote:...they need to have Divinity start being involved in more cosmic scope in terms of impact to the Valiant universe.
But maybe Abram doesn't want to which I think would make the character more interesting to me. I've read countless anti-hero stories. How about an anti-God story? Person with god-like powers who doesn't want to be involved on a macro scale.
Remember in Divinity 0, he did check in with each character, and they didn't need him for anything. They basically asked him to go away, so he relegated himself to that little plot of land in Russia. I think Anti-God story is pretty spot on. It seems like he would rather not fuss with all the cosmic stuff, so he just chills out in his little cottage far away from everything.
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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by geocarr »

TheeBaldMoose wrote:
geocarr wrote:
markie7235 wrote:
tell wrote:...they need to have Divinity start being involved in more cosmic scope in terms of impact to the Valiant universe.
But maybe Abram doesn't want to which I think would make the character more interesting to me. I've read countless anti-hero stories. How about an anti-God story? Person with god-like powers who doesn't want to be involved on a macro scale.
Remember in Divinity 0, he did check in with each character, and they didn't need him for anything. They basically asked him to go away, so he relegated himself to that little plot of land in Russia. I think Anti-God story is pretty spot on. It seems like he would rather not fuss with all the cosmic stuff, so he just chills out in his little cottage far away from everything.
How much of what we do is to see if we actually can? What would you do if you knew you could do anything? Would you lose motivation to do anything and become extremely apathetic? Think of the existential questions. If you know you can do it, what's the purpose in doing it? Think of the conversation between Divinity and a quadriplegic person who's been homeless for 20 years with nothing and no resources to effect change who questions their purpose. The existential questioning similarities between the person who can do anything and the person who can do nothing.
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Re: Eternity #4 Discussion

Post by Big Red »

In my opinion, this was the least enjoyable of all the Divinity miniseries.

I just didn't get it.

How did David Camp fire a bullet that went back in time and through the cosmos?

And most of the inhabitants of the Unknown seem pretty powerful, yet a regular ol' bullet killed the Observer?

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