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 Post subject: Incursion
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 5:58:41 am 
Personal shoe-shopper for Atom!
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Well, one of the things we’ve been talking about in the Valiant Beyond Initiative is Incursion. Incursion is a mini-series that is going to be written by Andy Diggle and we brought on co-writer Alex Paknadel, and so now the two of them are gonna be writing it together. Alex Paknadel has a lot of great work for Vault Comics, BOOM! Studios, Titan, and we’re really excited about the story that he and Andy have crafted, which focuses on the Eternal Warrior, the geomancer, and it’s going to reignite those characters for a new audience and Doug Braithwaite, who is our exclusive artist, is doing some of the best work of his career, and José Villarrubia, one of the best illustrators and colorists in American comics is coloring it and we’re very happy and excited about that. As you may know, we’re heading towards the 30th Anniversary of Valiant which is huge, so we have a lot of big plans and we’re gonna be rolling out news in the coming weeks and months which is really going to speak to the future of Valiant.


from interview on Multiversity http://www.multiversitycomics.com/interviews/nycc-18-joseph-illidge-valiant/


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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 7:31:17 am 
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Well that's interesting...Based on all the info previously on what Incursion would be about, I assumed that it would be a story focused on Shadowman, X-O, and/or Divinity....But apparently it's another mini-series bringing Gilad and the Geomancer back into the spotlight. Even more curious now on what this will be about


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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:14:39 am 
Especially "dude." And "balls." Those terms work in the tech industry.
Especially "dude." And "balls." Those terms work in the tech industry.
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I'll miss Divinity.

I'll miss David Baron.

I'm not super interested in another series that will "reignite the characters for a new audience."

I do like Braithwaite, Gilad and Tama. Maybe it will pick up well after Rapture.


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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:42:21 am 
Nice art! (I used to own that.)
Nice art! (I used to own that.)
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Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2004 11:11:13 am
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Valiant fan since: 1992
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Favorite artist: Lewis LaRosa
Looks interesting. Braithwaite is one of their best artists and I love his work.
I'm a little nervous they felt they needed to bring in a co-writer. Why is this necessary on a 4 issue mini-series?
Dan

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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:45:20 am 
Just jumpin' through time arcs, that's all.
Just jumpin' through time arcs, that's all.
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sonicdan wrote:
Looks interesting. Braithwaite is one of their best artists and I love his work.
I'm a little nervous they felt they needed to bring in a co-writer. Why is this necessary on a 4 issue mini-series?
Dan


Do you think the co-writer could be launching an ongoing coming out of the mini?


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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 10:46:41 am 
Nice art! (I used to own that.)
Nice art! (I used to own that.)
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Joined: Wed Feb 04, 2004 11:11:13 am
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Valiant fan since: 1992
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Favorite artist: Lewis LaRosa
Here are a couple Incursion images that were posted (potentially spoiler-ish):

http://sonicdan.com/Valiantart/2018/IncursionRDLT.jpg

http://sonicdan.com/Valiantart/2018/IncursionRDLTc.jpg

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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 11:03:41 am 
Rockin' out in Torquehalla
Rockin' out in Torquehalla
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Joined: Fri Jun 03, 2016 12:03:41 pm
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Valiant fan since: ECCC April 2016
Favorite character: Bloodshot/Ninjak/Divinity
Favorite title: Divinity/BS Reborn/Britannia
Favorite writer: Kindt/Lemire/Roberts
Favorite artist: All of them, really
jaden_sai wrote:
sonicdan wrote:
Looks interesting. Braithwaite is one of their best artists and I love his work.
I'm a little nervous they felt they needed to bring in a co-writer. Why is this necessary on a 4 issue mini-series?
Dan


Do you think the co-writer could be launching an ongoing coming out of the mini?


THIS was exactly my thought reading through this! There has been a good deal of hype (on twitter) revolving around EW, and I firmly believe that he will return to an ongoing here soon (sometime next year). This would be an excellent way to give Alex Paknadel a feel for Tama and EW and how the Valiant universe runs.

