Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

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Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by jmatt »

An appropriately timed one-shot with a simple story, nice art and some messaging about consumerism and crass commercialism.

Now, consumers and commerce are what the world go around (even for comic book writers) but it's also important to remember that the innocence of imagination has a place in it, too.

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by otomo »

I haven't enjoyed much of the faith solo stuff, but I found this book to be pretty cute and enjoyable. As a holiday one shot, it is what it is to some degree. You expect a little cheesy, but this was fun and pretty imaginative as well with the whole Alice In Wonderland element to it. I was happy with it as a one-shot, though I don't have a ton of discussion points on it.

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by Dallow Spicer1 »

Was a bit disappointed with this. I was expecting the usual ‘Valiant lite’ from a Faith story but in a nice Christmassy context. The art and feel of Christmas was there but the political message seemed a bit crowbarred into the story. Yes Christmas is very commercial but if you really want to be political then look at how the word ‘Christmas’ is being slowly eradicated in North America and Europe! :? I think the writer should have focused on a good story first and foremost and not use it as an opportunity political platform, especially if it’s an easy target.

Also, ‘get gendered’!?! facepalm I’m gonna leave that there!

Story wise the evil queen part of the story came to a grinding halt all of a sudden and everything was resolved and tidied up in the space of a couple of panels?!? :o

Also, the actress who played Alice in the tv programme when Faith was a kid, she’s probably 15 years older than Faith but at the end of the issue when they meet she looks to be in her 70’s :lol: I guess it’s possible kid Faith was watching repeats from years before!

2.5/5 disappointing

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by tell »

Dallow Spicer1 wrote:Yes Christmas is very commercial but if you really want to be political then look at how the word ‘Christmas’ is being slowly eradicated in North America and Europe! :?
If you think the word Christmas is being eradicated in North America you must have fallen down the War-On-Christmas rabbit hole created by Fox News, into their FearmongerScape.

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by Dallow Spicer1 »

tell wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:Yes Christmas is very commercial but if you really want to be political then look at how the word ‘Christmas’ is being slowly eradicated in North America and Europe! :?
If you think the word Christmas is being eradicated in North America you must have fallen down the War-On-Christmas rabbit hole created by Fox News, into their FearmongerScape.
I’m not American and nor do I watch Fox, but certainly in Europe this is a real thing and not a media invention. One example being Christmas markets are now ‘winter markets’.

Judging by US tv programmes in recent years you tend to hear the phrase ‘happy holidays’ instead of ‘merry Christmas’ or is this not the case?

In fact, the issue of Faith in this thread avoids the use of the word Christmas and is referred to as a ‘Winter Wonderland’ special? What even is a ‘winter wonderland’??

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by jmatt »

Dallow Spicer1 wrote:Also, ‘get gendered’!?! facepalm I’m gonna leave that there!
I didn't want to mention it, but yeah, I rolled my eyes on that line. I have sympathy for people that feel gender conflicted but... come on. Does SJWing need to invade everything? I didn't let it spoil what was otherwise a pleasant story.

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by kinggirlfriend »

"Sleigh bells ring are you listening,
In the lane snow is glistening.
A beautiful sight,
We're happy tonight,
Walking in a winter wonderland."

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by otomo »

jmatt wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:Also, ‘get gendered’!?! facepalm I’m gonna leave that there!
I didn't want to mention it, but yeah, I rolled my eyes on that line. I have sympathy for people that feel gender conflicted but... come on. Does SJWing need to invade everything? I didn't let it spoil what was otherwise a pleasant story.
LOL yes I was on the same page. This sort of stuff really shouldn't get past editorial it looks absolutely ridiculous and frankly Valiant does a bit too much of it (Fred Van Lente is really guilty of doing this kind of thing). It just throws anyone out of a story and adds no value, and it's ridiculous cuz no one talks like that. But barring that one bubble in one panel -- which I just purged from my head, I thought it was fun otherwise.
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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by Dallow Spicer1 »

jmatt wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:Also, ‘get gendered’!?! facepalm I’m gonna leave that there!
I didn't want to mention it, but yeah, I rolled my eyes on that line. I have sympathy for people that feel gender conflicted but... come on. Does SJWing need to invade everything? I didn't let it spoil what was otherwise a pleasant story.
+1 totally agree and jmatt articulated this point much better. I have sympathy for anyone who suffers gender issues too, but when things like this appear in books it feels like there’s an ‘agenda’ behind it and that’s what I object too.

