VALIANT MAY 2018 SALES

[agent_graves]

103 Harbinger Wars 2 1* $3.99 Valiant 22,621... Opps, forgot this one, I guess combined, (prelude+1) it’s not so bad. Still low for “Summer Event”...

190 Shadowman 3 $3.99 Valiant 9,883... Slipped a bit but still outsold the prelude to the summer event

201 Harbinger Wars 2 Prelude 1 $3.99 Valiant 9,261... Dud!?

202 X-O Manowar 15 $3.99 Valiant 9,118... Holding steady

214 Bloodshot Salvation 9 $3.99 Valiant 8,495... +371 from prior month

246 Ninja-K 7 $3.99 Valiant 6,733... Still dropping over 1k a month

267 Quantum & Woody 6 $3.99 Valiant 5,390... Same as above

316 Valiant High 1 $3.99 Valiant 4,078... Digital first so, I’m assuming all physical copies are a plus

[TheeBaldMoose]

surprised a little, I thought the Q&W would have been a little better...

[Zhuge1]

246 Ninja-K 7 $3.99 Valiant 6,733... Still dropping over 1k a month

267 Quantum & Woody 6 $3.99 Valiant 5,390... Same as above

316 Valiant High 1 $3.99 Valiant 4,078... Digital first so, I’m assuming all physical copies are a plus

These are the ones most surprising to me. I wouldn't have expected Valiant High to do quite so well or Ninja-K and Q&W to fall quite so much.

[nycjadie]

Q&W 1:50. I'm calling it.

[syzhang28]

This is disappointing. Especially because this is an important month as a sign of things to come. This is the first month of sales after Dinesh was no longer steering the ship. In a few months we'll see that the quality of the stories are without Dinesh and Warren too.

Harbinger Wars 2 is very disappointing but also not surprising since there was little marketing once DMG took over and the reading order became very confusing after DMG changed the original teams double sized idea. I think this is lower than Armor Hunters, Book of Death, 4001 and also lower than many ongoing series launches like X-O Manowar.

The prelude especially is a big misfire. The first of it's kind from Valiant since they came back? Have we seen them launch something of this size under 10k?

X-O Manowar and Bloodshot are holding steady but Ninja-k and Quantum & Woody are dropping fast. I can't help but think that's because the original team (Hunter, Atom, Warren, Dinesh etc) were there to make sure the earlier two titles were stable but not there for the later too. Seems the second arc is where Valiant used to push hard and stabilize an ongoing. I think we will see Shadowman do as poorly in it's later arcs.

Valiant High is also very low but it is probably all gravy as you say.

103 Harbinger Wars 2 1* $3.99 Valiant 22,621... Opps, forgot this one, I guess combined, (prelude+1) it’s not so bad. Still low for “Summer Event”...

190 Shadowman 3 $3.99 Valiant 9,883... Slipped a bit but still outsold the prelude to the summer event

201 Harbinger Wars 2 Prelude 1 $3.99 Valiant 9,261... Dud!?

202 X-O Manowar 15 $3.99 Valiant 9,118... Holding steady

214 Bloodshot Salvation 9 $3.99 Valiant 8,495... +371 from prior month

246 Ninja-K 7 $3.99 Valiant 6,733... Still dropping over 1k a month

267 Quantum & Woody 6 $3.99 Valiant 5,390... Same as above

316 Valiant High 1 $3.99 Valiant 4,078... Digital first so, I’m assuming all physical copies are a plus

[TheFerg714]

Really not wanting to be a negative Nancy, but this is seriously bad news. X-O is doing fine, so that's good. Shadowman's still doing very well, but no one knows what will happen with the next arc Salvation is doing well (for some reason), but it's ending in a few months. Q&W didn't get a boost at all from being a new arc or "tying into" the big event, so that will end soon. And similarly, Ninja-K didn't get a sales boost from it's latest arc, and now it's down into cancellation numbers, and the story is kicking *SQUEE*, so I don't really see that going anywhere else but down.

And on top of all that, HW2 is doing awful. 10k is, unequivocally, NOT a good start, and obviously the prelude to even worse, just like every other one-shot Valiant produces.