If this fails as a mini, well we won't hear from Alex again, but I don't think it will fail. EW is so close to returning in Ninja-K, and that series is almost done, this has to be the next step!

Incursion, Earth will again need her hero to step up and protect Her!

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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 12:56:08 pm 
Is it Dee-no or Die-no? Dunno.
Is it Dee-no or Die-no? Dunno.
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Joined: Thu May 11, 2017 5:20:12 pm
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Favorite character: Gilad
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sonicdan wrote:
Here are a couple Incursion images that were posted (potentially spoiler-ish):

http://sonicdan.com/Valiantart/2018/IncursionRDLT.jpg

http://sonicdan.com/Valiantart/2018/IncursionRDLTc.jpg

I wonder if that's the Forever Queen in the flipped image?

Also this was in the recent preview book: https://scontent.fphx1-1.fna.fbcdn.net/ ... e=5C835BC0


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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 1:23:47 pm 
I could be talking poo-doo.
I could be talking poo-doo.
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Joined: Tue Mar 13, 2012 7:47:04 pm
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Valiant fan since: 1992
Favorite character: Ninjak
Favorite title: Imperium/Timewalker
Favorite writer: Joshua Dysart/FVL
Favorite artist: Clay Mann
Didn’t the original teaser for incursion have some Cthulhu like creature heading toward earth from outer space?

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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 1:31:13 pm 
Clinkin' bottles with Aram
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nycjadie wrote:
I'll miss Divinity.

I'll miss David Baron.

I'm not super interested in another series that will "reignite the characters for a new audience."

I do like Braithwaite, Gilad and Tama. Maybe it will pick up well after Rapture.

I'm sorry to hear that you're disappointed that this series isn't going to centre on Divinity. I have to admit, seeing the issue #1 cover art I had this pegged as an event focusing on either Divinity or XO Manowar, so I was somewhat looking forward to more Divinity myself.

Having said that, I've loved every VEI EW comic that's come out to date and am even now disappointed that the character hasn't been able to float its own series for the long term. Which is why, unlike you, I'm pleased to see that there's going to be a new attempt to "reignite the characters for a new audience." That is EXACTLY what this character needs, and anyone who's willing to take a stab at succeeding at developing a new audience for EW is good by me, because then I'll get to read more EW comics :thumb:

I've got nothing but enthusiasm for that attitude.

I'm also curious to know what it was about the statment that rubbed you up the wrong way?

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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 3:00:10 pm 
Especially "dude." And "balls." Those terms work in the tech industry.
Especially "dude." And "balls." Those terms work in the tech industry.
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I don't know that the statement rubbed me the wrong way, but there seems to be a recurring theme with new series that they are meant to attract new audiences. I don't know that the two go hand in hand. It also doesn't address the potential loss of losing existing audiences. None of us really want another Bloodshot origin story. When the movie comes out, it's likely we'll see another one.

Another EW story sounds awesome. I love Tama. A new creative team is good too. Another rehash is what I'm more concerned about. Most people who pick up the book know enough about the character to not need origin.


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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 4:27:54 pm 
I think you might be a closeted Canadian.
I think you might be a closeted Canadian.
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I thought this thread was about all the Canadians joining the board recently...

Still warrants a good scan for encoded messages...

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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Mon Oct 29, 2018 8:00:21 pm 
Harbinger rank: Nensei
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Joined: Sun Sep 28, 2014 11:43:20 pm
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Valiant fan since: 1991
Favorite character: Ninjak
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Favorite artist: Lewis Larosa
Shadowman99 wrote:
nycjadie wrote:
I'll miss Divinity.

I'll miss David Baron.

I'm not super interested in another series that will "reignite the characters for a new audience."

I do like Braithwaite, Gilad and Tama. Maybe it will pick up well after Rapture.

I'm sorry to hear that you're disappointed that this series isn't going to centre on Divinity. I have to admit, seeing the issue #1 cover art I had this pegged as an event focusing on either Divinity or XO Manowar, so I was somewhat looking forward to more Divinity myself.

