I'm considering becoming a VH1 collector. Any tips or suggestions?

[TheFerg714]

So I just finished BWS's Archer & Armstrong run, and holy *SQUEE*, it was fantastic.

Now I'm feeling the itch. I haven't had enough Valiant in my life for the past few years, and I'm starting to think it would be really nice to dive into the OG stories that have eluded me thus far. I just have a few questions for you super fans (seeing as this is pretty much the only place to discuss this stuff).

Is it possible? Are some of these issues impossible to find for a reasonable price? Will this inevitably end in me being *SQUEE* because there's 10 issues I can't find? Should I just read them online?

Should I just read the stuff that looks appealing to me, or just say screw it and read the entire damn thing? I've heard that the quality drastically drops after Unity, but that seems to be disproven by the fantastic A&A run I just finished.

Are there any good reading orders? Does it even matter?

Are they distinct "eras," or "phases," like with VEI? Clearly "Pre-Unity" is it's own phase, but is there a second "phase," or is it all just one big "phase" (for lack of a better word) after that?

Thank you for any info or answers you may have.

EDIT: I forgot to mention my VH1 credentials. I have read the entirety of Pre-Unity, as well as the event itself, Rai #0, and now A&A #1-12. I adored Solar #1-10, Unity, and Shadowman #1-5, but I can't say I was super impressed with the rest of the stories. Going forward, I am most interested in Shadowman, the Gold Key characters, and the rest of A&A, but like I said, I'm tempted to just dive into the whole thing and see how it goes.

[geocarr]

Step #1 - Buy my entire collection of VH1 and Acclaim raw and slabbed books, original art, and memorabilia for $20,000. It’s a steal!


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[nycjadie]

Pre-Unity and Unity is where it’s at for reading. For collecting, outside of those issues, the last few of the longer runs can be expensive. Some of those later issues are pretty bland or silly. I think X-O was pretty solid.

If you do Acclaim, definitely read Shadowman. I liked Armorines as well. Magnus was not my cup of tea. Q&W was a bit silly for my tastes as well, but I appreciated the 4th wall thing.

[The Chosen 1]

I really enjoyed Harbinger up to issue #25. I think Valiant as a whole changed direction around this time. Harbinger #26 went in a completely different direction and that's where i feel the quality dropped off a cliff.

Around Magnus #30, XO Manowar #25 and Solar #30 are the issues i think you can tell things changed a lot. It was pretty consistent with all the comics being released around the same time. Everything before that was great to read.

[Chiclo]

The best break points between the eras are the crossovers, Unity, Chaos Effect and to a lesser extent, Birthquake. Most of the stuff between Unity and Chaos Effect is pretty readable, less so after Chaos Effect, with exceptions both ways. A&A ends with Chaos Effect, so that title was spared the worst of it. The future books probably were the better quality late in VH1. Hard Corps takes a real dive in quality. Ninjak had a decent Abnett and Lanning run in the middle. Eternal Warrior loses his way after the Geoff dies. X-O slides downward around issue 30 and never recovers. Turok and Timewalker were hit and miss. Geomancer was all miss. If I remember right, Bloodshot and Solar have pretty sad runs but the titles end with a few better but not quite good issues - but I haven’t read these in 10 years or so.

I do recommend an EW one-shot story, around issue 35. Great opening vignette with Gilad meeting Attila the Hun at a bridge and a great, neon-soaked 80s style story where Gilad is basically the Highlander from the first movie.

[ckb]

I'm not sure I agree with the premise that VH1 issues are hard to find for a reasonable price. If you buy the books in runs/sets, use reprints for the expensive issues, and avoid the big retail websites, I think you can get a really good collection going without spending too much. Don't most runs finish at about $1/book shipped?

[The Chosen 1]

I'm not sure I agree with the premise that VH1 issues are hard to find for a reasonable price. If you buy the books in runs/sets, use reprints for the expensive issues, and avoid the big retail websites, I think you can get a really good collection going without spending too much. Don't most runs finish at about $1/book shipped?

I've found the last dozen issues of each run can get expensive, especially the last few issues. mainly due to low print runs. Some can be difficult to track down. It took me a while to find XO and Bloodshot issues, and when i did, they weren't cheap. (Depending on your version of cheap)

[David_Cody]

Seeing that I completed my VH1 run less than a year ago, I can say having bought them, the last issues of each title are a bit more expensive. But by no means do they break the bank.

[leonmallett]

I highly recommend the VH1 Shadowman run; for me it crystallised perfectly with bob Hall taking over as writer, and the last few issues are a rollercoaster ride to a solid ending.

[TheFerg714]

Big thanks to everyone for answers, opinions, and info. This whole thread has been insanely helpful. Tbh though, considering the rather negative feedback I've been hearing about post-Unity, I'm thinking about reading stuff online first, then going back and collecting the stuff I liked.