I think, it's over guys... I really don't see Beyond Valiant doing much better, so where do you go after that?

[agent_graves]

7 titles=71,501

10.2k* Avg per book...

*Edit..

[BugsySig]

8 titles=75,579

9.4k Avg per book...

Isn’t that just as good or better than average for them? I don’t keep up with the numbers as much as I used to, but any average around 10k is pretty good for a small publisher.

But, y’know, DOOM!

[grendeljd]

8 titles=75,579

9.4k Avg per book...

Isn’t that just as good or better than average for them? I don’t keep up with the numbers as much as I used to, but any average around 10k is pretty good for a small publisher.

But, y’know, DOOM!

Agreed - on average, still pretty solid for where Valiant is at. And a nice boost from the actual 1st issue of HW2.

I am scratching my head over the Ninja-K drop, this title has been generally outstanding - personally it has been my favourite Ninjak series to date, reaching &/or exceeding the same heights that the best issues of Kindt's run did. I don't understand why more people aren't staying with it into the second story arc.

[Ryan]

8 titles=75,579

9.4k Avg per book...

Isn’t that just as good or better than average for them? I don’t keep up with the numbers as much as I used to, but any average around 10k is pretty good for a small publisher.

But, y’know, DOOM!

I think every small publisher is going to be different. A lot of Image books are done by small teams of ppl with other jobs or with little overhead so maybe selling 5,000 is enough to break even for everyone or pay rent. Valiant employs professionals at every level and has NYC offices with editorial and marketing staffs etc? It's a little bit of a different ballgame.

A month with a new #1 should always be a little higher, especially since it's the beginning of a summer event. The overall market is depressed so it can't be a good sign that HW 2 #1 can't even crack the top 100.

[BugsySig]

8 titles=75,579

9.4k Avg per book...

Isn’t that just as good or better than average for them? I don’t keep up with the numbers as much as I used to, but any average around 10k is pretty good for a small publisher.

But, y’know, DOOM!

I think every small publisher is going to be different. A lot of Image books are done by small teams of ppl with other jobs or with little overhead so maybe selling 5,000 is enough to break even for everyone or pay rent. Valiant employs professionals at every level and has NYC offices with editorial and marketing staffs etc? It's a little bit of a different ballgame.

A month with a new #1 should always be a little higher, especially since it's the beginning of a summer event. The overall market is depressed so it can't be a good sign that HW 2 #1 can't even crack the top 100.

I think it’s more a case of poor marketing and promotion. A major casualty of the DMG takeover. What is HW2? I’m still not sure I have any idea what it’s about. Where’d the Alpha go? There’s no Harbinger or even Secret Weapons book leading into it. Heiserer’s book got axed. It’s a mess.

Those Image books make little to no money. Very few do (TWD, Saga, a few exceptions of course). Other mid-tier publishers make their profit off licensed properties. We’ve had the discussion before but we’ll never know what VALIANT’s overhead is. What we do know is they managed to stay in business for 6 plus yrs. Granted, DMG took over when their investment couldn’t be paid back by VEI, but we also don’t know where that original loan money went into (film/tv development, etc).

What I do know is there are many small publishers that sell a lot fewer books than VALIANT, and manage to stay afloat. Some even have licensing fees to pay on top of their overhead, which VALIANT doesn’t. VALIANT also has a lot more sources of income than a lot of them: merchandise, trade and digital sales, international and foreign language sales, and their own licensing deals.

The numbers aren’t great, but they’re not terrible, and they’re not going down overall. Basically they’ve carved a niche in the market, but can they ever grow past that niche? DMG seems to believe, maybe rightly so, that the only way to do that is through tv and film adaptations. So we will have to wait and see. If the publishing arm isn’t profitable, and they can’t hit on a movie or tv show, they’ll likely pull the plug and start licensing VALIANT (DMG) properties out to the highest bidder, and before we know it it’ll be Dynamite presents the VALIANT UNIVERSE.

[TheFerg714]

8 titles=75,579

9.4k Avg per book...