Having said that, I've loved every VEI EW comic that's come out to date and am even now disappointed that the character hasn't been able to float its own series for the long term. Which is why, unlike you, I'm pleased to see that there's going to be a new attempt to "reignite the characters for a new audience." That is EXACTLY what this character needs, and anyone who's willing to take a stab at succeeding at developing a new audience for EW is good by me, because then I'll get to read more EW comics :thumb:

I've got nothing but enthusiasm for that attitude.

I'm also curious to know what it was about the statment that rubbed you up the wrong way?


I'm cautiously excited for this series. I think after the disappointment of HW2 and all the changes, this is the real first series the new team are in control of. I hope it does well. I'm looking forward to seeing EW and Tama launch from here into their own series, a bit like Bloodshot did from The Valiant.

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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:15:01 am 
Harbinger rank: Shinia
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Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2016 7:20:02 pm
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Details removed at the request of the person at Valiant who told them to me. Don't want to get anyone in trouble.


Last edited by syzhang28 on Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:14:00 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:32:47 am 
Clinkin' bottles with Aram
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nycjadie wrote:
I don't know that the statement rubbed me the wrong way, but there seems to be a recurring theme with new series that they are meant to attract new audiences. I don't know that the two go hand in hand. It also doesn't address the potential loss of losing existing audiences. None of us really want another Bloodshot origin story. When the movie comes out, it's likely we'll see another one.

Another EW story sounds awesome. I love Tama. A new creative team is good too. Another rehash is what I'm more concerned about. Most people who pick up the book know enough about the character to not need origin.

I agree that we don't need any kind of rehash of events already passed, and certainly nothing in relation to any kind of origin story for EW.

Whilst there's a dedicated fanbase to nuture too (although we're not all 'all in' by far, are we?), Valiant is by no means beyond any kind of stage where it needs to cease efforts to increase its number of regular consumers, so I think that any time a new series is announced, one primary goal of doing so surely has to be 'to attract a new audience and continue expanding the Valiant readership (thereby sustaining the company's capacity to continue existing)'? Additionally, launching new comics is an opportunity to get both existing and new readers interested in the character that the title centers upon, and to recapture readers of previous series featuring the character in question by producing a 'better' story, so I think that does somewhat attempt to address the problem of lost readership doesn't it?

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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 7:37:01 am 
Clinkin' bottles with Aram
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syzhang28 wrote:
Word from NYCC was that this was a Shadowman story that Warren, Dinesh and Diggle were working on. DMG/Valiant liked the idea so much they made it a 12 issue event and mandated major characters be added (X-O?). It was then reduced to 4 issues. Then the major characters that were asked to be added were removed. Then Shadowman was asked to be removed and replaced with Eternal Warrior so Diggle got upset which is why another writer was brought on board. Many writers were asked from the usual Valiant stable but all turned it down.

Is there any evidence of this?

In total honesty, this chain of events, resulting in publication of a title, seems highly unlikely to me. I just can't see any project that has been through this degree of disfigurement ever getting the green light for publication. I mean, swapping out the main character that the entire story centres upon for another: how can that possibly make any sense? :?

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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:10:25 am 
Especially "dude." And "balls." Those terms work in the tech industry.
Especially "dude." And "balls." Those terms work in the tech industry.
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syzhang28 wrote:
Word from NYCC was that this was a Shadowman story that Warren, Dinesh and Diggle were working on. DMG/Valiant liked the idea so much they made it a 12 issue event and mandated major characters be added (X-O?). It was then reduced to 4 issues. Then the major characters that were asked to be added were removed. Then Shadowman was asked to be removed and replaced with Eternal Warrior so Diggle got upset which is why another writer was brought on board. Many writers were asked from the usual Valiant stable but all turned it down.


!

I get not wanting it to be another Shadowman title with one going on right now, but if the characterization of these changes are accurate, I'd be more than a bit frustrated as a writer.


