Dr. Tomorrow

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by iggy101us »

I didn't think Speed Racer . . . I thought of this . . . Science Ninja Team Gatchaman from the 1970s :?

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by The Chosen 1 »

I just wonder how this impacts/affects anything to do with Ivar and Neela. I wouldn't have thought that Valiant need another time jumping character.
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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Jrosen »

The Chosen 1 wrote:I just wonder how this impacts/affects anything to do with Ivar and Neela. I wouldn't have thought that Valiant need another time jumping character.
My thoughts exactly. I really enjoyed iver's maxi series and Faith and the future force. I'd like to see them represented.

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Dallow Spicer1 »

Oxmyx wrote:
GammaJosh wrote: There's nobody from DMG in the office in New York. ...real writers, artists, editors and other staff
This is an interesting point. Pretty much all the negative energy is being directed squarely at DMG (with the notable exception on DallowSpicer who directs his criticism at Heather Antos), and I'm not sure that is correct. .
Woahhh hold your horses there dude, that’s fake news! My justified criticism is mainly aimed at whoever makes the hiring decisions (eg who hired HA in the first place) but mostly whoever is in charge of the creative direction, presumably Robert Myers. Hearher Antos is part of the problem (imo) but she’s not chief architect of Valiant’s downfall.

As for this book, it’s been written by a former editor and as far as I’m aware is his first book with an art choice that is not my taste. I won’t be pre-ordering it but if the reviews (from credible sources) are positive then I’ll check it out. I’m not hugely optimistic but as with all new Valiant launches I’m hoping for the best, I even pre ordered the first 4 issues of FVL latest dross Psi Lords knowing full well how bad his previous Valiant books were. facepalm

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Sunlight on Snow »

Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
Oxmyx wrote:
GammaJosh wrote: There's nobody from DMG in the office in New York. ...real writers, artists, editors and other staff
This is an interesting point. Pretty much all the negative energy is being directed squarely at DMG (with the notable exception on DallowSpicer who directs his criticism at Heather Antos), and I'm not sure that is correct. .
Woahhh hold your horses there dude, that’s fake news! My justified criticism is mainly aimed at whoever makes the hiring decisions (eg who hired HA in the first place) but mostly whoever is in charge of the creative direction, presumably Robert Myers. Hearher Antos is part of the problem (imo) but she’s not chief architect of Valiant’s downfall.
And yet you seem to blame Meyers and Antos for EVERYTHING including the "downfall".

Neither of them hired Ayala and green-lit "their" Livewire series, for instance.

They (Meyers & Antos!) can't be made responsible for anything before "Valiant Breakthrough".

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Dallow Spicer1 »

Sunlight on Snow wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
Oxmyx wrote:
GammaJosh wrote: There's nobody from DMG in the office in New York. ...real writers, artists, editors and other staff
This is an interesting point. Pretty much all the negative energy is being directed squarely at DMG (with the notable exception on DallowSpicer who directs his criticism at Heather Antos), and I'm not sure that is correct. .
Woahhh hold your horses there dude, that’s fake news! My justified criticism is mainly aimed at whoever makes the hiring decisions (eg who hired HA in the first place) but mostly whoever is in charge of the creative direction, presumably Robert Myers. Hearher Antos is part of the problem (imo) but she’s not chief architect of Valiant’s downfall.
And yet you seem to blame Meyers and Antos for EVERYTHING including the "downfall".

Neither of them hired Ayala and green-lit "their" Livewire series, for instance.

They (Meyers & Antos!) can't be made responsible for anything before "Valiant Breakthrough".
Let me get this straight...the editor and chief editor on Livewire are not responsible for probably the worst series ever put out by VEI? The first arc was passable but the art and story on the final arc was shocking, who is responsible for that?!

Why don’t you explain what they have been responsible for most of 2019? Who have they hired? If Meyers isn’t in charge of the quality of the books then who is?! Seems to me Illidge left a fair while ago, who green lit Roku, Psi Lords, (latest) Bloodshot, Dr Mirage etc. Or are you happy with the output?