Yea, that looks fine when you don't take mitigating factors into account. X-O, Shadowman, and Salvation are literally the only books doing exceedingly well for Valiant. The problem is that one of those is ending soon, one of them is entering it's second arc (which has proven to not engender many more sales in Valiant's latest ongoings), and who knows how people are going to feel about a 4-month flashback in X-O.

I just love that DMG was so scared of HW2 failing that, instead of just marketing better, they simply slashed the budget in half. Of course, the blame can't fully be at DMG's feet. In 2017, Valiant (imo) did such an amazing job of bringing all of it's core characters back to the forefront and really gaining back some trust from the audience, but meanwhile, they completely squandered the lead-up to HW2. I honestly don't know what VEI and Dinesh were thinking...

[syzhang28]

8 titles=75,579

9.4k Avg per book...

Yea, that looks fine when you don't take mitigating factors into account. X-O, Shadowman, and Salvation are literally the only books doing exceedingly well for Valiant. The problem is that one of those is ending soon, one of them is entering it's second arc (which has proven to not engender many more sales in Valiant's latest ongoings), and who knows how people are going to feel about a 4-month flashback in X-O.

I just love that DMG was so scared of HW2 failing that, instead of just marketing better, they simply slashed the budget in half. Of course, the blame can't fully be at DMG's feet. In 2017, Valiant (imo) did such an amazing job of bringing all of it's core characters back to the forefront and really gaining back some trust from the audience, but meanwhile, they completely squandered the lead-up to HW2. I honestly don't know what VEI and Dinesh were thinking...

The lead up to Harbinger Wars 2 should have begun in Jan of 2018 which is when Dinesh was pushed out. If they started earlier they would have peaked too early and they had to market the launches of Bloodshot Salvation, Ninja-K and Quantum & Woody all at the end of 2017. Of anything we can say about Dinesh and VEI (and we can say great books, great creators, great fan relations etc etc etc) we can't argue that they marketing and promoted as well as anyone. Especially the events. Do we really think if Dinesh wasn't in charge from Jan to now that Harbinger Wars 2 wouldn't have been everywhere.

Also, 9.4k average is fine...if you aren't launching a tentpole crossover for the year (with 2 issues in the same month) in the middle of the summer.

[agent_graves]

8 titles=75,579

9.4k Avg per book...

Isn’t that just as good or better than average for them? I don’t keep up with the numbers as much as I used to, but any average around 10k is pretty good for a small publisher.

But, y’know, DOOM!

I don’t think I’ve mentioned DOOM & GLOOM in any of my post, EVER.... But for comparisons sake, let’s take a look at the numbers. I left out Image, because that wouldn’t be fair, and would of took way too long, and I’m at work, lol. Also, only top 300, and no really small publishers. So....

Aftershock
179 Walk Through Hell 1 $3.99 Aftershock 10,877
260 Dark Ark 6 $3.99 Aftershock 5,602
263 Pestilence Story of Satan 1 $3.99 Aftershock 5,534

3 titles=22,013 (7.3k avg) Per book..


Archie
175 Vampironica 2 $3.99 Archie 11,652
228 Jughead The Hunger 6 $3.99 Archie 7,727

2 titles=19,379 (9.6k avg) Per book...


Boom Studios
133 Mighty Morphin Power Rangers 27 $3.99 Boom 18,047
154 Go Go Power Rangers 9 $3.99 Boom 14,190
189 Jim Henson Labyrinth Coronation 4 $3.99 Boom 9,909
193 Coda 1 $3.99 Boom 9,773
235 Jim Henson Fraggle Rock 1 $3.99 Boom 7,390
290 Robocop Citizens Arrest 2 $3.99 Boom 4,697
292 Adventure Time Beginning of End 1 $3.99 Boom 4,647

7 titles=68,653 (9.8k avg) Per book...