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by Dallow Spicer1 »

kinggirlfriend wrote:"Sleigh bells ring are you listening,
In the lane snow is glistening.
A beautiful sight,
We're happy tonight,
Walking in a winter wonderland."
Good point :lol: but as we all know, that is a Christmas song, why not call this book the Faith Christmas Special rather than allude to it but avoid using the word? :?

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by greg »

Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
kinggirlfriend wrote:"Sleigh bells ring are you listening,
In the lane snow is glistening.
A beautiful sight,
We're happy tonight,
Walking in a winter wonderland."
Good point :lol: but as we all know, that is a Christmas song, why not call this book the Faith Christmas Special rather than allude to it but avoid using the word? :?
Because there's no mention of Christmas in "Alice in Wonderland"?

Could "walking in a winter wonderland" describe Hanukkah?
Could it describe walking in non-denominational snow?
Are sleigh bells ringing in winter an indication of Santa (if it's not Christmas eve) or of a 19th century family traveling party to Grandma's house?
Which religion gets exclusive claim to building snowmen in the meadow and dreaming later on by the fire?

Come on people. Christmas isn't going anywhere.
"Happy Holidays" usually means Christmas AND New Year's Day. Two holidays.
This was Faith in Wonderland... and it's snowing.

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by Dallow Spicer1 »

greg wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
kinggirlfriend wrote:"Sleigh bells ring are you listening,
In the lane snow is glistening.
A beautiful sight,
We're happy tonight,
Walking in a winter wonderland."
Good point :lol: but as we all know, that is a Christmas song, why not call this book the Faith Christmas Special rather than allude to it but avoid using the word? :?
Because there's no mention of Christmas in "Alice in Wonderland"?

Could "walking in a winter wonderland" describe Hanukkah?
Could it describe walking in non-denominational snow?
Are sleigh bells ringing in winter an indication of Santa (if it's not Christmas eve) or of a 19th century family traveling party to Grandma's house?
Which religion gets exclusive claim to building snowmen in the meadow and dreaming later on by the fire?

Come on people. Christmas isn't going anywhere.
"Happy Holidays" usually means Christmas AND New Year's Day. Two holidays.
This was Faith in Wonderland... and it's snowing.
I get your point Greg and if they released this issue in October or February then I’d buy that explanation, however, it was released in December and had all of the imagery of Christmas but avoided using the term. We know it’s a Christmas special so let’s just call it that! :?

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by greg »

One mention of gender-confliction in a book referencing Alice in Wonderland makes SOME sense. The biggest reference to Alice in Wonderland in this generation was The Matrix. Follow the white rabbit. Take the red pill and see how deep the rabbit hole goes.

The Wachowskis created The Matrix.

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by grendeljd »

If anyone would like to hear our OTV:VCR podcast discussing/reviewing this issue, please follow the link;

http://onlythevaliant.com/episodes/vcr144/" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Thanks to any who listen in :thumb:
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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by grendeljd »

greg wrote:One mention of gender-confliction in a book referencing Alice in Wonderland makes SOME sense. The biggest reference to Alice in Wonderland in this generation was The Matrix. Follow the white rabbit. Take the red pill and see how deep the rabbit hole goes.

The Wachowskis created The Matrix.
Nice :thumb:
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My wife likes to draw stuff too, and she is better than me! [I'm very proud of her]... https://www.facebook.com/pages/Sara-Dec ... ref=stream" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by greg »

Dallow Spicer1 wrote:I get your point Greg and if they released this issue in October or February then I’d buy that explanation, however, it was released in December and had all of the imagery of Christmas but avoided using the term. We know it’s a Christmas special so let’s just call it that! :?
OK, but then you'd have Valiant publishing the Faith Christmas Special and the story would be all about Alice in Wonderland. Where's the manger? Where are the shepherds? Where did they mention baby Jesus at all?

Outrage either way.

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by Dallow Spicer1 »

greg wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:I get your point Greg and if they released this issue in October or February then I’d buy that explanation, however, it was released in December and had all of the imagery of Christmas but avoided using the term. We know it’s a Christmas special so let’s just call it that! :?
OK, but then you'd have Valiant publishing the Faith Christmas Special and the story would be all about Alice in Wonderland. Where's the manger? Where are the shepherds? Where did they mention baby Jesus at all?

Outrage either way.
Just a Father Christmas would be enough! :P :thumb:

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by greg »

Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
greg wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:I get your point Greg and if they released this issue in October or February then I’d buy that explanation, however, it was released in December and had all of the imagery of Christmas but avoided using the term. We know it’s a Christmas special so let’s just call it that! :?
OK, but then you'd have Valiant publishing the Faith Christmas Special and the story would be all about Alice in Wonderland. Where's the manger? Where are the shepherds? Where did they mention baby Jesus at all?