I really enjoyed Harbinger up to issue #25. I think Valiant as a whole changed direction around this time. Harbinger #26 went in a completely different direction and that's where i feel the quality dropped off a cliff.

Around Magnus #30, XO Manowar #25 and Solar #30 are the issues i think you can tell things changed a lot. It was pretty consistent with all the comics being released around the same time. Everything before that was great to read.

Why do you think that happened? What happened around this period to set this quality decline off?

The best break points between the eras are the crossovers, Unity, Chaos Effect and to a lesser extent, Birthquake. Most of the stuff between Unity and Chaos Effect is pretty readable, less so after Chaos Effect, with exceptions both ways. A&A ends with Chaos Effect, so that title was spared the worst of it. The future books probably were the better quality late in VH1. Hard Corps takes a real dive in quality. Ninjak had a decent Abnett and Lanning run in the middle. Eternal Warrior loses his way after the Geoff dies. X-O slides downward around issue 30 and never recovers. Turok and Timewalker were hit and miss. Geomancer was all miss. If I remember right, Bloodshot and Solar have pretty sad runs but the titles end with a few better but not quite good issues - but I haven’t read these in 10 years or so.

I do recommend an EW one-shot story, around issue 35. Great opening vignette with Gilad meeting Attila the Hun at a bridge and a great, neon-soaked 80s style story where Gilad is basically the Highlander from the first movie.

Really appreciate the info Chiclo. I'm (re)listening through some of the old OTV podcasts, and they're so awesome. I really appreciate everything you, and your cohorts, did with OTV. It's essential listening for all Valiant fans imo.

Seeing that I completed my VH1 run less than a year ago, I can say having bought them, the last issues of each title are a bit more expensive. But by no means do they break the bank.

What do you mean by that? Are we talking like double cover price, or..?

I highly recommend the VH1 Shadowman run; for me it crystallised perfectly with bob Hall taking over as writer, and the last few issues are a rollercoaster ride to a solid ending.

I was very impressed with the first five issues that I read a few years back. I've actually already collected like a third of the run, so I'm thinking I'll probably dive headfirst into this series, and A&A #13-26.

[grendeljd]

Ferg, you might want to just get an issue or two of A&A post-BWS run to see if you like them before committing to buying them all. Just my own personal opinion here, but back in the day I did not enjoy the creative team shift at all. BWS’s run is just so special that it’s a tough act to follow for anyone.

I have tried to re-read those later issues a few times over the years since they first came out, and I just can’t ever get through more than one or two of them.

I do enjoy the complete run of VH1 Shadowman, & I’m *still* currently picking away at a full run of VH1 Bloodshot for the sheer fun of it. I just have a couple small gaps in the 30’s & 40’s, and I don’t have 50 or 51 yet either.

Like others have expressed, VH1 Harbinger was also not enjoyable to me after #25, although I *think* I did fill in the run mostly about 8-10 years ago (haven’t checked in a long time).

Same for XO. I originally quit the series at #28 back in the day. I have picked up a couple issues to the early #30’s since then, but I’m still not to keen on the book beyond that.

[The Chosen 1]

Big thanks to everyone for answers, opinions, and info. This whole thread has been insanely helpful. Tbh though, considering the rather negative feedback I've been hearing about post-Unity, I'm thinking about reading stuff online first, then going back and collecting the stuff I liked.

I really enjoyed Harbinger up to issue #25. I think Valiant as a whole changed direction around this time. Harbinger #26 went in a completely different direction and that's where i feel the quality dropped off a cliff.

Around Magnus #30, XO Manowar #25 and Solar #30 are the issues i think you can tell things changed a lot. It was pretty consistent with all the comics being released around the same time. Everything before that was great to read.

Why do you think that happened? What happened around this period to set this quality decline off?

Seeing that I completed my VH1 run less than a year ago, I can say having bought them, the last issues of each title are a bit more expensive. But by no means do they break the bank.

What do you mean by that? Are we talking like double cover price, or..?

I'm only speculating, but i think at this point the company went through a bit of soft re-boot. Up until this point they kept with the Shooter story lines, but after this they moved away from that. As i said, i'm only speculating why this point in time the quality really dropped off. I'd be more than happy to have someone with a bit more knowledge of this time give their reason.

And i found the later issues were up to $80 Australian Dollars. Which is roughly $$50 - $60 USD. So they won't break the bank, but not cheap. The last couple of Bloodshot and XO issues were around this price.

[TheFerg714]

Ferg, you might want to just get an issue or two of A&A post-BWS run to see if you like them before committing to buying them all. Just my own personal opinion here, but back in the day I did not enjoy the creative team shift at all. BWS’s run is just so special that it’s a tough act to follow for anyone.