Dark Horse
139 Xerxes Fall of House of Darius 2 $4.99 Dark Horse 16,840
153 Neil Gaiman American Gods My Ainsel 3 $3.99 Dark Horse 14,500
174 Black Hammer Age of Doom 2* $3.99 Dark Horse 11,690
195 Doctor Star & Kingdom Lost Tomorrows 3 $3.99 Dark Horse 9,663
207 Blackwood 1* $3.99 Dark Horse 8,667
231 BPRD Devil You Know 6 $3.99 Dark Horse 7,531
233 Ether Copper Golems 1* $3.99 Dark Horse 7,453
236 Buffy the Vampire Slayer Season 11 Giles 4 $3.99 Dark Horse 7,330
254 Koshchei The Deathless 5 $3.99 Dark Horse 6,065
271 World of Tanks Citadel 1 $3.99 Dark Horse 5,254
278 Witchfinder Gates of Heaven 1 $3.99 Dark Horse 4,912
294 Usagi Yojimbo 3 $3.99 Dark Horse 4,623
299 Harrow County 31 $3.99 Dark Horse 4,485

13 titles=109,013 8.3k avg Per book...

Dynamite
142 Red Sonja Tarzan 1 $3.99 Dynamite 16,371
200 Red Sonja 15 $3.99 Dynamite 9,355
253 Barbarella 6 $3.99 Dynamite 6,148
256 Dejah Thoris 4 $3.99 Dynamite 5,981
272 Kiss Aod 4 $3.99 Dynamite 5,222
276 James Bond The Body 5 $3.99 Dynamite 5,004
279 Savage Tales Vampirella One Shot 1 $4.99 Dynamite 4,892
284 Sheena 9 $3.99 Dynamite 4,824
291 Xena 4 $3.99 Dynamite 4,659
296 Legenderry Red Sonja 4 $3.99 Dynamite 4,591

10 titles=67,047 6.7k avg Per book... I’m sure this’ll make most if not all happy!

IDW
159 TMNT Urban Legends 1 $3.99 IDW 12,735
163 Sonic The Hedgehog 5 $3.99 IDW 12,561
172 Star Wars Adventures 10 $3.99 IDW 11,917
176 Star Trek TNG Through The Mirror 1 $3.99 IDW 11,508
177 TMNT Ongoing 82 $3.99 IDW 11,207
184 Star Trek TNG Through The Mirror 2 $3.99 IDW 10,271
188 Star Trek TNG Through The Mirror 3 $3.99 IDW 9,927
194 Star Trek TNG Through The Mirror 4 $3.99 IDW 9,747
197 Star Trek Tng Through The Mirror 5 $3.99 IDW 9,602
211 My Little Pony Friendship Is Magic 66 $3.99 IDW 8,542
217 My Little Pony Ponyville Mysteries 1 $3.99 IDW 8,304
219 TMNT Universe 22 $4.99 IDW 8,103
220 G.I. Joe a Real American Hero 252 $3.99 IDW 8,096
227 Bubba Ho-Tep & Cosmic Blood-Suckers 1* $3.99 IDW 7,752
239 G.I. Joe a Real American Hero 251 $3.99 IDW 7,052
247 Star Trek Discovery 4* $3.99 IDW 6,505
251 Star Trek Discovery Succession 2 $3.99 IDW 6,215
266 Optimus Prime 19 $3.99 IDW 5,399
268 Judge Dredd Under Siege 1 $3.99 IDW 5,343
297 Crow Memento Mori 3 $3.99 IDW 4,544
300 Back to the Future Time Train 5 $3.99 IDW 4,471

21 books=179,801 (8.5k) avg Per book...

Oni Press
124 Rick & Morty 38 $3.99 Oni 18,986
222 Invader Zim 30 $3.99 Oni 8,025

2 titles=27,011 (13.5k) avg Per book...

[agent_graves]

Indy Publishers Top 300 Avg Units Per Book

Oni Press 13.5k avg
Valiant 10.2k avg*
Boom 9.8K avg
Archie 9.6k avg
IDW 8.5k avg
Dark Horse 8.3k avg
Aftershock 7.3k avg
Dynamite 6.7k avg

*Edit

[TheFerg714]

The lead up to Harbinger Wars 2 should have begun in Jan of 2018 which is when Dinesh was pushed out. If they started earlier they would have peaked too early

But they DID start marketing HW2 way earlier than January. I remember seeing teases for HW2 like 2 years ago.

and they had to market the launches of Bloodshot Salvation, Ninja-K and Quantum & Woody all at the end of 2017. Of anything we can say about Dinesh and VEI (and we can say great books, great creators, great fan relations etc etc etc) we can't argue that they marketing and promoted as well as anyone. Especially the events. Do we really think if Dinesh wasn't in charge from Jan to now that Harbinger Wars 2 wouldn't have been everywhere.