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Sunlight on Snow »

Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
Sunlight on Snow wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
Oxmyx wrote:
GammaJosh wrote: There's nobody from DMG in the office in New York. ...real writers, artists, editors and other staff
This is an interesting point. Pretty much all the negative energy is being directed squarely at DMG (with the notable exception on DallowSpicer who directs his criticism at Heather Antos), and I'm not sure that is correct. .
Woahhh hold your horses there dude, that’s fake news! My justified criticism is mainly aimed at whoever makes the hiring decisions (eg who hired HA in the first place) but mostly whoever is in charge of the creative direction, presumably Robert Myers. Hearher Antos is part of the problem (imo) but she’s not chief architect of Valiant’s downfall.
And yet you seem to blame Meyers and Antos for EVERYTHING including the "downfall".

Neither of them hired Ayala and green-lit "their" Livewire series, for instance.

They (Meyers & Antos!) can't be made responsible for anything before "Valiant Breakthrough".
Let me get this straight...the editor and chief editor on Livewire are not responsible for probably the worst series ever put out by VEI? The first arc was passable but the art and story on the final arc was shocking, who is responsible for that?!

Why don’t you explain what they have been responsible for most of 2019? Who have they hired? If Meyers isn’t in charge of the quality of the books then who is?! Seems to me Illidge left a fair while ago, who green lit Roku, Psi Lords, (latest) Bloodshot, Dr Mirage etc. Or are you happy with the output?
Haha! You keep doing it. Fake news!

The downfall you mentioned. Who started it? Meyers and Antos? You're a hypocrite!

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by nonplayer »

I think Dr tomorrow might actuelly be good.
Least it wont be our nostalgic charaters protrayed wrong with holes in continuity.
I just hope dr tomorrow has a stethoscope or a sonic screwdriver or is some way unique and has charater development.
Is it alot to ask for good quality art.
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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Oxmyx »

nonplayer wrote:I think Dr tomorrow might actuelly be good.
Least it wont be our nostalgic charaters protrayed wrong with holes in continuity.
I just hope dr tomorrow has a stethoscope or a sonic screwdriver or is some way unique and has charater development.
Is it alot to ask for good quality art.
I sure hope it's good. But instead of a stethoscope, I'm pulling for a Cerebral Bore myself.
I've been looking everywhere for the ultra-rare Turok vs Blister issue. Anybody able to help me out?

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Oxmyx »

Sunlight on Snow wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
Sunlight on Snow wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
Oxmyx wrote:
GammaJosh wrote: There's nobody from DMG in the office in New York. ...real writers, artists, editors and other staff
This is an interesting point. Pretty much all the negative energy is being directed squarely at DMG (with the notable exception on DallowSpicer who directs his criticism at Heather Antos), and I'm not sure that is correct. .
Woahhh hold your horses there dude, that’s fake news! My justified criticism ... she’s not chief architect of Valiant’s downfall.
And yet you seem to blame Meyers and Antos for EVERYTHING including the "downfall".

They (Meyers & Antos!) can't be made responsible for anything before "Valiant Breakthrough".
Let me get this straight...the editor and chief editor on Livewire ... who is responsible for that?!
Or are you happy with the output?
Haha! You keep doing it. Fake news!

The downfall you mentioned. Who started it? Meyers and Antos? You're a hypocrite!
Guys, guys, don't make this so personal. DallowSpicer I was making a sort of joke just poking fun at your repeated mention of Heather. My apologies you took it as a stab not a poke. Someone here, and I'm not sure who, made a good point. If not who we've mentioned, then who?
I've been looking everywhere for the ultra-rare Turok vs Blister issue. Anybody able to help me out?

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Dallow Spicer1 »

@Oxmyx It’s all good mate I don’t take it personally :thumb:

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Shadowman99 »

iggy101us wrote:I didn't think Speed Racer . . . I thought of this . . . Science Ninja Team Gatchaman from the 1970s :?

Image
Have to admit, G-Force: Guardians of Space (the anglisised cartoon title) popped into my head instantly too. That helmet is totally, totally derivative.

Anyway, having seen this described as "family friendly" I'm really not all that enthused about it, and if that does turn out to be an accurate description it really leaves me wondering exactly what the marketing department's overall goals for driving sales must be, but I guess we'll see. Also not hyped to hear that this title forms the core of a "massive universe-wide event" that's coming in 2020, seems to suggest that the company is putting an awful LOT of stock and hope in this title.