Outrage either way.
Just a Father Christmas would be enough! :P :thumb:
Faith is American, and even her love of Doctor Who would be connected to Santa episodes.

Father Christmas means nothing over here. :)

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by otomo »

As a person pretty sensitive to political agendas in comics I think the not naming it Christmas is a non issue here because of the Alice In Wonderland Winter Wonderland titling pun which I thought was clever conceptually and as a title personally :) It's obviously a special for Christmas time but the word use didn't have bearing on the story.
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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by greg »

Image

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by Dallow Spicer1 »

greg wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
greg wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:I get your point Greg and if they released this issue in October or February then I’d buy that explanation, however, it was released in December and had all of the imagery of Christmas but avoided using the term. We know it’s a Christmas special so let’s just call it that! :?
OK, but then you'd have Valiant publishing the Faith Christmas Special and the story would be all about Alice in Wonderland. Where's the manger? Where are the shepherds? Where did they mention baby Jesus at all?

Outrage either way.
Just a Father Christmas would be enough! :P :thumb:
Faith is American, and even her love of Doctor Who would be connected to Santa episodes.

Father Christmas means nothing over here. :)
C’mon Greg, let’s not start some sort of ‘war on Father Christmas’ now! :lol:

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by greg »

Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
greg wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
greg wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:I get your point Greg and if they released this issue in October or February then I’d buy that explanation, however, it was released in December and had all of the imagery of Christmas but avoided using the term. We know it’s a Christmas special so let’s just call it that! :?
OK, but then you'd have Valiant publishing the Faith Christmas Special and the story would be all about Alice in Wonderland. Where's the manger? Where are the shepherds? Where did they mention baby Jesus at all?

Outrage either way.
Just a Father Christmas would be enough! :P :thumb:
Faith is American, and even her love of Doctor Who would be connected to Santa episodes.

Father Christmas means nothing over here. :)
C’mon Greg, let’s not start some sort of ‘war on Father Christmas’ now! :lol:
The war on Father Christmas was over in 1776. :P

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by Dallow Spicer1 »

greg wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
greg wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
greg wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:I get your point Greg and if they released this issue in October or February then I’d buy that explanation, however, it was released in December and had all of the imagery of Christmas but avoided using the term. We know it’s a Christmas special so let’s just call it that! :?
OK, but then you'd have Valiant publishing the Faith Christmas Special and the story would be all about Alice in Wonderland. Where's the manger? Where are the shepherds? Where did they mention baby Jesus at all?

Outrage either way.
Just a Father Christmas would be enough! :P :thumb:
Faith is American, and even her love of Doctor Who would be connected to Santa episodes.

Father Christmas means nothing over here. :)
C’mon Greg, let’s not start some sort of ‘war on Father Christmas’ now! :lol:
The war on Father Christmas was over in 1776. :P
Ouch, shots fired! :lol: But remember, the Empire always strikes back! :high-five:

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by tell »

Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
tell wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:Yes Christmas is very commercial but if you really want to be political then look at how the word ‘Christmas’ is being slowly eradicated in North America and Europe! :?
If you think the word Christmas is being eradicated in North America you must have fallen down the War-On-Christmas rabbit hole created by Fox News, into their FearmongerScape.
I’m not American and nor do I watch Fox, but certainly in Europe this is a real thing and not a media invention. One example being Christmas markets are now ‘winter markets’.

Judging by US tv programmes in recent years you tend to hear the phrase ‘happy holidays’ instead of ‘merry Christmas’ or is this not the case?

In fact, the issue of Faith in this thread avoids the use of the word Christmas and is referred to as a ‘Winter Wonderland’ special? What even is a ‘winter wonderland’??
Sure, you see Happy Holidays a lot more than you used to, but the word Christmas is far from being eradicated. The news loves to talk about it like it's a huge deal when for the most part companies that aren't using Merry Christmas are doing so of their own volition because it appeals to a wider market, it's capitalism not PC culture war.

As for the Winter Wonderland, the term comes from a 1934 Christmas song, it's a very common and popular phrase which doubles as a reference to Wonderland, where Alice In Wonderland takes place. It seems like a very logical title to me, it ties together the winter holidays with Alice In Wonderland.

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Re: Faith's Winter Wonderland Special

Post by kinggirlfriend »

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2jzhd0SU8k4" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;


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