I'm not 100% sure what you're getting at here, but I would say that Dinesh and co. are at least partly to blame for HW2. Sure, it would have been nice (and ambitious) to see their original idea of a double-sided, $3.99 priced come to fruition, but there are still major issues when it comes to the lead-up to HW2. Mainly: Harbinger Renegade.

Also, 9.4k average is fine...if you aren't launching a tentpole crossover for the year (with 2 issues in the same month) in the middle of the summer.

Exactly. #1 should've reached 30k AT LEAST. It's so strange to see how popular Secret Weapons was, and yet "the masses" refuse to go out and buy the #0 issues or this prelude. What is up with that? I thought there was some serious "mainstream" hype for Secret Weapons, but apparently there just wasn't.

[nycjadie]

Indy Publishers Top 300 Avg Units Per Book

Oni Press 13.5k avg
Boom 9.8K avg
Archie 9.6k avg
Valiant 9.4k avg
IDW 8.5k avg
Dark Horse 8.3k avg
Aftershock 7.3k avg
Dynamite (sucks!) 6.7k avg

This is interesting. Thx!

[Ryan]

Indy Publishers Top 300 Avg Units Per Book

Oni Press 13.5k avg
Boom 9.8K avg
Archie 9.6k avg
Valiant 9.4k avg
IDW 8.5k avg
Dark Horse 8.3k avg
Aftershock 7.3k avg
Dynamite (sucks!) 6.7k avg

This is super interesting. Averages can be misleading though if you're only looking at the top 300, because a lot of these publishers have a bunch of books in the 300-500 range, which would bring their averages way down. Compared to Valiant, which only has one book out of the top 300 (Valiant High at 316).

Items in Top 300
Marvel 100
DC 76
Image 47
IDW 21
Dark Horse 13
Dynamite 10
Boom 7
Valiant 7
Titan 4
Aftershock 3
Albatross 2
Archie 2
Oni 2
Action Lab 1
Black Mask 1
Bongo 1
Broadsword 1
Tokyopop 1
United Plankton 1

Compared to overall comics shipped in May

New comics released
Marvel 92
DC 74
Image 65
IDW 39
Boom 23
Dynamite 20
Dark Horse 17
Valiant 8
Oni 3
Other 131
TOTAL 472

For example the 3rd Oni book is Ballad of Sang #3 which shipped 1,494 copies, that would bring the Oni avg. way down.

IDW, Dynamite, and Boom all have a significant % of books outside of the top 300, half or more.

Another interesting thing to look at is the unit shares.

Share of Overall Units
Marvel 38.35%
DC 37.87%
Image 9.67%
IDW 3.07%
Dark Horse 1.63%
Boom 1.58%
Dynamic Forces 1.30%
Valiant 0.90%
Titan 0.57%
Aftershock 0.53%
Archie 0.49%
Oni 0.48%
Viz 0.40%
Avatar 0.33%
Zenescope 0.28%
Action Lab 0.23%
St. Martins 0.13%
Hachette 0.13%
Random House 0.13%
Fantagraphics 0.09%
Other 1.84%

I haven't been following it closely, but hasn't Valiant consistently been around 1%?

[WrathOfArmstrong]

Indy Publishers Top 300 Avg Units Per Book

Oni Press 13.5k avg
Boom 9.8K avg
Archie 9.6k avg
Valiant 9.4k avg
IDW 8.5k avg
Dark Horse 8.3k avg
Aftershock 7.3k avg
Dynamite (sucks!) (sucks!) 6.7k avg

This is interesting. Thx!

I assumed Aftershock was doing better, they are putting out great books consistently. I buy everything now. A much more consistent version of IMAGE that sometimes scratches my VERTIGO itch.

I'm also shocked at the Dark Horse Mignolaverse titles, overall I really thought DH performed much better.

On a ranking standpoint, I think HW2#1 did really good. It was the closest indie #1 to top 100. And in a month where Brian K. Vaughn doesn't release a 5 issue mini-series that'll only be printed one time/one way, HW2 #1 would've been in the top 100 easy.