Well, I hope it does something miraculous for VEI, but I'm really not feeling this one right now.
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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Shadowman99 »

Oxmyx wrote:
nonplayer wrote:I think Dr tomorrow might actuelly be good.
Least it wont be our nostalgic charaters protrayed wrong with holes in continuity.
I just hope dr tomorrow has a stethoscope or a sonic screwdriver or is some way unique and has charater development.
Is it alot to ask for good quality art.
I sure hope it's good. But instead of a stethoscope, I'm pulling for a Cerebral Bore myself.
You're still willing that cerebral bore to make its first VEI appearance eh? Well, I can't see it happening myself but I'll literally cheer out loud if ever it does (I'd love to see it back too) :lol: :high-five:
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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Sunlight on Snow »

Oxmyx wrote:
Sunlight on Snow wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
Sunlight on Snow wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:Woahhh hold your horses there dude, that’s fake news! My justified criticism ... she’s not chief architect of Valiant’s downfall.
And yet you seem to blame Meyers and Antos for EVERYTHING including the "downfall".

They (Meyers & Antos!) can't be made responsible for anything before "Valiant Breakthrough".
Let me get this straight...the editor and chief editor on Livewire ... who is responsible for that?!
Or are you happy with the output?
Haha! You keep doing it. Fake news!

The downfall you mentioned. Who started it? Meyers and Antos? You're a hypocrite!
Guys, guys, don't make this so personal. DallowSpicer I was making a sort of joke just poking fun at your repeated mention of Heather. My apologies you took it as a stab not a poke. Someone here, and I'm not sure who, made a good point. If not who we've mentioned, then who?
He's trying to hard to find a way to blame Meyers and Antos.

Neither Robert Meyers nor Heather Antos hired Ayala and green-lit her pitch for the Livewire series, that was Joe Illidge who was "hand-picked" by Warren Simons. Neither Meyers nor Antos put Livewire in her miserable position in the first place, that was Eric Heisserer, among others. It's not they're fault either Valiant is in the hands of DMG now.

Valiant is having quality issues since 2016/17, long before the takeover. I liked Generation Zero but it certainly wasn't great. Harbinger Renegade wasn't great either. Where's Solomon and the Alpha? Who decided to ignore them and give us HW2 with Livewire killing thousands of innocent people? It was Heisserer's farewell gift to us, the Valiant fans. Did someone ever blame him for ruining one of the most intriguing characters? It's mind-blowing really, many around here keep telling themselves the prelude issue still is the best issue of the series, completely ignoring what it did to Livewire. There's a difference between being an anti-hero or being a mass murderer. How could any writer possibly write a reasonable follow-up, both realistic and great? You can't really get away with (mass) murder.

Anyhow, I'm as much a hypocrite. While I do like some of the current series--not saying they're great--I didn't even read all of Livewire. Midway through the sixth issue I decided to just skip through the rest without reading everything. But I don't blame Antos. At the end of the day comics are still being plotted and written by the writers. You either give them creative freedom or you simply decide to not accept the pitch in the first place--like LADOTH back in 2016, for instance. What if they had done it? What if they had let Dysart write his version of Generation Zero? We'll never know. They decided to let RR do Renegade instead, and A+A.

I don't envy Meyers and the creative people at Valiant at the moment.
This train has gotten off the tracks a while ago and the VU, as messy as it is at the moment, can't be fixed in a day. 12 months is a long time but Meyers hasn't been responsible for everything since mid-December, 2018. Besides, Simons wasn't hired the day before the Summer of Valiant either. He had an entire year to plan the relaunch and could build continuity from zero--actually from Shooter's origin stories. Meyers doesn't have that advantage, he's got to fix everything that's been broken at a time when they may not be given the same amount of money anymore.

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Dallow Spicer1 »

Meyers is in charge and has been been for what, a year? Are you saying he’s not responsible for any of the output? The Heather Antos ‘diversity over talent’ debate has been done to death on other threads, the evidence is there to see in the books, refuse to see it if you like.
Heisserer’s story for HW2 was changed and re-written last minute by Kindt so I’m not sure how closely you’ve been paying attention?

The previous regime put out some trash books at times (eg Gen Zero, Shadow Times) and also dabbled in left wing politics (Hillary on the front cover of Faith, Shadowman 4001ad for example) and I called that out at the time. But they also were responsible for many great books too, the current regime haven’t (LADOTH is a Dino/Simmons book). So not sure how I’m a hypocrite?