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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 8:22:30 am 
Especially "dude." And "balls." Those terms work in the tech industry.
Especially "dude." And "balls." Those terms work in the tech industry.
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Shadowman99 wrote:
nycjadie wrote:
I don't know that the statement rubbed me the wrong way, but there seems to be a recurring theme with new series that they are meant to attract new audiences. I don't know that the two go hand in hand. It also doesn't address the potential loss of losing existing audiences. None of us really want another Bloodshot origin story. When the movie comes out, it's likely we'll see another one.

Another EW story sounds awesome. I love Tama. A new creative team is good too. Another rehash is what I'm more concerned about. Most people who pick up the book know enough about the character to not need origin.

I agree that we don't need any kind of rehash of events already passed, and certainly nothing in relation to any kind of origin story for EW.

Whilst there's a dedicated fanbase to nuture too (although we're not all 'all in' by far, are we?), Valiant is by no means beyond any kind of stage where it needs to cease efforts to increase its number of regular consumers, so I think that any time a new series is announced, one primary goal of doing so surely has to be 'to attract a new audience and continue expanding the Valiant readership (thereby sustaining the company's capacity to continue existing)'? Additionally, launching new comics is an opportunity to get both existing and new readers interested in the character that the title centers upon, and to recapture readers of previous series featuring the character in question by producing a 'better' story, so I think that does somewhat attempt to address the problem of lost readership doesn't it?


I totally get that, but I'm not sure I see the data that that's true. There are a certain amount of folks who will say they picked up the first issue, etc., found Valiant or Marvel or whatever by reading something. But I think that's true with any reader of comics no matter whether it's a #1 or a #203. I certainly didn't need to read Uncanny X-Men #1 to start the series. I picked up issue 203. No origin. Just story.

I also just don't see the metrics supporting the premise that new series bring new readers beyond the first issue or 2. We can look at publication numbers. I'd say there are probably 4-5K regular Valiant readers of any given title. The first issue bumps into the 15K range or higher, and then falls back down to 4-5K except for the flagship titles. Maybe you get a few new readers, and lose a few regulars. That's normal. The one constant is the 4-5K regular readers.

Now, if you are talking about trade readers, then I don't think rehashing makes sense at all either. Folks that want the origin story will buy that. After that, they want developing characters and stories. Not origin. No rehash. Maybe you can do that every once in a blue moon with a Weapon X/Bloodshot Rising story, but you also need development of those characters, something that Jeff Lemire is very good at. My kids want to read the origin of Batman, and then they want to know what Batman does after that, and all the great villain stories that he encountered.


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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 12:04:54 pm 
Completely ruined the ending of Last Jedi: The Force Reloaded of the Green Gables 8 -- This Time, It's Really Really Personal (In Space).
Completely ruined the ending of Last Jedi: The Force Reloaded of the Green Gables 8 -- This Time, It's Really Really Personal (In Space).

Joined: Thu Nov 10, 2016 3:08:41 pm
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Location: Hollywood, Florida
Valiant fan since: 2013
Favorite character: Animalia
Favorite title: X-O Manowar
The reason why I started reading Valiant was because of the VEI relaunch. The reason why I got into DC was because of the New 52. Line wide relaunches will always have bigger impacts than new #1s. They're legitimate fresh slates with the promise of allowing you to be there to watch the universe grow. New #1s just cause everything to lose momentum. Same problem happens when you change the creative team.

The addition of a co-writer, and the change in focus to Eternal Warrior doesn't bode well for me. This is literally the third time that the creative team for a DMG/Valiant book changed prior/during publication. All of the initial buzz for Incursion heavily implied it was going to be a crossover event that would finally have Shadowman mingle with the mainstream Valiant Universe. They kept talking about how Incursion was part of Diggle's larger Shadowman plan, and then they change the scale of the conflict and bring in a different writer.