Would that count as success for Valiant?

As far as the Top 100 list goes, it's all standard fare, there were 25 other #1s from the big two in a month that had FCBD, Spidey 800, Bendis Supes and Venom #1. Image has their core Walking Dead/Saga/Spawn that always takes up spots, plus the new Kirkman title will probably stay pretty high going forward. Otherwise, the other stuff is up there because it is in every single comic shop and on most people's pulls already.


I agree the push on HW2 has been lackluster, but I also think it's 22k is the product of timing too. Last real week of May... the one going into memorial day weekend in the same month a lot of us spent a lot of money on FCBD sales. So I would assume there might be some reorders in June. And Prelude did bomb, I guess it got lost in FCBD as shoppers loaded up on everything else, or stores didn't order enough because they were too busy trying dealing with the impending FCBD. They should've found a better gap in the publishing cycle to dominate the news outlets.

But I think the main issue with HW2 goes back to the previous regime. Right in the title it says #2. To me that means I needed to pick up that Harbinger Wars Compendium (pretending I'm a new reader with $4 to spend on HW2#1). In fact, last year, I jumped on to Renegades (which I'd intended to trade wait on) because I assumed it would be required reading for HW2. So how many lost sales stem more from this not being an entry level story, but one that was built for those of us that have been reading everything? Does HW2 do better if it's called something else?

Should anyone have expected it to do better than XO #14? Because it's basically an alternative XO #14, seeing as how it's Aric on earth as written by Matt Kindt...

I think if VEI had handled Renegades and Secret Weapons better and really built right into this event (Looking at you too Bloodshot Salvation), it's still not going to move the needle much higher on a book already labeled as a sequel.


And back to BARRIER.... that's what Valiant needs to do instead of Legend of the Geomancer... a weekly gateway/non-required reading/but best foot forward only floppy (never in trade... but snuck into a hardcover a couple years later...) printing to get a larger audience involved at the LCS level. Seems like Vaughn's approach paid off really well. Stores bought a ton of copies in my area but for the most part, Barrier is only ever going to be something Vaughn Completists seek out. Imagine if that series had tied into PAPER GIRLS or SAGA or something new.

[WrathOfArmstrong]

Indy Publishers Top 300 Avg Units Per Book

Oni Press 13.5k avg
Boom 9.8K avg
Archie 9.6k avg
Valiant 9.4k avg
IDW 8.5k avg
Dark Horse 8.3k avg
Aftershock 7.3k avg
Dynamite (sucks!) (sucks!) 6.7k avg

This is super interesting. Averages can be misleading though if you're only looking at the top 300, because a lot of these publishers have a bunch of books in the 300-500 range, which would bring their averages way down. Compared to Valiant, which only has one book out of the top 300 (Valiant High at 316).

Items in Top 300
Marvel 100
DC 76
Image 47
IDW 21
Dark Horse 13
Dynamite (sucks!) 10
Boom 7
Valiant 7
Titan 4
Aftershock 3
Albatross 2
Archie 2
Oni 2
Action Lab 1
Black Mask 1
Bongo 1
Broadsword 1
Tokyopop 1
United Plankton 1

Compared to overall comics shipped in May

New comics released
Marvel 92
DC 74
Image 65
IDW 39
Boom 23
Dynamite (sucks!) 20
Dark Horse 17
Valiant 8
Oni 3
Other 131
TOTAL 472

For example the 3rd Oni book is Ballad of Sang #3 which shipped 1,494 copies, that would bring the Oni avg. way down.

IDW, Dynamite (sucks!), and Boom all have a significant % of books outside of the top 300, half or more.

Another interesting thing to look at is the unit shares.

Share of Overall Units
Marvel 38.35%
DC 37.87%
Image 9.67%
IDW 3.07%
Dark Horse 1.63%
Boom 1.58%
Dynamic Forces 1.30%
Valiant 0.90%
Titan 0.57%
Aftershock 0.53%
Archie 0.49%
Oni 0.48%
Viz 0.40%
Avatar 0.33%
Zenescope 0.28%
Action Lab 0.23%
St. Martins 0.13%
Hachette 0.13%
Random House 0.13%
Fantagraphics 0.09%
Other 1.84%

I haven't been following it closely, but hasn't Valiant consistently been around 1%?