If Meyer’s delivers great books in 2020 then I’m on board but from the announcements I’ve yet to see a creative team that inspires confidence. Rai I’m hopefully will be good and the Visitor I’m optimistic for, but nothing else ..yet.

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by iggy101us »

Some original art from the original Doctor Tomorrow . . .

#7 cover
Image

#7 page 1 splash
Image

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by iggy101us »

Character model sheets signed by Bob Layton. I bought these off eBay years ago and they were unsigned. Bob was appearing at a nearby con and I brought these with me and asked him to sign them. He was surprised to see them after all these years.

Image

Image

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Sunlight on Snow »

Dallow Spicer1 wrote:Meyers is in charge and has been been for what, a year? Are you saying he’s not responsible for any of the output?
Sunlight on Snow wrote:They (Meyers & Antos!) can't be made responsible for anything before "Valiant Breakthrough".
Because some comics had already been planned and written (incl. LADOTH).

I'm saying Meyers may have the best job....just at the worst possible time. Nobody can fix everything in a day.
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:The Heather Antos ‘diversity over talent’ debate has been done to death on other threads, the evidence is there to see in the books, refuse to see it if you like.
I didn't bring it up here but your "justified criticism" is relative as you can't really prove anything. Nobody had to talk Ayala into creating a non-binary character. Again, she wasn't even hired by Meyers and Antos, and Antos was only an associate editor on LW #2-4.
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:Heisserer’s story for HW2 was changed and re-written last minute by Kindt so I’m not sure how closely you’ve been paying attention?
Pretty sure Livewire blacked out at the end of the Prelude issue that was still written by Heisserer. They changed the format from 4 double-sized books to 1 Prelude by Heisserer and 4+Aftermath by Kindt.

So much for paying attention.

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Sunlight on Snow »

iggy101us wrote:Some original art from the original Doctor Tomorrow . . .
:thumb:

Thanks for sharing.

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Dallow Spicer1 »

Sunlight on Snow wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:Meyers is in charge and has been been for what, a year? Are you saying he’s not responsible for any of the output?
Sunlight on Snow wrote:They (Meyers & Antos!) can't be made responsible for anything before "Valiant Breakthrough".
Because some comics had already been planned and written (incl. LADOTH).

I'm saying Meyers may have the best job....just at the worst possible time. Nobody can fix everything in a day.
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:The Heather Antos ‘diversity over talent’ debate has been done to death on other threads, the evidence is there to see in the books, refuse to see it if you like.
I didn't bring it up here but your "justified criticism" is relative as you can't really prove anything. Nobody had to talk Ayala into creating a non-binary character. Again, she wasn't even hired by Meyers and Antos, and Antos was only an associate editor on LW #2-4.
.
Yes some books were planned and written but many weren’t and ultimately he’s responsible for the output.

You brought up me ‘blaming’ Antos and I explained my criticism of her.

Are any books the result of Meyers? What about Fallen World, that was decent are we that one was him?

If Meyers delivers great books in 2020 then fantastic, but it’s his responsibility to select better writers.

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Sunlight on Snow »

Dallow Spicer1 wrote:You brought up me ‘blaming’ Antos and I explained my criticism of her.
Which isn't justified no matter what you and the other 1% may believe.

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Oxmyx »

Shadowman99 wrote:
Oxmyx wrote:
nonplayer wrote: I just hope dr tomorrow has a stethoscope or a sonic screwdriver.
I sure hope it's good. But instead of a stethoscope, I'm pulling for a Cerebral Bore myself.
You're still willing that cerebral bore to make its first VEI appearance eh? Well, I can't see it happening myself but I'll literally cheer out loud if ever it does (I'd love to see it back too) :lol: :high-five:
Haha. Question...have you seen a movie called UPGRADE? It has nanite cerebral bores that enter your nose...truly scary!
I've been looking everywhere for the ultra-rare Turok vs Blister issue. Anybody able to help me out?

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by Oxmyx »

Dallow, I hadn't known about the Hillary cover to Faith...that was something to see. A little disturbing, but noteworthy to see. Thanks for pointing it out.

Livewire has an alternative-gender character? Well, that explains the flavor of your criticism.
I've been looking everywhere for the ultra-rare Turok vs Blister issue. Anybody able to help me out?