Why would Diggle ask for a co-writer, if clearly he already had his own version of the story worked out months ago? Why did the creative team for Bloodshot Project Rising Spirit bail on the project after literally the first issue? Feels like the same thing is happening that happened with Harbinger Wars II. They *SQUEE* off the main writer during production of the book, after it was announced, and now they're going to publish it anyway despite the fact that the original writer clearly doesn't want to work with them anymore. If something like this happened at Marvel or DC the book would probably be cancelled outright, but Valiant can't afford to do that because of their limited publishing slate. If they cancelled Bloodshot Project Rising Spirit after the creative team left then they'd be down one ongoing series, and have nothing Bloodshot related on the shelves when the movie comes out in 16 months. I don't see how DMG/Valiant is going to bring in new readers if they can't successfully get new books off the ground. We used to wonder when Valiant would expand was the 9 book limit. Now I'm just sitting here wondering if DMG can even manage to maintain 5 books per month.


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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Tue Oct 30, 2018 2:09:24 pm 
Just jumpin' through time arcs, that's all.
Just jumpin' through time arcs, that's all.

Joined: Sat Sep 15, 2012 9:16:04 pm
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Valiant fan since: back in the day xo#9
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Favorite title: Divinity, savage,
Favorite writer: Joshua dysart
Favorite artist: Robert Gill
My hope that dmg will do good with the charaters and story have dwindled away. Im holding on because of nostalgia and my continuing collections since I was a kid.
Dmg needs a slam dunk and quick

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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2018 3:48:59 am 
Harbinger rank: Shinia
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Shadowman99 wrote:
syzhang28 wrote:
Word from NYCC was that this was a Shadowman story that Warren, Dinesh and Diggle were working on. DMG/Valiant liked the idea so much they made it a 12 issue event and mandated major characters be added (X-O?). It was then reduced to 4 issues. Then the major characters that were asked to be added were removed. Then Shadowman was asked to be removed and replaced with Eternal Warrior so Diggle got upset which is why another writer was brought on board. Many writers were asked from the usual Valiant stable but all turned it down.

Is there any evidence of this?

In total honesty, this chain of events, resulting in publication of a title, seems highly unlikely to me. I just can't see any project that has been through this degree of disfigurement ever getting the green light for publication. I mean, swapping out the main character that the entire story centres upon for another: how can that possibly make any sense? :?


It may seem unlikely but look at the preview they just put out. I think it will fill in a few gaps here.


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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Fri Nov 02, 2018 2:28:59 pm 
I could be talking poo-doo.
I could be talking poo-doo.
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syzhang28 wrote:
Shadowman99 wrote:
syzhang28 wrote:
Word from NYCC was that this was a Shadowman story that Warren, Dinesh and Diggle were working on. DMG/Valiant liked the idea so much they made it a 12 issue event and mandated major characters be added (X-O?). It was then reduced to 4 issues. Then the major characters that were asked to be added were removed. Then Shadowman was asked to be removed and replaced with Eternal Warrior so Diggle got upset which is why another writer was brought on board. Many writers were asked from the usual Valiant stable but all turned it down.

Is there any evidence of this?

In total honesty, this chain of events, resulting in publication of a title, seems highly unlikely to me. I just can't see any project that has been through this degree of disfigurement ever getting the green light for publication. I mean, swapping out the main character that the entire story centres upon for another: how can that possibly make any sense? :?


It may seem unlikely but look at the preview they just put out. I think it will fill in a few gaps here.


If they’re trying to pitch something in TV or film dealing with EW, it makes sense to want the character back out there.

I definitely remember when it was announced that it was tied to Shadowman.

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 Post subject: Re: Incursion
PostPosted: Thu Nov 08, 2018 6:03:50 pm 
Is it Dee-no or Die-no? Dunno.
Is it Dee-no or Die-no? Dunno.
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Valiant fan since: 2016
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Favorite title: Wrath
Favorite writer: Venditti
Favorite artist: CAFU
They're doing a pre-order bundle for this?

http://www.outrightgeekery.com/2018/11/ ... er-bundle/


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