+1

[battlepark]

We are all basically loyal to Valiant and it's characters, but in the end do we like the product they are putting out?
Screw doom and gloom, the end of Valiant Era 1 was painful, those books were awful. Virtually no dialog at all,
blown up artwork. You could tell they were just trying to squeeze out a few more dollars out of us. And Acclaim?
was it overall that good? No! You could find some good books, but overall it was bad.

We are 6 years in, and this new run of Valiant has been good overall. The only positive in the DMG purchase is that
we know Valiant is going to survive and movies will be made. As long as the product they are putting out is quality
then I am not concerned about numbers. I understand HWII was caught in the middle of the transition, but that is
one cross-over, not a main title.

[TheFerg714]

I agree with your overall assessment of quality > sales, but I take issue with a few of your points.

We are all basically loyal to Valiant and it's characters

I'm not. They've lost all goodwill from me after firing the people that made it great. I'm definitely interested in what comes next, and I will probably always, in some way, pay attention to what's going on at Valiant, but the second I sniff out suckage, I'm done. I usually give Valiant the benefit of the doubt, but as far as I'm concerned, this is a new company and they have to earn my loyalty back.

but in the end do we like the product they are putting out?

Yea... Right now I'm generally very happy with what's going on at Valiant, but post-HW2 is an entirely different ball game.

The only positive in the DMG purchase is that we know Valiant is going to survive

I'm sorry, but you don't know that. They could very easily kill the comic book side of Valiant if it stopped making money, and who knows what will happen to Valiant if the Bloodshot movie underperforms.

I understand HWII was caught in the middle of the transition, but that is one cross-over, not a main title.

It's not just a crossover, it's their major summer event that has been "building" for years.

[agent_graves]

Indy Publishers Top 300 Avg Units Per Book

Oni Press 13.5k avg
Boom 9.8K avg
Archie 9.6k avg
Valiant 9.4k avg
IDW 8.5k avg
Dark Horse 8.3k avg
Aftershock 7.3k avg
Dynamite (sucks!) (sucks!) 6.7k avg

This is interesting. Thx!

No prob...

We are all basically loyal to Valiant and it's characters, but in the end do we like the product they are putting out?
Screw doom and gloom, the end of Valiant Era 1 was painful, those books were awful. Virtually no dialog at all,
blown up artwork. You could tell they were just trying to squeeze out a few more dollars out of us. And Acclaim?
was it overall that good? No! You could find some good books, but overall it was bad.

We are 6 years in, and this new run of Valiant has been good overall. The only positive in the DMG purchase is that
we know Valiant is going to survive and movies will be made. As long as the product they are putting out is quality
then I am not concerned about numbers. I understand HWII was caught in the middle of the transition, but that is
one cross-over, not a main title.

This!!! F the numbers, they could’ve had the highest avg per book, but none of that really matters if you’re not liking what they’re putting out, if none of it interest you as a fan, all these numbers become meaningless. We all know quantity doesn’t equal quality...

[agent_graves]

Soooooooo, I just realized that I included Valiant High #1, (it didn’t make the top 300) when I originally did the math for VEI. It should’ve been....

7 titles=71,501 (10.2k avg) Per book...

My bad...

[grendeljd]

Soooooooo, I just realized that I included Valiant High #1, (it didn’t make the top 300) when I originally did the math for VEI. It should’ve been....

7 titles=71,501 (10.2k avg) Per book...

My bad...

All kinds of interesting analysis from you this month, man! Made this thread a good read - and despite all the concerns we are all generally discussing about the new VMG era, I'm glad to see something come across in a generally positive light.

Their sales are reasonably stable overall - would love to see them get stronger (and the strength be based on the quality of the creative teams & stories, of course), but they've held roughly the same ground over 6 years with some peaks & valleys. I hope that will continue to mean they aren't going to fold up shop any time soon. They're making some mistakes leading up to & since DMG took over, but not everything about it has been Doom & Gloom.