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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by kjjohanson »

Oxmyx wrote:Dallow, I hadn't known about the Hillary cover to Faith...that was something to see. A little disturbing, but noteworthy to see. Thanks for pointing it out.

Livewire has an alternative-gender character? Well, that explains the flavor of your criticism.
The issue of Faith wasn't even explicitly political, as it didn't focus on policy as much as the historic context of the 1st female to be a major party's candidate. (Of course, it ignored the fact that we have the first mentally deranged candidate from a major party as well, so maybe equal time wasn't given)
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Re: Dr. Tomorrow

Post by kjjohanson »

Sunlight on Snow wrote:
Oxmyx wrote:
Sunlight on Snow wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:
Sunlight on Snow wrote:
Dallow Spicer1 wrote:Woahhh hold your horses there dude, that’s fake news! My justified criticism ... she’s not chief architect of Valiant’s downfall.
And yet you seem to blame Meyers and Antos for EVERYTHING including the "downfall".

They (Meyers & Antos!) can't be made responsible for anything before "Valiant Breakthrough".
Let me get this straight...the editor and chief editor on Livewire ... who is responsible for that?!
Or are you happy with the output?
Haha! You keep doing it. Fake news!

The downfall you mentioned. Who started it? Meyers and Antos? You're a hypocrite!
Guys, guys, don't make this so personal. DallowSpicer I was making a sort of joke just poking fun at your repeated mention of Heather. My apologies you took it as a stab not a poke. Someone here, and I'm not sure who, made a good point. If not who we've mentioned, then who?
He's trying to hard to find a way to blame Meyers and Antos.

Neither Robert Meyers nor Heather Antos hired Ayala and green-lit her pitch for the Livewire series, that was Joe Illidge who was "hand-picked" by Warren Simons. Neither Meyers nor Antos put Livewire in her miserable position in the first place, that was Eric Heisserer, among others. It's not they're fault either Valiant is in the hands of DMG now.

Valiant is having quality issues since 2016/17, long before the takeover. I liked Generation Zero but it certainly wasn't great. Harbinger Renegade wasn't great either. Where's Solomon and the Alpha? Who decided to ignore them and give us HW2 with Livewire killing thousands of innocent people? It was Heisserer's farewell gift to us, the Valiant fans. Did someone ever blame him for ruining one of the most intriguing characters? It's mind-blowing really, many around here keep telling themselves the prelude issue still is the best issue of the series, completely ignoring what it did to Livewire. There's a difference between being an anti-hero or being a mass murderer. How could any writer possibly write a reasonable follow-up, both realistic and great? You can't really get away with (mass) murder.

Anyhow, I'm as much a hypocrite. While I do like some of the current series--not saying they're great--I didn't even read all of Livewire. Midway through the sixth issue I decided to just skip through the rest without reading everything. But I don't blame Antos. At the end of the day comics are still being plotted and written by the writers. You either give them creative freedom or you simply decide to not accept the pitch in the first place--like LADOTH back in 2016, for instance. What if they had done it? What if they had let Dysart write his version of Generation Zero? We'll never know. They decided to let RR do Renegade instead, and A+A.

I don't envy Meyers and the creative people at Valiant at the moment.
This train has gotten off the tracks a while ago and the VU, as messy as it is at the moment, can't be fixed in a day. 12 months is a long time but Meyers hasn't been responsible for everything since mid-December, 2018. Besides, Simons wasn't hired the day before the Summer of Valiant either. He had an entire year to plan the relaunch and could build continuity from zero--actually from Shooter's origin stories. Meyers doesn't have that advantage, he's got to fix everything that's been broken at a time when they may not be given the same amount of money anymore.
This is the crux of the problem. Simons had to get a stationary train moving. Meyers had to jump onto a movie train that lost its driver and make sure that it got to its destination. I'm nto going to opine on which is more difficult, but the *visible* problems are more obvious with the latter.

There have been a lot of complaints about:
• the creative teams on the current books, and
• the lack of major characters that currently have books

I imagine that the two are connected. You still have to have output for the line while planning for the future. Having a bunch of minis may be a way to keep the output going while figuring out how to mold the line for the future, picking up from where the last crew left off. I imagine there would be a lot more hemming and hawing if Ayala had been handed an X-O ongoing rather than a character that had only been a team-book character thus far.
If you're not a *SQUEE*, you're okay with me.


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