My LCS has #13-15 last I checked, so I'm probably going to be picking those up tomorrow. Thanks for the heads up.

Like others have expressed, VH1 Harbinger was also not enjoyable to me after #25, although I *think* I did fill in the run mostly about 8-10 years ago (haven’t checked in a long time).

I couldn't really get into Pre-Unity Harbinger, so I can't say I'm too interested. Maybe it just pales in comparison to Dysart's run.

I'm only speculating, but i think at this point the company went through a bit of soft re-boot. Up until this point they kept with the Shooter story lines, but after this they moved away from that. As i said, i'm only speculating why this point in time the quality really dropped off. I'd be more than happy to have someone with a bit more knowledge of this time give their reason.

And i found the later issues were up to $80 Australian Dollars. Which is roughly $$50 - $60 USD. So they won't break the bank, but not cheap. The last couple of Bloodshot and XO issues were around this price.

That is out of the question lol. I've never spent more than $10 on one issue, and considering that everyone seems to agree that the quality is super low near the end of every run, I don't intend to break my rule.

[GammaJosh]

From watching Facebook posts in the various Valiant groups, I'm always amazed at what people find in the the dollar bins. So my tip would be...always check the dollar bins!

[dellamorte]

Pre Unity is almost all GOLD. Unity to this day may be the finest company wide crossover event ever pulled off. After that it get's hit or miss, most books were solid until the ran out of Shooter's plots. Harbinger stayed strong until Lapham left. BWS kept Archer and Armstrong amazing until he left (and we can't forget his short run on Eternal Warrior). The MVP of post Unity for me is Bob Hall and his killer run on Shadowman up til the end.

[TheFerg714]

From watching Facebook posts in the various Valiant groups, I'm always amazed at what people find in the the dollar bins. So my tip would be...always check the dollar bins!

Well that's unfortunate. Years ago, Omaha's LCS's all were seemingly chock full of old Valiant's. I just went and flipped through every single one of their discount bins, and found nothing. It was very disappointing.

Pre Unity is almost all GOLD. Unity to this day may be the finest company wide crossover event ever pulled off. After that it get's hit or miss, most books were solid until the ran out of Shooter's plots. Harbinger stayed strong until Lapham left. BWS kept Archer and Armstrong amazing until he left (and we can't forget his short run on Eternal Warrior). The MVP of post Unity for me is Bob Hall and his killer run on Shadowman up til the end.

Thanks for the info!

[buff-beardo]

Pre-Unity is always the quick and easy answer you’ll get from old school VALIANT fans. Understandable. It’s incredibly tight continuity written primarily by one author. However, there are some excellent stories afterwards. Shadowman vastly improves post-Unity.

I missed out on VALIANT until Unity during the summer of 1992. My thanks for making me aware of VALIANT is solely due to the late Wizard magazine. I suspect the same for most of us from back then. The internet wasn’t around for a VAST majority of us. It’s hard to imagine now.

Also, VALIANT back then didn’t go from hero to zero overnight. It was a gradual but steady decline imo. Similar to VEI. History loves company!!!

Anyhow, I highly recommend the following reads to you that are very affordable post-Unity.

Post-Unity Best:
- Bloodshot 0, 1-3, 6-7 (6-7: “Ninjak” arc)
- Eternal Warrior 3-7, 12-13 (Immortal Enemy, Bloodshot, Master Darque, Immortal Enemy Returns Arcs)
- Harbinger 10-22, 23-25 (10-11: H.A.R.D. Corps; 12-22: buildup; Sting vs Harada culmination)
- Magnus 17-20 (Jim Shooter leftovers)
- Rai 8
- Shadowman 6-12 (“Blood Runners” Master Darque arc)
- Shadowman 0, 13-43, Yearbook 1 (solid run all the way)
- Solar 14-15 (“Fred Bender” arc)
- Solar 16-18 (“Seed of Destruction” arc: x-over w/ X-O 11-13)
- Solar 21-23 (Master Darque)
- Solar 25 (Dr. Eclipse arc: x-over w/ Secret Weapons 1-2)
- Secret Weapons 1-2 (Dr. Eclipse arc: x-over w/ Solar 25)
- X-O Manowar 9-10
- X-O Manowar 11-13 (18 (“Seed of Destruction” arc: x-over w/ Solar 16-18)
- X-O Manowar 14-15 (Turok)

Malev War:
Prelude-
- Solar 20
- Rai 0
- Bloodshot 4, 5
War-
- Magnus 21-37
- Rai 9-21
Aftermath-
- Magnus 38
- Rai 22

If you read all that and are still wanting more, continue on with all the titles through the end of Chaos Effect. Still trucking? Read until Birthquake. I have no advice after that.